Papa Lazarou
Living in a De Zerbi wonderland
The stress levels of trying to get home some days, with jam packed trains, and non-functional air conditioning will undoubtedly lead to a heart attack soon.
Southern Rail STRIKE details
- Thread starter Ernest
- Start date
Got something to say or just want fewer pesky ads? Join us... 😊
The stress levels of trying to get home some days, with jam packed trains, and non-functional air conditioning will undoubtedly lead to a heart attack soon.
Deadly Danson
Well-known member
It's absolute nonsense and a sign that GTR and the government are becoming increasingly desperate. On occasions, cameras have been declared unfit by the driver - I have numerous pictorial examples which I can't share here. When they are checked at the depot they are obviously checked in an indoor lit dry environment rather than outside with rain, fog, debris, darkness, sunlight, canopies etc so they are declared fine. In the past none of this would have been a major issue but now, as we are self dispatching, we are told to rely on cameras and cameras only for the safe dispatch of a train and if these are in any way faulty then we are duty bound to declare it. Apart from anything else, if the worst happened and we hadn't reported a poor quality camera image you know full well who would be blamed.
What was their source ?
Garry Nelson's teacher
Well-known member
Well this might be a surprise but it was a Tory MP............Jeremy (it would have to be a Jeremy) Quin when travelling as a passenger. This was backed up by the rail minister in a written answer to a parliamentary question that there had been "a noticeable increase in camera defects reported. However, when investigated, no faults had been found."
*falls off chair in surprise*...........
Garry Nelson's teacher
Well-known member
To be read in conjunction with Deadly Danson's earlier response............
There are some low blows being landed in this dispute, but I guess you take your pick as to who is landing them.
If the unions backed off and just left Southern to it then nothing would happen other than Southern would just run down their contract. I just can't see how anything would change if Southern were just left to it. I was talking to someone last night and they said when you're up against the government and one of their big-business friends only a "catastrophe or disaster" will force change. History tends to support this idea. And the only way I see this can be brought about in a controlled manner is by a complete boycott of the system. The commuters are not going to do this .....so it's down to the unions I'm afraid. I'm of the view if the unions force a complete and total indefinite shut down something will budge. Unions backing off and allowing Southern to carry on unchallenged whilst commuters continue to shovel thousands of pounds into their pockets and write letters to the papers will not solve anything.
Sorrel
Well-known member
I've been on two trains that were cancelled (while I was on them) due to "faulty camera equipment". This never happened before the current dispute. From the comments of the MPs it suggests that the number of equipment failures of this type being reported is higher than previously.
The cause is probably more sensitivity on the part of those using the equipment and probably also some among the drivers wanting to make a point (this is clear sometimes from the on-board announcements). I would be very surprised if the drivers were lying, though - there is a broad range between working perfectly and not working at all and the drivers are probably erring more on the side of caution than they previously did, causing the higher figures - and yes, maybe also trying to make a political point.
The cause is probably more sensitivity on the part of those using the equipment and probably also some among the drivers wanting to make a point (this is clear sometimes from the on-board announcements). I would be very surprised if the drivers were lying, though - there is a broad range between working perfectly and not working at all and the drivers are probably erring more on the side of caution than they previously did, causing the higher figures - and yes, maybe also trying to make a political point.
Deadly Danson
Well-known member
Absolutely right. I hate that it has come to this but there isn't any choice - simply letting GTR get on with it would make no difference. And it's only when you're on the inside knowing the facts of what you deal with day in and day out that you realise the full force of the government, media and big business spin machine. Notice all the Tory papers, ministers etc all whirring into action now with new articles every day trying to slight us. If it wasn't so annoying, it's actually fascinating to see it in action and friends who read this rubbish quoting it back to me as fact.
Possibly right - seems like a complete impasse at the moment with no prospect of resolution, with anyone reliant on the railways absolutely shafted in the interim and lives being made a misery. A commuter boycott won't happen - too many people are captive and simply can't or won't take the risk. I suppose it could get to the stage of meaningful public protest but not sure what form this would take. Wonder to what extent the Tories realise how many votes this will cost them in the region next time around. Do you think the Unions will go down the route of a total and indefinite shutdown ? Impact on their members would be too big.
Deadly Danson
Well-known member
Again, previously if the cameras weren't working it wasn't a big deal, the guard closes the doors and the cameras are useful to us to keep an eye on what's going on. Now they have to be 100% for us to dispatch a train - by the company's own instruction - so naturally more faults will be reported.
........as an aside, really appreciate your insightful and informative posts on here. Conscious you're possibly taking a bit of a risk in doing so, so thanks (from a frustrated commuter)
I agree it's sad it's come to this but I just can't see any other realistic option now. We now have to put our faith in the Southern staff and the unions to bring about the required change. Good luck.
I second this. It's been very interesting, not to mention eye-opening, at times.
Arthur
Well-known member
Been saying this for several hundred pages of this thread. The strikes as they are currently are pointless and won't change anything. Either walk out completely or get back to work.
Deadly Danson
Well-known member
Thanks. I genuinely hope that we can somehow start to provide you with a better service next year because getting you from a to b safely and on time is all we want (even though it may not look that way sometimes).
Interesting point about votes. Hove and Brighton are non-blue. I feel there will be tactics employed to bring about a change in Kemp Town next time. There's seemingly little to lose on the coast which might explain the governments indifference?
elninobonito
Whitehawk Born and Bred
- May 27, 2011
- 652
I haven't read a newspaper since being at the Euros in the summer, after reading some of the nonsense that was written about England fans at the time. However, it is so hard to know who to blame from a commuter point of view!
Having a view from the inside is always great to really get an understanding from another perspective. Unfortunately I can no longer work from home and my employers are becoming increasingly frustrated at my timekeeping.
What are your views on the current safety of passengers due to the conditions on the limited service on trains now? I understand passenger safety is paramount to all staff but surely more lives are being put at risk during strikes/overtime bans than at any other time due to the serious overcrowding?
I watched the urgent question in parliament yesterday that was presented on 5th December and it left me thinking that this is going to just keep going on for a while!
Sorrel
Well-known member
As for a solution to the disputer - my thoughts are that the only way to compromise would be to focus on the safety aspect and not introduce the changes until some of these issues have been addressed.
This could have the advantage of getting the unions to sign up for the changes while also not imposing the changes to happen immediately until further equipment can be provided/bought. That way the dispute moves on from being about the people and roles and moves on to more safety-based items.
A compromise will need to involve both sides backing down. GTR will have to not introduce their changes immediately whilst the unions will have to accept that some of the roles can be changed, which should be possible as they have been consistently saying it is about safety. The use of better equipment and safety measures, on train and on platform, should be a way that this can be achieved: i.e. GTR will introduce the changes, but only when the safety measures have been addressed (as they have been on the Thameslink trains and associated stations). This could take a long time before it is in place, but would need acceptance in principle from the unions.
This could have the advantage of getting the unions to sign up for the changes while also not imposing the changes to happen immediately until further equipment can be provided/bought. That way the dispute moves on from being about the people and roles and moves on to more safety-based items.
A compromise will need to involve both sides backing down. GTR will have to not introduce their changes immediately whilst the unions will have to accept that some of the roles can be changed, which should be possible as they have been consistently saying it is about safety. The use of better equipment and safety measures, on train and on platform, should be a way that this can be achieved: i.e. GTR will introduce the changes, but only when the safety measures have been addressed (as they have been on the Thameslink trains and associated stations). This could take a long time before it is in place, but would need acceptance in principle from the unions.
pearl
Well-known member
I couldn't agree more here. I overheard a conversation between train staff recently ... what it's like to work for this company. I posted before that I felt Aslef had fvcked over the RMT, I've been made aware that I was wrong and I support this dispute even more. GOOD LUCK