[Finance] The cryptocurrency (Bitcoin etc) thread

[Marshy]

its a fair point that the banks dont *need* to use an existing crypto to build out an interbank system. if i were a bank i'd look to roll/fork my own, remove fees and keep governance within the banking industry. banks arent known for cooperation though Swift shows they can do it. for they look more interested in the $ gains as an asset.

what are you tipping to topple bitcoin?

The banks don't trust each other to create there own in my opinion, it needs to be independent and de-centralized as it were for any adoption to take place, One they can trust that has been running for a long time without error.
It will have to be massively regulated and run on its own Private ledger for banks to adopt.

I have no bitcoin, but I do own some XRP ( created by Ripple ) which I believe has the best chance of winning in this scenario. It is also practically free/fee wise to use and as green as they get. Offering cross border payment in a few seconds.

Its just an educated guess though, if I lose everything its only what I am willing to lose.

I believe the banks and Central banks have already chosen the token/crypto currency they want to use, but until clarity and much stricter regulation has been brought to the market they cannot fully adopt it.

I am hoping I am on the winning horse.

Ripple are currently in court with the SEC in America.... I however believe that is just a show while America get there act together, they are so far behind the rest of the world on Crypto it staggers belief.

America wont want to get left behind.

The dollar being the reserve currency of the world will be no more...

 

[Marshy]

I have only really got interested in Crypto in the last 6 months, a good friend advised me about it.

But I researched the one I liked and eventually made a small investment.

I really don't know about any other assets in this class other than XLM which I also believe will come out well when things get shook down after regulation.

NEVER INVEST WHAT YOU CANNOT AFFORD TO LOSE IN CRYPTO is my advice, it could all be worth nothing tomorrow.I don't think so, but its entirely possible.

 

[Bold Seagull]

The banks don't trust each other to create there own in my opinion, it needs to be independent and de-centralized as it were for any adoption to take place, One they can trust that has been running for a long time without error.
It will have to be massively regulated and run on its own Private ledger for banks to adopt.

I have no bitcoin, but I do own some XRP ( created by Ripple ) which I believe has the best chance of winning in this scenario. It is also practically free/fee wise to use and as green as they get. Offering cross border payment in a few seconds.

Its just an educated guess though, if I lose everything its only what I am willing to lose.

I believe the banks and Central banks have already chosen the token/crypto currency they want to use, but until clarity and much stricter regulation has been brought to the market they cannot fully adopt it.

I am hoping I am on the winning horse.

Ripple are currently in court with the SEC in America.... I however believe that is just a show while America get there act together, they are so far behind the rest of the world on Crypto it staggers belief.

America wont want to get left behind.

The dollar being the reserve currency of the world will be no more...

I think banks and financial institutions being involved is an alarm bell rather than an endorsement. They are chasing the money, and like so many other things, they don't do their research or knowledge backup, they go off the hype and the graphs. Dotcom bubble happened because of this type of idiocy. You will have investors now having no idea of what this all is, but they're lumping in because everyone else so need a position.

So rather than the best crypto, technology, utilities whatever else goes into it rising the top, it will be whoever the hedge funds lump in on, and it will create a smokescreen of what is really happening even for informed investors.

It is very much the wild west, only you don't ride out of town with a bag of gold, just the promise the technology as longevity.

Completely agree with you other posts though, don't invest what you can't afford to lose, and there is no doubt fun to be had and money to be made if it floats your boat and the whole thing is of real interest.

 

[Barnet Seagull]

I have only really got interested in Crypto in the last 6 months, a good friend advised me about it.

But I researched the one I liked and eventually made a small investment.

I really don't know about any other assets in this class other than XLM which I also believe will come out well when things get shook down after regulation.

NEVER INVEST WHAT YOU CANNOT AFFORD TO LOSE IN CRYPTO is my advice, it could all be worth nothing tomorrow.I don't think so, but its entirely possible.

Totally agree. Volatility is high in the market, as is greed. I'm now trading on past profit only and it feels much more comfortable.

Not sure if anyone else uses it but I really like https://alternative.me/crypto/fear-and-greed-index/ as a bit of a barometer of the markets. Obviously each investment should be scrutinised individually but it can be a useful way to gauge how things are and where they may head.

 

[Fitzcarraldo]

Whilst I don't really understand it, I find it really interesting. Instinctively I agree with those that say it's like the Tulips, and that the value is driven by the greater fool theory, so eventually I think there will be a crash. On the other hand it also seems to be me that the market for it is so massive and accessible (basically everyone around the globe with a spare dollar, access to the internet and a desire to make money doing nothing) that the supply of fools is much bigger than for anything ever before (almost endless). So maybe there won't.

Are people with money invested concerned about some kind of government regulations coming in? What is the speculation that will look like?

 

[Marshy]

Whilst I don't really understand it, I find it really interesting. Instinctively I agree with those that say it's like the Tulips, and that the value is driven by the greater fool theory, so eventually I think there will be a crash. On the other hand it also seems to be me that the market for it is so massive and accessible (basically everyone around the globe with a spare dollar, access to the internet and a desire to make money doing nothing) that the supply of fools is much bigger than for anything ever before (almost endless). So maybe there won't.

Are people with money invested concerned about some kind of government regulations coming in? What is the speculation that will look like?

oh for sure there will be a big crash, or not so much a crash but a clear out of tokens that offer little or no utility in the real world.

regulation is coming, how that will look who knows. This market is still Tiny.

I am holding and in for the long term. Certainly the next 3 or 4 years to see how things play out.

there will be some insane movement in the markets this year. if you know what you are doing big profits can be made, and also lost if you don't.

I am not an expert hence just holding unless the prices go insane the I might cash in some.

 

[CheeseRolls]

There are some really good points made in this discussion, but the size and scale of this is such that people can be right and completely wrong at the same time. Rather than make it look like I am picking arguments with everyone here are a few points I would add.

Bitcoin - A bit like the Confederate Flag will still be around a long time after it serves a purpose. For some it is an anti government symbol, which is particularly powerful in the US but also in other parts of the world.
The Banks - Many of us live in an extraordinarily stable part of the world. Globally there are likely to be more people without bank accounts than with them. Yes I am sure they want and will gain more control, but at the same time, the picture is much bigger.

You can make money if you buy a coin at a low value and sell it at a much higher price. You can also get very wealthy if your fee is £0.000000001 per transaction and there are a million transactions per second. There are so many use cases for this latter scenario, that have not even ben dreamed up yet.

 

[beorhthelm]

I have no bitcoin, but I do own some XRP ( created by Ripple ) which I believe has the best chance of winning in this scenario. It is also practically free/fee wise to use and as green as they get. Offering cross border payment in a few seconds.

Ripple is a double headed project, selling a transaction service that doesn't use XRP and another service using XRP. their bank solution doesnt use the token. banks might use this tech, i'm pretty sure if they had settled on Ripple, they wouldnt be in court with SEC. Stellar (XLM) is a good candidate for tech, other projects have built on it and it seems to scale. similar issue for token holders, dont need the token if someone builds a system on it.

its an underlying issue for any blockchain, needs to be near free to be viable for transfers, which should render the token near valueless unless there is some other utility. BTC has become a store of value (no one is buying anything with it), ETH and some others have smart contracts going for them. dont think there'll be a single dominant token in the end.

 

[Marshy]

Ripple is a double headed project, selling a transaction service that doesn't use XRP and another service using XRP. their bank solution doesnt use the token. banks might use this tech, i'm pretty sure if they had settled on Ripple, they wouldnt be in court with SEC. Stellar (XLM) is a good candidate for tech, other projects have built on it and it seems to scale. similar issue for token holders, dont need the token if someone builds a system on it.

its an underlying issue for any blockchain, needs to be near free to be viable for transfers, which should render the token near valueless unless there is some other utility. BTC has become a store of value (no one is buying anything with it), ETH and some others have smart contracts going for them. dont think there'll be a single dominant token in the end.

the central banks and banks solution will use XRP as a currency/token that will be the bridge asset. the Banks will have there own private ledger on the XRP ledger.

If it happens of course, Ripple provide the tech but the token is required to bridge the movement of money.

 

[Solid at the back]

Got about £3k to invest, interested in buying some and just sitting on it for a few years, any advice?

 

[Marshy]

Got about £3k to invest, interested in buying some and just sitting on it for a few years, any advice?

my advice is do your research

I don't give financial advice on how people should spend there money ! that would be a terrible idea on my part lol

 

[beorhthelm]

the central banks and banks solution will use XRP as a currency/token that will be the bridge asset. the Banks will have there own private ledger on the XRP ledger.

If it happens of course, Ripple provide the tech but the token is required to bridge the movement of money.

if you have a secure shared ledger, you dont need a bridge asset. that is to say you can use one, its just redundant to the process.

 

[Marshy]

if you have a secure shared ledger, you dont need a bridge asset. that is to say you can use one, its just redundant to the process.

yes you do ;-)

 

[Barnet Seagull]

No advice except

be prepared to lose
diversify

 

[FatSuperman]

So in layman's terms has anyone made real money that i can spend on amazon if so what is the return rate on the investment? It sort of comes across like a computer game rather than real life.

An acquaintance of mine has yes. An incredible, incredible sum. He and his partner (in lawyer terms) set up I believe the first blockchain / crypto legal firm in the country, possibly Europe. He has an eye watering amount of bitcoin, in a very short space of time - having been paid a large part in the currency.

He has gone from nothing to worrying about weeds on his floodlit, 5-a-side astro pitch, in about 10 years. Good guy as well, so great for him.

A couple of friends and I spent a year with our gaming PCs mining whilst we were at work, I cannot remember how many coins we got, but suffice to say they are on drives that we have lost by now. I don't even like to think about it to be honest!

 

[Notters]

Totally agree. I have no doubt about the above bit in bold whatsoever. But the central banks will form a huddle and, er, form their own cryptocurrency that will inherit the global market. Bitcoin is just the next Pets.com and is just as doomed to crash and burn. I'd cash out now if I were you. Or at least attempt to

https://cointelegraph.com/news/governments-are-looking-to-buy-bitcoin-nydig-ceo-confirms

 

[dazzer6666]

Got about £3k to invest, interested in buying some and just sitting on it for a few years, any advice?

Don’t do it unless you’re perfectly prepared to lose £3k
Read as much as you can
Diversify within crypto, very difficult to back a single horse now

I only dabble on the edge of the market with a tiny % of my savings, it’s just a bit of fun........

 

[Albion Dan]

https://cointelegraph.com/news/governments-are-looking-to-buy-bitcoin-nydig-ceo-confirms

I'd really not bother arguing with naysayers and cryptocurrency critics. They were probably the same people saying the Internet wouldn't change the world in the late 90s and that smart phones wouldn't become the most important personal tool in our lives.

Mainstream adoption is still about 5 years away but its inevitable. If you seroously educate yourself and as has been said make sure you don't invest more than you are prepared to lose life changing money is there to be made.

 

[Albion Dan]

Don’t do it unless you’re perfectly prepared to lose £3k
Read as much as you can
Diversify within crypto, very difficult to back a single horse now

I only dabble on the edge of the market with a tiny % of my savings, it’s just a bit of fun........

If you are going to back single horse and want less (but still significant) volatility I'd back bitcoin but be prepared to see its value go much higher then drop up to 80% when the next bear crash comes, which could be anywhere between the next 3-12 months. Then the cycle will start again....

Alt coins wil have much higher gains and much higher drops but definitely get educated before diving in.

 

[Notters]

Be interested to hear your thoughts on Maidsafe @<u><a href="https://www.northstandchat.com/member.php?u=316" target="_blank">Albion Dan</a></u> - it's been coming for a long time... but if it every actually arrives it will likely change everything and potentially wipe out everything else.