Re: Closure of NSC ticket exchange

[Rugrat]

Can I just ask, are you in any way employed by the club or connected to someone who is?

Looking at the posts this fella makes I'd say that's a reasonable question

 

[Da Man Clay]

My argument though is that "NSC" has always acted as a facilitator. The ticket exchange involved "posters" offering and asking for tickets not "NSC". NSC was just the medium that they used to conduct the transaction. This will still be true if it done using the PM system.

I admit that if they don't use the PM system to conduct the trade then NSC is in the clear but if they do, then there isn't really a difference.

That's always been true, but actually allowing someone to advertise tickets for sale is covered in the facilitating part of the act and NSC becomes liable.

If people don't use the PM system after the original request for tickets and its done out in the open then NSC is once again liable as 'they' have allowed the transfer of tickets. If its done in secret by PM it should be fine as NSC cannot really be expected to audit the PM function.


It's all a bit of a nonsense anyway. I have quite high doubts that NSC would ever be taken to court anyway, it's just the club getting a ridiculously high and mighty over something that happened since tickets were sold for football games, and will continue to happen forever more.

 

[Steve.S]

A company can't just put any terms and conditions they like on a contract. Say for instance they put a condition on the ticket that they were allowed to come and punch you in the face at half time or put a paper bag over your head. Would that be an acceptable condition?

Conditions have to be reasonable. Now this hasn't been tested much by the courts but the general principles of contract law is that any condition that prevents you from selling on your own property is not reasonable.

Where is it not reasonable to give you value for buying your ST. You get a ST for a reduced rate, because you are paying up front. People who do not have a ST pay far more on a match to match basis. Therefore where is it unreasonable for a club to say that some one who comes in on your ST for one or two games does not pay the same price as everyone else for a match to match basis. The club are also not stopping you selling your ticket, they just want you to do it through the club. And again you are going on about the law. The club have very right to refuse you entry to the ground, and that can not be challenged in any court. They refund your ST and say that you can not come in. You can not challenge anyone to except your custom if they do not want it. You could also look at it two ways. Why do not STH take the club to task about letting people who pay the same price as them, yet can do it on a match to match basis.

 

[Steve.S]

Looking at the posts this fella makes I'd say that's a reasonable question

No, can I not have an opinion that is not the same as yours. I am not the one who has a ST and is trying to change the terms of it, because it does not suit my needs. Read the small print and if you do not like, do not get one. The club gave it to you at a reduced rate compared to buying match to match basis. And they say you can use the club exchange. That's where I would have an issue They could put your ticket on the market, as soon as you confirm you will not be attending. They could also maybe do half season tickets. Then they could also reward to people who attend every match. The club could do a lot more. But I do not think it is unreasonable for a company to try and stop selling tickets at reduced market rate. Would you be happy if they allowed you to sell your Ticket at the market rate?

 

[El Presidente]

It is clear from Atilla's post on the safe standing/meeting with MP/PB thread that the club are behind the closing of the NSC ticket exchange.

It would appear that their view of NSC is 'thanks for the campaigning, the letters, the lobbying, the support for the planning application, NOW f*** OFF.

 

[Alex Alex Dawson oo! oo!]

It is clear from Atilla's post on the safe standing/meeting with MP/PB thread that the club are behind the closing of the NSC ticket exchange.
It would appear that their view of NSC is 'thanks for the campaigning, the letters, the lobbying, the support for the planning application, NOW f*** OFF.

Not to me, whereabouts is this?
The only thing I've read that doesn't appear to be just gossip was Bozza's initial post about closing down the ticket exchange because it had been drawn to his attention that it may be illegal. Incidentally, I don't believe he didn't know this.

 

[Titanic]

Not to me, whereabouts is this?
The only thing I've read that doesn't appear to be just gossip was Bozza's initial post about closing down the ticket exchange because it had been drawn to his attention that it may be illegal. Incidentally, I don't believe he didn't know this.

I brought up the subject of the ticket exchange as well. Reasons are:
- maximising revenue - ie until we are completely sold out the club should be selling tickets not individual fans (I can see their argument, not sure it's entirely fair but it's a valid one)
- that 'identifiable individual in identifiable seat' business again

"Reasons" for what??

 

[Titanic]

and this seems even clearer:

PB did say that he realises that tickets are passed around between family and friends and that this will continue (it'll happen more and more as games happen less and less on Saturdays at 3pm, moving games to Friday nights/late kick offs on Sats should be made ILLEGAL as far as I'm concerned, but I'm sure some people don't mind) It's the commercial ticket exchange he objects to.

Although I don't understand what is 'commercial' about passing tickets on at cost between friends or fellow-NSCers??

 

[Rugrat]

No, can I not have an opinion that is not the same as yours. I am not the one who has a ST and is trying to change the terms of it, because it does not suit my needs. Read the small print and if you do not like, do not get one. The club gave it to you at a reduced rate compared to buying match to match basis. And they say you can use the club exchange. That's where I would have an issue They could put your ticket on the market, as soon as you confirm you will not be attending. They could also maybe do half season tickets. Then they could also reward to people who attend every match. The club could do a lot more. But I do not think it is unreasonable for a company to try and stop selling tickets at reduced market rate. Would you be happy if they allowed you to sell your Ticket at the market rate?

You're entitled to whatever opinion you want but given that you keep banging on about T&C's as about the only justification for their actions the question that was asked by the other poster seems reasonable to me. I don't live my life by T&C's indeed I doubt any of us do and they are generally there (in this case) to stop profiteering. The exchange here is not about profit it simply is a small service for fans by fans and the financial impact on the club is negligible. These are fans who have stuck with the club through some really difficult times, and as others have said, have lobbied on it's behalf and many have given a lot more to ensure its survival.

I have a great deal of Commercial experience and there is no way I would isolate a small and loyal group of my customers just because I can .... it's petty in the extreme

 

[Ernest]

and this seems even clearer:



Although I don't understand what is 'commercial' about passing tickets on at cost between friends or fellow-NSCers??

Because he wants the unsold ones sold not ones already paid for

 

[El Presidente]

Because he wants the unsold ones sold not ones already paid for

This will bite him on the bum though, as some STH will not renew if they only can make 15-18 matches a season and sold their 'spares' at cost on the ticket exchange.

It is commercially daft, as the club will lose out overall.

 

[Bold Seagull]

This will bite him on the bum though, as some STH will not renew if they only can make 15-18 matches a season and sold their 'spares' at cost on the ticket exchange.

It is commercially daft, as the club will lose out overall.

How many people did use the exchange though vs how many people are on the season ticket waiting list?

 

[Springal]

This will bite him on the bum though, as some STH will not renew if they only can make 15-18 matches a season and sold their 'spares' at cost on the ticket exchange.

It is commercially daft, as the club will lose out overall.

Is this not a side affect of NSC becoming Ltd? I'm sure the club wouldn't have take strong action against a fan as that is never good press, but instead maybe now NSC is a Ltd company, they reminded them of the law etc.

And are there really that many fans affected by this, can they not setup a Facebook Group, or Twitter Hashtag or similar? Is the number of fans that would not renew, greater than the waiting list for ST's ? Or do you not 'know' people that would want them?

4 of us go, if someone can't make it, about 50% of the time we can shift it for £20 via facebook to everyones circle of friends.

 

[Tony Meolas Loan Spell]

Said it on another thread but will say it here! We banged out our spare at £20 so hardly making a profit and yes the club have already had the ST money up front.

 

[Ernest]

This will bite him on the bum though, as some STH will not renew if they only can make 15-18 matches a season and sold their 'spares' at cost on the ticket exchange.

It is commercially daft, as the club will lose out overall.

I agree as the thing with 3pm kick off changes is pissing a lot of people off, TV fair enough but its the students stuff that is f***ing it all up too. Plus a lot more seats on general sales makes a season less attractive now

 

[Rugrat]

Oh and just as a marker for [MENTION=24564]Steve.S[/MENTION] I just went to a big Liverpool forum (Red and White Kop) and they have a ticket exchange set up much along the same lines as ours. Can't imagine it's not in L'pool T&C's but seems OK for them

 

[smeariestbat]

i tend to work weekends and therefore struggle to make some of the 3pm saturday games. I USED to just GIVE my ST to friends or family, free of charge, to go to the game. These are people who would never have bought a ticket on their own from the club. I did this because i'm of the opinion that i prefer SOMEONE to be sitting in my seat rather than no-one. These people would still be spending on money on refreshments and merchandise i'm sure, but when you havent already shelled out 40 quid for a ticket thats not so hard to do. If you're gonna spend 40 quid on a ticket, then another 10/20 if not more on in Amex purchases, it becomes a very expensive afternoon out, which as i have mentioned before, the people i was lending my ticket to cant afford.

So now, thanks to Barbers Bullies i will be leaving my seat empty. So any revenue they may have made through sales from me lending out my ticket have gone, because these people wont be able to buy a ticket to go to yhe game as its too damn expensive! This reduces the chances of converting more people to being fans and all that. Community club my arse.

 

[Alex Alex Dawson oo! oo!]

"Reasons" for what??

Cheers, should have read A's post thoroughly. Apologies El Pres.

 

[fcportaloo]

It is clear from Atilla's post on the safe standing/meeting with MP/PB thread that the club are behind the closing of the NSC ticket exchange.

It would appear that their view of NSC is 'thanks for the campaigning, the letters, the lobbying, the support for the planning application, NOW f*** OFF.

Yes, it's small-minded and petty of the club to chase after a few extra pounds in this way. Most ST holders are unable to attend every game, for whatever reason. If they then decide to pass to a friend, family member, work colleague and ask for the face value of the ticket - what is so wrong with this? If they do the same via NSC it's not any different either.

The club have the benefit of a supporter in the seat (better atmosphere etc etc than loads of empty seats, spend in the ground on beer, pies whatever) the ST holder recoups a bit of their outlay (for something they were unable to participate in) and the person buying the ticket gets to see The Albion at a better price. There are reasons the ticket is not been bought from the club (can't pay/won't pay £40 a match doesn't matter which) so I imagine these people will find ways round the 'exchange rules' or will just stop going.

Of course, the club doesn't care that they stop going. They are not an important revenue stream, probably many on here agree. A football should be more than a revenue generator though.

I have used the ticket exchange a few times, it's meant I went to games I would otherwise not have gone to. There was no problem with tickets, trusting people or payment. No problem with my behaviour at the ground, or any kind of risk because the club did not definitively know who was in which seat (they don't anyway). The games I went to I would not have bought a full-price match ticket, the club hasn't 'lost' any money. I spent money in the ground each time too.

In the past, like countless others I have given my time, goodwill and even a cash donation to the club to ensure it's survival and the ability to get planning permission. This parsimonious, petty quibbling by the club over a few dozen tickets being exchanged on NSC makes me feel like something important has been lost.

I know, I am only a supporter, not a guaranteed revenue stream so matter little in an economic sense. But come on - football is not only about revenue is it? If so, close the clubs/leagues outside the prem and have some some kind of bloated, orgiastic football festival designed 100% for pay TV

 

[fcportaloo]

Exactly