Standing

[Telboy]

Can anyone explain to me why we are made to sit during games but as soon as the half time whistle goes nearly everyone stands up and there is not a steward in sight to make us sit down. I take it they are busy having there half time cuppa. What is the difference between standing during the match and standing 15-20mins at half time surely the safety aspect still applies.

 

[lighthouse]

so that the people behind you can see the game when it is on possibly?

 

[Telboy]

but if everyone wants to stand where you are what is the problem

 

[maffew]

Can anyone explain to me why we are made to sit during games but as soon as the half time whistle goes nearly everyone stands up and there is not a steward in sight to make us sit down. I take it they are busy having there half time cuppa. What is the difference between standing during the match and standing 15-20mins at half time surely the safety aspect still applies.

 

[User removed 4]

but if everyone wants to stand where you are what is the problem

Er, not everyone wants to stand ?

 

[maffew]

but if everyone wants to stand where you are what is the problem

are you for real? Lets allow standing but make sure the ticket office book the seats in height order starting at the back. Like a school photo.

 

[beorhthelm]

thats a actually a good question, unless you are move to/from your seat, surely you must be seated at all times. likewise, if standing and moving back and forth, maybe you cant be done for standing up.

so the solution to the standing question is to keep moving. have a coupld of rows and shuffle left... then up a row, shuffle right, down a row...


might work. or be a laugh trying.

 

[The Large One]

Isn't he Dick Knight's nephew?

 

[Brovion]

It's actually a valid point. Everybody knows that all-seater stadia where brought in on the recommendation of the Taylor Report on Hillsborough, but I've done a bit of research and as far as I can see there's no actual LAW that says you have to be seated whilst watching a football match. What we have is a situation where the various competition organisers (The FA, Premier League, FIFA, UEFA) have a stipulation that in order to compete in certain specific competitons (such as the Premier League) you must have an all-seater stadium. This stipulation can either be voluntary or it may be made compulsory by order of the Secretary of State. (Section 11 of the Football Spectators' Act 1989) Football stadiums must be licenced by the Football Licencing Authority, (which was also set up by the Act of 1989). The FLA will work in conjunction with the Police and the local authority when deciding whether to issue a licence or not.

Now here's the fun part. One of the conditions of a Licence for an all-seater stadium is that spectators must be seated 'at all times whilst the game is in progress' - and the game is deemed to be still 'in progress' when a goal is scored. So all those of you who stand up and cheer the goals are techncally breaking the law! Also obviously you're not allowed to stand up during an attacking phase of play if you think your going to score. I think most stewards would allow you to stand and applaud a goal, and then of course you're into a grey area as to what they should turn a blind eye to and what they should clamp down on in order that the ground doesn't lose it's licence.

As I say , that's just what I've found out with a little bit of research. I await correction on any points from the legal-eagles on here.

(As an aside it's also an offence under the Criminal Justice Act to re-sell a spare ticket, so anybody doing that on NSC risks getting the board shut down again!)

 

[Acker79]

I imagine it might have something to do with the risk levels.

As mentioned above the sitting rules were introduced in response to the taylor report. When a game is on there is something to work the fans up, a promising attack, a percieved injustice, a goal, etc. this leads to an increased risk* of people pushing forward to get near the pitch, to celebrate with the players, to hurl abuse at the ref or opposition etc.

At half time, the stadium half empties with people going to the loo, getting snacks, stretching their legs on the running track. There is nothing to excite or incite the diminished crowd to want to rush forward, reducing the risk incident.



*Before anyone comes at me with the whole "there isn't any risk!" / "how many accidents have there been at xxxx?" argument, let me point out that I'm talking relativity here. The risk of incident during a regular match may be one in a million, but it is still dramatically lowered when the game isn't being played, that is, at half time.

 

[Brovion]

I imagine it might have something to do with the risk levels.

As mentioned above the sitting rules were introduced in response to the taylor report. When a game is on there is something to work the fans up, a promising attack, a percieved injustice, a goal, etc. this leads to an increased risk* of people pushing forward to get near the pitch, to celebrate with the players, to hurl abuse at the ref or opposition etc.

At half time, the stadium half empties with people going to the loo, getting snacks, stretching their legs on the running track. There is nothing to excite or incite the diminished crowd to want to rush forward, reducing the risk incident.

...

I agree. As you've pointed out the 'riskiest' time when an injury is most likely is at a time of heightened emotion (such as when a goal is scored). How many times have you banged your shins etc on the seat in front when celebrating a goal?

Logically (and to strictly comply with the terms of the Licence) in the interests of everyone's safety, the stewards should eject anyone who jumps up at times of emotion. You should sit safely in your seat at all times, except at half time and obviously at full time when you should leave QUIETLY. You can go to the toilet if you must but really you should have gone before you sat down. Yes it sounds a bit Draconain but there you go; rules are rules, if it saves one life, football's changed now, what part of "it's the law" don't you understand, think of the children, etc etc etc.

 

[k2bluesky]

It's actually a valid point. Everybody knows that all-seater stadia where brought in on the recommendation of the Taylor Report on Hillsborough, but I've done a bit of research and as far as I can see there's no actual LAW that says you have to be seated whilst watching a football match. What we have is a situation where the various competition organisers (The FA, Premier League, FIFA, UEFA) have a stipulation that in order to compete in certain specific competitons (such as the Premier League) you must have an all-seater stadium. This stipulation can either be voluntary or it may be made compulsory by order of the Secretary of State. (Section 11 of the Football Spectators' Act 1989) Football stadiums must be licenced by the Football Licencing Authority, (which was also set up by the Act of 1989). The FLA will work in conjunction with the Police and the local authority when deciding whether to issue a licence or not.

Now here's the fun part. One of the conditions of a Licence for an all-seater stadium is that spectators must be seated 'at all times whilst the game is in progress' - and the game is deemed to be still 'in progress' when a goal is scored. So all those of you who stand up and cheer the goals are techncally breaking the law! Also obviously you're not allowed to stand up during an attacking phase of play if you think your going to score. I think most stewards would allow you to stand and applaud a goal, and then of course you're into a grey area as to what they should turn a blind eye to and what they should clamp down on in order that the ground doesn't lose it's licence.

As I say , that's just what I've found out with a little bit of research. I await correction on any points from the legal-eagles on here.

(As an aside it's also an offence under the Criminal Justice Act to re-sell a spare ticket, so anybody doing that on NSC risks getting the board shut down again!)

Interesting points, as it seems to vary greatly, watch any premier league game at Man Utd/Liverpool/Chelsea/West Ham etc and they are standing behind the goal and not always just for corners/attacking moves, also grounds in Europe, Bayern Munich etc have standing sections now so FIFA, UEFA allow it in cases where there is terracing but also do nothing to stop it at the big Premier league clubs in Europe or throw them out of Europe for it. Its total bullshit, all about control, having a number/name, rather like gobal warming, safety is the excuse to impose extra restrictions/laws - compare the number of football deaths per attendance numbers with driving/flying/train travel/smoking, in fact almost anything.
I don't need some fat arse in a suit who has probably never stood on a terrace in his life telling me what is too dangerous for me, and I'm sure hundreds of thousands of other UK football fans feel the same too. Solo climbing on K2 maybe!

 

[Tim Over Whelmed]

I guess it's fairly simple? If you designate standing areas you can stand, if you designate and sell tickets in seating areas you should sit.

My six year old struggles to see when people are seated so we would PREFER people to sit.

You can never keep everyone happy and a fact of life, for our club, is we need all sorts of people to keep us afloat and create the supporters of tomorrow etc!

Surely FIFA, UEFA etc come come up with a "safe" way of allowing people to stand ... afterall. It always amazes me that we don't allow people to stand at football yet we cram people into trains and tubes, platforms etc without, seemingly, a care in the world. With modern technology for ticketing control and safer stadia anyway surely we can cater for all?

 

[Brovion]

Interesting points, as it seems to vary greatly, watch any premier league game at Man Utd/Liverpool/Chelsea/West Ham etc and they are standing behind the goal and not always just for corners/attacking moves, also grounds in Europe, Bayern Munich etc have standing sections now so FIFA, UEFA allow it in cases where there is terracing but also do nothing to stop it at the big Premier league clubs in Europe or throw them out of Europe for it. ...

It's very much a numbers thing. At Withdean there's only a few dozen home fans trying to stand up and the regulations can easily be enforced. However I've seen loads of Newcastle Utd games over the years (when they were in the Prem!) and at every game (when I've been in with the away fans) I've been able to stand. The reason being is that if you've got four or five thousand Geordies all wanting to stand up then no stewarding team can make them sit down. The result is that the regulations on all-seater stadia are flouted week in week out and nobody bats an eyelid. Anybody who says "if you stand up the ground can lose its licence" is just spouting so much hot air. Technically they're correct of course, but in reality it's just an empty threat.

So what what we've ended up with is the worst of both worlds with people standing in areas where they should be seated. This both pisses off the people who DO want to sit down, and is actually more dangerous than having 'proper' standing areas. However the situation will continue until the authorities either decide to enforce the regulations without exception (and punish the clubs that break them), or allow proper standing areas to be created.

 

[Box of Frogs]

It's very much a numbers thing. At Withdean there's only a few dozen home fans trying to stand up and the regulations can easily be enforced. However I've seen loads of Newcastle Utd games over the years (when they were in the Prem!) and at every game (when I've been in with the away fans) I've been able to stand. The reason being is that if you've got four or five thousand Geordies all wanting to stand up then no stewarding team can make them sit down. The result is that the regulations on all-seater stadia are flouted week in week out and nobody bats an eyelid. Anybody who says "if you stand up the ground can lose its licence" is just spouting so much hot air. Technically they're correct of course, but in reality it's just an empty threat.

So what what we've ended up with is the worst of both worlds with people standing in areas where they should be seated. This both pisses off the people who DO want to sit down, and is actually more dangerous than having 'proper' standing areas. However the situation will continue until the authorities either decide to enforce the regulations without exception (and punish the clubs that break them), or allow proper standing areas to be created.

You've hit the nail on the head there - its a numbers thing. If it is considered feasable to get the people standing to sit down then every effort has to be made to do so. If however, there are simply too many standing up then it would not be feasable to get them all seated.

At Withdean it would probably not be possible to get the whole of the South Stand to sit if they all insisted on standing but it is to get individual blocks or parts of block to sit. The away end is usually possible to get seated due to numbers, unless it is packed and they all insist on standing.