Railway silly season

[Gwylan]

What you'd like to think is completely irrelevant though. As I'm sure you know, there is a tick box which states something like 'I have read and agree to all of the terms & conditions'. In ticking that box you are agreeing to use the ticket in accordance with those terms & conditions, no matter how draconian or ridiculous they may be.

Yes, but the point seems to be, as Westdene Seagull has pointed out, is that there's nothing in the T&C that says you can't leave the train early.

What you're agreeing to is the right for SWT to implement any fines they seem fit - that doesn't sound like a fair process to me. Nor, does it seem, one that has any force in law and relies on people meekly complying with daylight robbery.

 

[British Bulldog]

I do use pre-booked tickets on the odd occasion and I would like to think it is my right to leave the train at any point during the journey.

Now thats where the main problem seems to be BoF, There's just too many people who see it as they're god given right to cheat the rail company's out of money. As Ernest said earlier if you want the flexibility then you pay for the ticket that allows it.

 

[Badger]

Not really, could be their marketing strategy or are you an expert ?

I'm clearly not an expert but I have this thing called common sense which tells me that if it is a marketing strategy it's a very bad one from a consumer's point of view.

 

[Barrel of Fun]

Now thats where the main problem seems to be BoF, There's just too many people who see it as they're god given right to cheat the rail company's out of money. As Ernest said earlier if you want the flexibility then you pay for the ticket that allows it.

Where have I even suggested that it is my god given right to cheat a rail company out of money?

As an example - What would happen if I entered London Victoria, but decided I didn't want to get on my train to Southampton at all and demanded to be let out. Could I expect a fine from there?

 

[beorhthelm]

As an example - What would happen if I entered London Victoria, but decided I didn't want to get on my train to Southampton at all and demanded to be let out. Could I expect a fine from there?

i am enjoying the contrived scenarios being suggested. i'd have thought the point of the enforcment in this case is to prevent commuters abusing the cheap fares.

 

[sten_super]

Yes, but the point seems to be, as Westdene Seagull has pointed out, is that there's nothing in the T&C that says you can't leave the train early.

What you're agreeing to is the right for SWT to implement any fines they seem fit - that doesn't sound like a fair process to me. Nor, does it seem, one that has any force in law and relies on people meekly complying with daylight robbery.

Well on the Megabus website I found the following;

4. Bookings are only valid on the journey(s) and places stated.

20. Rail travel is undertaken under the National Rail Conditions of Carriage as amended by these terms. A copy can be obtained from staffed train stations or from National Rail Enquiries .

And on the National Rail website, looking at t&cs for advance fares;

Break of journey

You may not start, break and resume, or end your journey at any intermediate station except to change to/from connecting trains as shown on the ticket(s) or other valid travel itinerary.

So it looks like it is in the terms & conditions.

And yes, I do believe in the right of SWT to implement and terms & conditions that they want. IMHO, train travel is a service which is provided by a private operator, and it is the choice of the consumer whether or not they use to utilise it. If the t&cs were really that draconian, I would suggest that people wouldn't use the trains and would use alternatives instead.

 

[British Bulldog]

Where have I even suggested that it is my god given right to cheat a rail company out of money?

By suggesting when you buy a cheap ticket on line you like to feel it's your right to use it how you feel fit rather than buy the more expensive ticket for the purpose you really want.

 

[Beach Hut]

I'm clearly not an expert but I have this thing called common sense which tells me that if it is a marketing strategy it's a very bad one from a consumer's point of view.

Excellent news, I am sure they would employ consultants like you then.

 

[Iggle Piggle]

I think this argument boils down to the following

If I piss my customers off they go elsewhere.
If the train people on here piss their customers off it does not matter to them as we are stuck with them and thier is no incentive to be nice to the customers.

I also love the way that the trainey people talk about 'maximising revenue' It's all very well having this attitude (like the tube strikes) but don't expect any sympathy off me when a glorified monorail or driverless train is invented if that's the way you think.

Similarly, at my local station, it's often the case that not all ticket windows are manned when there is a massive queue but plenty of staff standing around chatting. More ticket machines are deployed and they all went on strike proving the point that automation is the way forward. If we got a great service, the great British public might be more amenable.

 

[Simster]

Excellent news, I am sure they would employ consultants like you then.

Yeah, afterall he's only a potential customer isn't he, as opposed to one of your comrades at work milking the cash cow. Therefore, his opinion is of little relevance when compared to that of a train worker.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

What we really need is for someone to challenge the T&Cs to see if they are reasonable. I also wonder if they are compatible with the law of the land and general rights for freedom of movement etc.

 

[Badger]

Excellent news, I am sure they would employ consultants like you then.

No I'm not anal enough to work for a train company and I think they've filled their 1% quota of helpful and understanding staff

 

[Barrel of Fun]

By suggesting when you buy a cheap ticket on line you like to feel it's your right to use it how you feel fit rather than buy the more expensive ticket for the purpose you really want.

But what if you intend to see out the journey and make a spur of the moment decision to cancel your contract. You entered the agreement in good faith. I now know to ask the ticket inspector on the train if it is possible to jump off sooner and hope some common sense prevails.

I have never had to terminate or break a journey on a booked ticket, so I shall have to wait and see if the need ever arrives.

I've only ever had one fine and that is when I lost my ticket and had no record of it as it was paid for by cash. If I were keen to fare dodge, I would have got out at PP rather than face the barriers at Brighton, but there was a common sense lapse from the ticket chap. I certainly wouldn't have told him I came all the way from Putney if I were looking for a cheap ride.

 

[Beach Hut]

Yeah, afterall he's only a potential customer isn't he, as opposed to one of your comrades at work milking the cash cow. Therefore, his opinion is of little relevance when compared to that of a train worker.

I don't really understand your problem but for the avoidance of any doubt I do not work for a train company so please do not keep saying this.

 

[Simster]

I don't really understand your problem but for the avoidance of any doubt I do not work for a train company so please do not keep saying this.

But if you ever needed a job, you should definitely apply. With your ambivalence to the importance of good customer service and your inability to apply common sense, you'd fit right in.

 

[Gwylan]

And on the National Rail website, looking at t&cs for advance fares;

So it looks like it is in the terms & conditions.

Ok fair enough but it does highlight the ludicrous nature of the tickets that in order to find the relevant conditions, a passenger has to look, not at the website of the ticketing company, but at the website of the overall rail authority. And I stand by my position that the T&Cs are unfair - after all as you point out, the tickets are bought off one website but the T&Cs are from another organisation. I'm absolutely certain that that wouldn't stand up in a court.

 

[Yoda]

The one thing that truely get's on my nerves with advanced booking's is that (on some operator's) you can reserve seat's at no extra charge at a quarter of the price you would if you decided to travel that day at FULL cost.

Why should the person who has paid MORE (most likely) have to STAND, yet the who has paid a FRACTION of them get to sit?

 

[British Bulldog]

But what if you intend to see out the journey and make a spur of the moment decision to cancel your contract. You entered the agreement in good faith. I now know to ask the ticket inspector on the train if it is possible to jump off sooner and hope some common sense prevails.

In all honesty BoF in genuine cases I'd like to think there is still room for a little bit of common sense and flexibility, It's the people who knowingly try and cheat the rail company's are the people I like to see hit hard.

 

[Acker79]

But what if you intend to see out the journey and make a spur of the moment decision to cancel your contract. You entered the agreement in good faith. I now know to ask the ticket inspector on the train if it is possible to jump off sooner and hope some common sense prevails.

How do you tell the difference between somoene making a genuine spur of the moment decision from those who are trying to circumvent the fees?

 

[Gwylan]

This is a bit strange too.

Originally Posted by National Rail website
Break of journey
You may not start, break and resume, or end your journey at any intermediate station except to change to/from connecting trains as shown on the ticket(s) or other valid travel itinerary.

I had one of these non-flexible rail tickets coming back from Scotland last month. Although the ticket said Helensburgh to Brighton, it also said it was only valid with five specific named trains and change at designated stations. But if I got off at Euston and decided to hang around London for a bit and get a later train, I'd have done that and bought a single ticket from London to Brighton - but I wouldn't have been fined for doing so. That seems to be quite an anomaly to me -if you allow people to break their journey to change trains - why can't they break their journey other times?