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[News] School strikes



beorhthelm

A. Virgo, Football Genius
Jul 21, 2003
35,265
That’s a fair point. Ironically I know people who can’t afford the days wage docked despite being pro strike for greater good. It’s all a bit of a gamble really isn’t it.
the advantage of today's industrial action is a few go on strike, enough for disruption to make thier point, while the majority show up for work. at mrs beorhthelm's school most the teachers were in, and a picket line disbanded shortly after 9.
 


HalfaSeatOn

Well-known member
Mar 17, 2014
1,885
North West Sussex
Rather than widespread action prefer my Union to take targeted action where impact is high and those taking action get wages covered from the strike fund. No problem supporting an increase in subs to support strike fund.
 


beorhthelm

A. Virgo, Football Genius
Jul 21, 2003
35,265
£6bn was lost in the economy on a single day of Liz Truss. During COVID, this government spent £37bn on Track and Trace. And a FURTHER £37bn on PPE.

But obviously the reason this country is in its current state is because of teachers, nurses, train drivers, etc wanting a pay increase to match their living costs.
i dont know why people keep wanting to drag this up - did you want no track and trace, no PPE?

it fails to understand the basics of government spending. spend £37bn on a one time event, its spent and done. it's not the same as ongoing increases, say £37bn across various pay awards, which will be £37bn every year forever. that means an additional £37bn raised in taxes or debt every year.
 


Greenbag50

Well-known member
Jun 1, 2016
386
What is your point ? What do you expect people to do that are on strike? You are a very strange person.
No point, just sharing my opinion that teachers and kids should have been in school and not in Pizza Express on a Tuesday lunchtime in term time.
Why does that make me strange?
 


The Clamp

Well-known member
NSC Patreon
Jan 11, 2016
24,277
West is BEST
No point, just sharing my opinion that teachers and kids should have been in school and not in Pizza Express on a Tuesday lunchtime in term time.
Why does that make me strange?
They were on strike. Most one-day picket lines disband at midday.
Would you prefer they went to church and sat in mournful reflection?

Worse things have happened at Pizza Express.
 




Greenbag50

Well-known member
Jun 1, 2016
386
They were on strike. Most one-day picket lines disband at midday.
Would you prefer they went to church and sat in mournful reflection?

Worse things have happened at Pizza Express.
They should have been in school
 


vegster

Sanity Clause
May 5, 2008
27,867
Sorry to hear that. Bullying and slyness by bosses in any sector is disgusting. I hope Mrs.V pursued a case. The events you describe are an archetypal constructive dismissal.
She ended up being signed off work due to stress and anxiety/depression, on full pay for nine months as I recall, then on half pay for a few months more then she was " made an offer " of 3 months salary if she quit..... on another subject but equally pertinent to modern employment... You remember I used to talk to you of my High Street retailer, a very well known " Brand " ? One of the staff who works with me had an extremely stressful day and effectively had a breakdown and went home mid afternoon in tears. ...lots of debate and meetings between management and directors as to what to do...the staff member was told they would dock her a whole day's pay or give her a disciplinary warning....she accepted the loss of pay as she said that " I probably won't get a pay rise in the upcoming performance reviews if I have a disciplinary warning on file "....I told her that probably none of us were getting a pay award this year anyway... however.. trading a threatened disciplinary warning against an arbitrary loss of a whole day's pay seems utterly corrupt in my book. Sadly, none of us are in a Union...I have worked in a company as a Union member and have worked for another company that were decent as a non Union member..neither would have tried to do this to a staff member.. truly awful ! ...This is where we are now.
 


Machiavelli

Well-known member
Oct 11, 2013
16,547
Fiveways
Now I'm really not sure what you are talking about, and as it has been a long time since I've studied economics I'm definitely not up on the current lingo.

But to put it simply:
* If I have a pay rise and prices stay the same, I have had a pay rise and more spending power. I have not had a pay cut.
* If I have a pay rise and prices rise at the same rate, I have had a pay rise and my spending power has not altered.
* If I have a pay rise and prices rise at a higher rate, I have had a pay rise and my spending power is less. I have not had a pay cut.
* If I have a pay cut, my pay has been cut.

I could list other scenarios but it'd get tedious. There is no philosophy to anything I have said it is just what happens.

As for what I think teachers should be paid, certainly above national average wage, which I note they already are, but probably a bit more than the current level given the complexity of the job they do.
You are rejecting the longstanding distinction in economics between real and nominal values. You can easily search what's meant by it online. Here's the clearest and most succinct for you:

Two ways of expressing monetary values: nominal values are measured in current prices while real values are measured in constant prices (i.e. in prices of a given or base period). Real values are obtained by adjusting nominal values with an appropriate index of prices, i.e. containing the effect of inflation.
Since inflation means that money can lose its value over time, nominal figures can be misleading when used to compare values in different periods. It is better to compare their real value, by adjusting the nominal figures to remove the effects of inflation.

 




CliveWalkerWingWizard

Well-known member
Aug 31, 2006
2,667
surrenden
They should have been in school
No they shouldn’t, they were striking. Do you not understand the concept or do you think that teachers should put up with 10 years of sub inflation pay awards and reduced funding for education?
 


Pavilionaire

Well-known member
Jul 7, 2003
30,521
I maintain that Brexit has f*cked our economy just enough to make the difference between our public secfor workers getting an agreeable wage increase or not getting one. We are the only major G8 economy to have gone backwards since Dec 19.

The sooner some grown-ups sort this shit out and get a Customs Union agreement the better. Right now the world is looking at us and our Brexit decision and consider us as a basket case. We can't afford the stuff we used to take for granted.
 


Greenbag50

Well-known member
Jun 1, 2016
386
No they shouldn’t, they were striking. Do you not understand the concept or do you think that teachers should put up with 10 years of sub inflation pay awards and reduced funding for education?
It’s perfectly obvious to me now, that we have fundamentally different outlooks on life, which is fine. It would be boring if we all thought the same, did the same things etc.
The one (and only in most likelihood) thing we have in common, is our support for BHAFC.
Let’s leave if there. UTA
 




The Clamp

Well-known member
NSC Patreon
Jan 11, 2016
24,277
West is BEST
They should have been in school
That's not how strikes work. Of course, if you're trying to say you don't agree with the strikes that's a decent debate and one worth having. Otherwise it just seems you don't know what strikes are.
 


wellquickwoody

Many More Voting Years
NSC Patreon
Aug 10, 2007
13,585
Melbourne
This is quite a strong statement. I know people who are in teachers and transport unions and this isn’t something they’ve made me aware of.

Out of interest what happened to you?
Someone I know very well.

An issue where the union took little, or maybe even no interest whatsoever, rumbled on for some months. When push came to shove and the issue went to the top, the employer folded saying that if they had been made aware earlier of what was happening they would have sorted out the problem far, far sooner.

Unable to say more, but union reps can and do offer differing levels of support to their members.
 


Cotton Socks

Skint Supporter
Feb 20, 2017
1,640
From when jnr was in primary school the budgets were cut & then cut again. He's now in year 11. The school was closed today due to strike action, I agree with them & I don't know any teachers. I can only speak for jnr's school but the teachers there worked their nuts off in lockdown. Normal lesson plans went completely out of the window, don't forget the lockdown started off as 'a couple of weeks' or something like that. It spread across year groups which run from Sept to June, rather than years in the calendar sense.
When it was clear that it was going to be longer, it was set up online & I found myself having to do pe lessons in my lounge via You tube vids that their actual teachers were putting up via a protected link. The teachers at my jnrs school made sure that they still got everything they needed. Yoga is not as 'gentle' as it seems and HIT pe lessons modified to a lounge by the teachers, is the work of the devil. I did enjoy our maths, science & french 'inter home' competitions, though I wouldn't win now jnr is in yr 11 compared to year 8 when the 1st lockdown started! :lolol: Jnr's form tutor rang them all up once a week to check they were ok, they also rang the parents another time in the week. I know that Jnrs form tutor was doing all this whilst homeschooling her own kid.
Anyone with the idea that their job starts and ends at the same time the kids arrive and leave is delusional.
Damn right they need a pay rise, it needs to be funded by the government though. There is no such thing as having a 'textbook' each during a lesson anymore, kids are being asked to take pictures of the whiteboard on their phones. I don't think they mind that much, as they don't have to experience carrying around textbooks in their rucksacks.
Teachers have to pay to educate the future generations, nurses & medical professionals have to pay to qualify to be able to look after us. They need resources to be able to do their jobs properly. If you are unlucky enough to need medical treatment ask the person who is treating you if they've paid off their student loan. If you have kids, when it comes to parents evening ask their teachers if they've managed to pay off their student loan yet. The loans they have to get to teach the kids, keep us well, affect their chances of getting a mortgage. Why are the people that keep things going, being charged to keep things going & then can't get a mortgage to own their own home. Someone doing a fine arts degree is going to be paying the same amount. No offence to those doing a fine arts degree but it isn't in my top 10 of essential qualifications for essential jobs list.
Rant over, I'm going to look at football threads now! :lolol:
 




dsr-burnley

Well-known member
Aug 15, 2014
2,185
Respect to him for standing up for his principles. :clap2:
The school wouldn’t be fully open if even one person takes strike action.
Sadly, headteachers have strong-armed a lot of teachers into going against a democratic vote for industrial action by following the DFE’s edict to find out which staff were striking in advance of the day. This is at odds with strike law and, needless to say, something this month’s education secretary Gillian Keegan was unaware of.
I suppose it depends what their aim is. If the head teachers know who is turning up and who isn't, they can make plans to give the children the best education possible in the circumstances. If the teachers want to cause maximum disruption and damage to the children's prospects (and presumably they do, that's the whole point) they keep mum about whether they are coming in because that way helps to increase the number of children who miss out on schooling.
 


Harry Wilson's tackle

Harry Wilson's Tackle
NSC Patreon
Oct 8, 2003
49,337
Faversham
No point, just sharing my opinion that teachers and kids should have been in school and not in Pizza Express on a Tuesday lunchtime in term time.
Why does that make me strange?
Should of.

Shirley?
 


Harry Wilson's tackle

Harry Wilson's Tackle
NSC Patreon
Oct 8, 2003
49,337
Faversham
From when jnr was in primary school the budgets were cut & then cut again. He's now in year 11. The school was closed today due to strike action, I agree with them & I don't know any teachers. I can only speak for jnr's school but the teachers there worked their nuts off in lockdown. Normal lesson plans went completely out of the window, don't forget the lockdown started off as 'a couple of weeks' or something like that. It spread across year groups which run from Sept to June, rather than years in the calendar sense.
When it was clear that it was going to be longer, it was set up online & I found myself having to do pe lessons in my lounge via You tube vids that their actual teachers were putting up via a protected link. The teachers at my jnrs school made sure that they still got everything they needed. Yoga is not as 'gentle' as it seems and HIT pe lessons modified to a lounge by the teachers, is the work of the devil. I did enjoy our maths, science & french 'inter home' competitions, though I wouldn't win now jnr is in yr 11 compared to year 8 when the 1st lockdown started! :lolol: Jnr's form tutor rang them all up once a week to check they were ok, they also rang the parents another time in the week. I know that Jnrs form tutor was doing all this whilst homeschooling her own kid.
Anyone with the idea that their job starts and ends at the same time the kids arrive and leave is delusional.
Damn right they need a pay rise, it needs to be funded by the government though. There is no such thing as having a 'textbook' each during a lesson anymore, kids are being asked to take pictures of the whiteboard on their phones. I don't think they mind that much, as they don't have to experience carrying around textbooks in their rucksacks.
Teachers have to pay to educate the future generations, nurses & medical professionals have to pay to qualify to be able to look after us. They need resources to be able to do their jobs properly. If you are unlucky enough to need medical treatment ask the person who is treating you if they've paid off their student loan. If you have kids, when it comes to parents evening ask their teachers if they've managed to pay off their student loan yet. The loans they have to get to teach the kids, keep us well, affect their chances of getting a mortgage. Why are the people that keep things going, being charged to keep things going & then can't get a mortgage to own their own home. Someone doing a fine arts degree is going to be paying the same amount. No offence to those doing a fine arts degree but it isn't in my top 10 of essential qualifications for essential jobs list.
Rant over, I'm going to look at football threads now! :lolol:
But there are some who still regard teachers as slaves, who should never never ever ever do anything that may progress the flowering of a young mind.

At the end of the day, most of us are slaves. The more we are seen a slaves, the more it is that the only weapon we have in the Social Contract (RIP) is to withdraw our labour.

Best wishes to all of those striking.
 


Cotton Socks

Skint Supporter
Feb 20, 2017
1,640
I suppose it depends what their aim is. If the head teachers know who is turning up and who isn't, they can make plans to give the children the best education possible in the circumstances. If the teachers want to cause maximum disruption and damage to the children's prospects (and presumably they do, that's the whole point) they keep mum about whether they are coming in because that way helps to increase the number of children who miss out on schooling.
I think you maybe over stating the damage and disruption to children's prospects for missing a couple of days of school. BBC bitesize is available if there's nothing else they can do. 🤷‍♀️
 




dsr-burnley

Well-known member
Aug 15, 2014
2,185
But there are some who still regard teachers as slaves, who should never never ever ever do anything that may progress the flowering of a young mind.

At the end of the day, most of us are slaves. The more we are seen a slaves, the more it is that the only weapon we have in the Social Contract (RIP) is to withdraw our labour.

Best wishes to all of those striking.
You mean all this fuss about the US Civil War was because the poor slaves were living lives like we are today? I've learned something there. Instead of having a war, why didn't they just move to a different employer, or go to university and get better qualified?
 


The Clamp

Well-known member
NSC Patreon
Jan 11, 2016
24,277
West is BEST
You mean all this fuss about the US Civil War was because the poor slaves were living lives like we are today? I've learned something there. Instead of having a war, why didn't they just move to a different employer, or go to university and get better qualified?
Then who will teach the children? You’ve not really thought that through.
 



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