[News] Shemima Begum- Should she be allowed to return to the UK?

[Zeberdi]

If she is indeed susceptible to suggestion, even in her older years, then off these shores might well be the best place for her.

She was already radicalised when she was arrested as a terrorist and is now in a prison camp - there would be no way she would just be allowed back without going through an intense deradicalisation programme whilst awaiting trial and is likely anyway to being incarcerated for a long time upon her return.

EDIT - however she got there and under whatever circumstances- there’s no doubt she lived the life of an ISIS bride/wife/mother - not so easy to deradicalise from that level of indoctrination and activity

The role of women in ISIS: From Wives and Mothers to Soldiers - Strife

Christina Chatzitheodorou writes about the role of women in the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant (ISIS)

www.strifeblog.org

My concern would be that the longer she is kept in inhumane conditions and in an appalling state of limbo, not only will that risk making her more likely to revert back to her radicalised views (if indeed she has even renounced them as she claims which I doubt) but could trigger further radicalisation of IS sympathisers already on British soil as she could become some kind of ‘martyr’ to the cause.

 

[jcdenton08]

She was already radicalised when she was arrested as a terrorist and is now in a prison camp - there would be no way she would just be allowed back without going through an intense deradicalisation programme whilst awaiting trial and is likely anyway to being incarcerated for a long time upon her return.

My concern would be that the longer she is kept in inhumane conditions and in an appalling state of limbo, not only will that risk making her more likely to revert back to her radicalised views (if indeed she has even renounced them as she claims) but could trigger further radicalisation of IS sympathisers already on British soil as she could become some kind of ‘martyr’ to the cause.

Anybody who has seen the documentary would take anything she says with a grain of salt; she is very manipulative and minimises her guilt at every opportunity.

 

[1066familyman]

Yes, I am guilty for being ‘anti-Assad’ mea culpa

The writer is not presenting a ‘narrow view’ but a sophisticated analysis of a very complex situation - ‘ Dr. Matthew Levitt is also the Fromer-Wexler senior fellow at The Washington Institute for Near East Policy. Previously, Levitt served in counterterrorism and intelligence positions with the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) and the U.S. Treasury Department. The author of several books and many monographs, journal articles and essays, Levitt teaches at Georgetown University’s School of Foreign Service.’

Far more qualified to give an opinion than I or some ill informed blogger on a social media platform with a right-wing agenda can provide.

Well, yes, Assad isn't exactly on my Christmas card list either.

Doesn't change the fact that it's a piece written with a clear agenda.
I've highlighted some clues for you.

It's hardly rocket science.

 

[1066familyman]

I'm not really sure what pointscoring remark you are trying to make here tbh. But here's mine.

Up yours.

I asked you a simple question. It was you that replied with the point scoring attempt at wit.

Your latest response just confirms my initial impression.

Thanks.

 

[Zeberdi]

Well, yes, Assad isn't exactly on my Christmas card list either.

Doesn't change the fact that it's a piece written with a clear agenda.
I've highlighted some clues for you.

It's hardly rocket science.

You dismissed a well researched analysis by a University Professor as an ‘anti-Assad rant’ - sounded very arrogant and your tone continues to be rude and patronising as highlighted in bold . You’ve hardly provided a well researched and qualified opinion as a rebuttal.

You are coming across as the one with an agenda on this thread.

All done here. I won’t respond to any further.

Back to thread topic.

 

[1066familyman]

You dismissed a well researched analysis by a University Professor as an ‘anti-Assad rant’ - sounded very arrogant and your tone continues to be patronising. You’ve hardly provided a well researched and qualified opinion as a rebuttal.

All done here.

Back to thread topic.

As you were then. I'll leave you to it.

I've now had my suspicions confirmed, so I'm done too.

 

[Easy 10]

I asked you a simple question. It was you that replied with the point scoring attempt at wit.

Your latest response just confirms my initial impression.

Thanks.

You are more than welcome.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

She was already radicalised when she was arrested as a terrorist and is now in a prison camp - there would be no way she would just be allowed back without going through an intense deradicalisation programme whilst awaiting trial and is likely anyway to being incarcerated for a long time upon her return.

EDIT - however she got there and under whatever circumstances- there’s no doubt she lived the life of an ISIS bride/wife/mother - not so easy to deradicalise from that level of indoctrination and activity

The role of women in ISIS: From Wives and Mothers to Soldiers - Strife

Christina Chatzitheodorou writes about the role of women in the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant (ISIS)

www.strifeblog.org

My concern would be that the longer she is kept in inhumane conditions and in an appalling state of limbo, not only will that risk making her more likely to revert back to her radicalised views (if indeed she has even renounced them as she claims which I doubt) but could trigger further radicalisation of IS sympathisers already on British soil as she could become some kind of ‘martyr’ to the cause.

She's not going to inspire wannabe teenage terrorists by swanning about with her hair uncovered, and wearing skinny jeans, I would have thought.

She's a deeply uninspiring person, to be frank.

 

[Westdene Seagull]

She was 15. She was a child.

Children become legally liable for criminal actions at 10 years old in the UK. Her being a child has no bearing.

 

[Deleted member 37369]

Anybody who has seen the documentary would take anything she says with a grain of salt; she is very manipulative and minimises her guilt at every opportunity.

Not just the documentary ... but really do encourage anyone that's really interested to listen to the podcast which goes into much more detail than the documentary.

BBC Radio 5 Live - I'm Not a Monster - Available now

Available episodes of I'm Not a Monster

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[Paulie Gualtieri]

By charging the government (i.e., the taxpayer) over the odds for the provision they provide.

Apparently they have BBC1 in HD inside now.

 

[Flagship]

She's not worth talking about. It's a shame she hasn't suffered the same fate as her two mates and her three ISIS spawn.

 

[Weststander]

I don't think so to be honest. It's racist dog-whistle politics from a failing government.

Another little rip in the UK's tattered reputation.

Backed by Labour.

 

[Chicken Run]

Backed by Labour.

View attachment 157583

Maybe, unlike everyone on this thread Starmer has now been privy to the security services intel on this piece of filth and happy to take a grown up view that is best for this country?

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

She was wearing exactly this style of western attire before becoming inspired/groomed herself wasn’t she? (Although she had her head covered admittedly) because she no longer wears a jilbab and hijab and veil, surely doesn’t make her any less of a risk if she is still radicalised does it? It is not what you wear that makes you a terrorist, it’s what you believe.

Interesting take on that here

Shamima Begum: what the media’s fixation on her ‘western’ clothing means for Muslim women

Comparisons between Begum’s Islamic garb and her new wardrobe suggest that Muslim women’s “liberation” depends on westernisation.

theconversation.com

Agree that she now speaks in a very uninspiring way (maybe always did) but I wonder how much that has to do with a conscious effort to remodel herself from a willing participant in jihadi activities to an ‘innocent child victim’ of trafficking and grooming for the sake of convincing us she should be repatriated?

Let there be no doubt though that women returners are treated as presenting the same risk as men returners and much of the recruiting of women is done online where the recruiters may not even be on video/streamed.

Shamima Begum: how Europe toughened its stance on women returning from Islamic State

Women used to be largely ignored by counter-radicalisation strategies. Why that changed.

theconversation.com

Yes maybe. But she comes across simply as someone who isn't very bright. Someone to be used rather than someone to lead.

But as I said my main point is that, unlike Jihadi men who wear jeans, she is in serious violation of Jihadi code by dressing as she does, now, and the prospect of her inspiring or leading anything is nil. That's before any excitable 15 year old depressed Muslim female in the UK asks whether Begum has obtained the ultimate rewards in a Jihadi female universe: a husband and children.

 

[Seagull on the Hill]

 

[A1X]

Maybe, unlike everyone on this thread Starmer has now been privy to the security services intel on this piece of filth and happy to take a grown up view that is best for this country?

Come on, everyone knows by now that public figures, especially those in politics, changing their minds on things is tantamount to heresy. Once you have stated an opinion on something then that's it, no amount of evidence or changing of circumstances is ever allowed to sway your opinion, that is set in stone forever.

 

[Is it PotG?]

This lady finds out if she's allowed back later this morning, after her appeal.

 

[Cheeky Monkey]

Let her in.

 

[Psychobilly freakout]

Let her in.

Would you let her move in with you ?