- Jun 20, 2021
- 3,258
Not just our current CBs, our former one can't defend at the moment, either.
Poor by White there
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Poor by White there
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[Albion] Premier League 5-7/3/22
- Thread starter Bozza
- Start date
Watford and Naaraach gone, 4 other contenders, Burnley usually survive and surely not Everton? Would like to see Brentford stay up which leaves us the World Champions of the World...
Why are they gone? Based on the form in the last 8 games they would both stay up while Leeds and Everton go down.
Seasider78
Well-known member
- Nov 14, 2004
- 5,940
I don’t know if you have noticed but the top managers tend to end up with the top jobs at the big clubs and win the big trophies. What exactly has Bielsa won in his career that warrants him being talked about as some sort of messiah? The fact Bielsa ended up at Leeds in the championship in the first place and is still not courted by the big fish suggests he is a bit average.
I don’t see Ronaldo every day in training but I can comfortably suggest he is world class player and Teemu Pukki is a bit average
No I haven't noticed. I've noticed that big names end up in big clubs that have the quality to win big trophies. Bielsa is a freak, no club/brand with a worldwide reputation is going to let him in but it doesnt mean he is any worse than those who get the big jobs. What suggests that Lampard, Arteta, Ole Gunnar Solskjaer, Gary Neville and so on would be any better than someone like Gareth Ainsworth just because they've managed bigger clubs? As Arsene Wenger said, boards in football clubs usually know very very little about football and there isnt much suggesting that they make choices based on the competence of the coach they're hiring.
Tough afternoon ahead for United now……1-0
Seasider78
Well-known member
- Nov 14, 2004
- 5,940
That’s some very selective picking what about Klopp, Guardiola, Conte, Mourinho, Ancelotti top managers who consistently get the top jobs because they are top managers.
The managers you have listed are where clubs take a punt on because they are young and have potential Bielsa has shown throughout his career he cannot deliver trophies which is why he has not been hired in any of those opportunities. The managers you listed will probably end up like Bielsa at a Leeds or something if they do not cut it at the top level it’s all part of the football food chain.
He is not some weird freak he’s just not as good as the hype around him suggests. No different in many ways to a lot of over hyped players it’s a fairly common thing in football.
Good finish by Sancho…..1-1
Unless you manage teams that are able to win titles, you're going to struggle to win titles... Klopp won 0 titles with Mainz, and how much did Conte win before he got the Juventus job? What happens if you put Ancelotti in charge of a team like... Everton, instead of a team with world class player in every position? How many titles would Mourinho win in a scenario where he was managing Harry Winks rather than Frank Lampard?
He's absolutely a weird freak... I struggle to see how anyone could question that. Look at him, listen to him... proper weird.
Whether he is good or bad is hard to tell because I've only watched 90 minutes of him doing the core part of his job (training sessions) but some of the guys you mentioned seems to hold him in high regard.
2-1 City, De Bruyne (again)
Motogull
Todd Warrior
- Sep 16, 2005
- 9,885
The sort of goal we would concede.
Seasider78
Well-known member
- Nov 14, 2004
- 5,940
I have always found Van Gaal a bit of an oddball but it never held him back from winning major trophies at big clubs.
Big clubs are happy to have crooks and murderers as owners so I am struggling to believe if any of them thought Bielsa could deliver them trophies they would not get him in purely because he is a bid odd in interviews and owns a bucket. You say ‘what would mourinho do with a team of Harry winks’ I would check out his achievements with Porto I would say that is pretty impressive and trumps anything Bielsa has ever achieved by some distance.
I can only judge him on what he has achieved in his profession and in a field littered with examples of managers progressing through clubs and hoovering up trophies his CV is a very average.
I was trying to think who we could realistic snaffle up in the Summer to add to our striking options - i thought Pukki and Dennis (Watford) may be better options than our normal punts on untried Low Countries of Europe "stars".
Seagull58
In the Algarve
To be fair to The Blessed Bielsa,, he has won the Argentine league title three times as a manager and also been runner-up in the Copa Libertadores. He also coached the Argentina national team to runner-up in the Copa America and Olympic gold medal. In Spain, he coached Athletic Bilbao to Europa League runners-up. His greatest achievement is undoubtedly coaching The Champions of Europe to the ELF Championship. So, he's not rubbish and he has been influential on a number of former players e.g. Poch and Simeone.
The reason has never been given an opportunity to manage one of hte top European sides could be, at least partly, because of his weirdness.
Seagull58
In the Algarve
Bielsa has 3 Argentine league titles with 2 different clubs. He was also runner-up in the Copa Libertadores and the Europa League. He coached Argentina to Copa America runners-up and the Olympic gold medal. His CV is decent but not much in Europe. Although coaching the Champions of Europe to the EFL Championship surely trumps any of Mourinho's achievements.
Money doesn’t always buy happiness and here’s the proof.
wolfie
Well-known member
That result means we can't win the league now.
I'm not saying Bielsa doesnt win trophies because he is weird, but it is one of the reasons he wouldnt end up in a big club (and clubs - not managers - win titles).
Louis van Gaal is eccentric, witty and bombastic, or Dutch as you also could call it, but other than that fairly normal.
Marcelo Bielsa... as the manager of a club like Barcelona or Manchester City you have to be able to shake hands with sponsors, business associates, state leaders, Chinese fanboys, and you have to respect the 500-1000 people working for the club. If you cant see people in the eyes when speaking to them, if you often comment on internal affairs (like when he made himself impossible in Bilbao through ranting about the shite construction workers working on the training ground) and if you appear to have zero idea how anything but football works... there will be issues. You can't have a savant in charge of Real Madrid.
Number of trophies and the size of the clubs you've managed does not tell the full story on your quality as a coach. McDonalds might win some corporate awards and sell more burgers than anyone else but it doesnt mean they have the best chefs.
hart's shirt
Well-known member
From Bruce/Pallister and Ferdinand/Vidic to Lindelof/Maguire. How the mighty have fallen.
United are now just another makeweight 5th-8th team with West Ham, Wolves and Spurs as rivals.
They were lucky to beat us at home. We deserved at least a point from that game.
Roy Keane:
"Who's running that dressing room? These guys seem more bothered about, "How am I looking? How’s my hair looking? Are my boots nice?" You leave your ego at the door when you play for Man Utd."
"I'm looking at the United fans and they're not daft. They're watching their team and seeing they're not fighting. There are no excuses."
"There will be statements, I have no doubt, over the next few days but we all know who will making them through their teams and on Twitter and all that nonsense. I don't care about any of that."
"It's what you say on the pitch that matters."
United are now just another makeweight 5th-8th team with West Ham, Wolves and Spurs as rivals.
They were lucky to beat us at home. We deserved at least a point from that game.
Roy Keane:
"Who's running that dressing room? These guys seem more bothered about, "How am I looking? How’s my hair looking? Are my boots nice?" You leave your ego at the door when you play for Man Utd."
"I'm looking at the United fans and they're not daft. They're watching their team and seeing they're not fighting. There are no excuses."
"There will be statements, I have no doubt, over the next few days but we all know who will making them through their teams and on Twitter and all that nonsense. I don't care about any of that."
"It's what you say on the pitch that matters."