Politically, are you left or right wing?

[cunning fergus]

Being a member of a trade union is NOT synonymous with being left wing it just means you see the benefits of banding together to improve your life.

Also I don't think what could be classed as traditional support i.e. the supposed 'working class' is the main core behind labour and that is down to major changes in demographics , more people owning their own houses, more and generally better paid self employed tradespeople , more people going to university , better access to political materials and generally more money around. To generalise the 'middle' class has moved to the left and big chunks of working class have moved to the right.

I definitely agree with the juxtaposition of social change with what we consider to be our class pulling in different directions from historic reference points, both those matters alone would be worthy matters for discussion.

The left/right debate though is just too simplistic, and dumbs down the nuance of how people genuinely see themselves politically. Indeed, part of the problem with the political system we have is that we are essentially given a binary choice on Governments. I am not making a case there for proportional representation, personally I think that would be worse, but that is a helpful segway to the left and right debate.

The genesis of left/right is driven from the outcome of the French Revolution, the Revolutionary radicals (jacobins) sat on the left, the monarchists on the right. The key to what was left and right was therefore the scale of change. The radicals eventually got their way, and up came the national razor, the end of organised religion and even a new calendar (the 10 day week).

The monarchists obviously resisted this change and wanted to shift closer to the British constitutional monarchy where parliament governs and the monarch as head of state is reduced to broadly figure head.

History is now the only judge on whether France did benefit, my own view is that the reign of terror, which was how the radicals sought to control the population after the revolution was deeply facist and led to civil strife for decades. This period saw the rise of a tyrant which resulted in the Napoleonic wars that killed millions across Europe.

So, in my view left and right is effectively change, how much and how fast. If BLM is left so is Brexit. If keeping statues is right so is staying in the EU.

Radical change can be good it can be bad, and people can desire both.

 

[super ads]

Lived in Sussex last 20 years. I have no time for tax avoiders. However have great admiration for anybody who has built up a company.and is now employing loads of people Fair enough if you think this is neoliberal capitalism or stripping money from system. To me even if they have become wealthy what they have created is making a great contribution to public finances. Where would you get tax income from if profit is so bad

I agree. The trouble is that there has to be a middle ground with this argument.(yeah ‘x’ company doesn’t pay enough tax but they employ loads of people that do).

Amazon are a prime example. These huge employers pay their staff minimal pay which then has to be topped up through the benefits system thus costing the tax payer even more. That is just crazy if you ask me. I will say though that you can’t blame amazon & other companies that do similar things, it’s not their fault the rules are like that. They a just taking advantage of the system. So until you have a government in place to stop it, then good luck to them.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[zefarelly]

I agree. The trouble is that there has to be a middle ground with this argument.(yeah ‘x’ company doesn’t pay enough tax but they employ loads of people that do).

Amazon are a prime example. These huge employers pay their staff minimal pay which then has to be topped up through the benefits system thus costing the tax payer even more. That is just crazy if you ask me. I will say though that you can’t blame amazon & other companies that do similar things, it’s not their fault the rules are like that. They a just taking advantage of the system. So until you have a government in place to stop it, then good luck to them.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

This is the problem, I don't wish them good luck, I wish they'd pay their dues. The reality, I think, is they pay huge sums of money to people who legally find loopholes and cracks in the system, off shore trading for example. Theres a combination of factors all designed to maximise profits for the few and **** the propescts of the many. So very wrong on all levels to my mind.

I know someone who worked for barclays as a tax adviser, saved them so much, they paid him millions.

If the governement/HMRC invested in this talent and closed a few loop holes we'd all be better off.

 

[Bakero]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HLNhPMQnWu4

 

[Lenny Rider]

I'm in favour of controlled immigration, a complete overhaul of the benefits system and I thought Jeremy Corbyn was a clown, so that probably puts me on the right.

 

[Baker lite]

I'm in favour of controlled immigration, a complete overhaul of the benefits system and I thought Jeremy Corbyn was a clown, so that probably puts me on the right.

They’ll have you for this....


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[Guinness Boy]

They’ll have you for this....


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Who will? It's a perfectly good explanation of what he believes in and where it puts him on the political spectrum.

 

[beorhthelm]

I agree. The trouble is that there has to be a middle ground with this argument.(yeah ‘x’ company doesn’t pay enough tax but they employ loads of people that do).

Amazon are a prime example. These huge employers pay their staff minimal pay which then has to be topped up through the benefits system thus costing the tax payer even more. That is just crazy if you ask me. I will say though that you can’t blame amazon & other companies that do similar things, it’s not their fault the rules are like that. They a just taking advantage of the system. So until you have a government in place to stop it, then good luck to them.

it is crazy. government provides people tax credits, distorting the labour market (people willing to work for lower wage). solution is not to have more government, making similar problems.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

No, yes
Yes, no
Not really, yes
Yes
Yes very
No

No, yes
Yes, no
Yes, no
Yes
Yes very
No

 

[Chicken Run]

I'm in favour of controlled immigration, a complete overhaul of the benefits system and I thought Jeremy Corbyn was a clown, so that probably puts me on the right.

I’m in favour of a points based immigration system, a national capped salary payable to all instead of benefits (as discussed on another thread, if you want anymore you go to work and top it up) and I still think Corbyn is a clown.

 

[Baker lite]

I’m in favour of a points based immigration system, a national capped salary payable to all instead of benefits (as discussed on another thread, if you want anymore you go to work and top it up) and I still think Corbyn is a clown.

You and Lenny can expect a visit from the Soy snatch squads.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[Mellor 3 Ward 4]

I'm in favour of controlled immigration, a complete overhaul of the benefits system and I thought Jeremy Corbyn was a clown, so that probably puts me on the right.

I agree with the first two - I don't think Corbyn was a clown - just someone who was always a protester, never a leader - someone with some odd ideas (some good ones too) and some very strange bedfellows. The fact that he was elected Labour Leader will in time be seen as big a mistake as you can get politically at a time when common sense and a 'middle way' was desperately required.

Controlled immigration - who can really argue against that - The UK needs immigration, but we must be able to chose who we allow here - a bit like Australia, USA and Canada.

A complete overhaul of the benefits system. Yes, I'd agree with that - and I don't mean just cutting benefits - there are those, who can't or who are unable to help themselves, who need and deserve so much more than they currently get - but there are those who take the p**S, play the system who deserve less, IMO.

I consider myself slightly right of centre, but think taxes should rise who most of us (and be collected efficiently on large Corporations) to pay for better Pubic Services but at the same time I am fed up with the waste and taking the p**S that occurs in the Public Sector (My wife works in it and I can see what's going on)

There's still too much of a sense of entitlement these days - something for nothing attitude which I detest.

 

[Deleted member 2719]

Almost 2:1 left v right

Thankfully NSC has ZERO reflection of the REAL world

Very true, but if you look at just the farthest Left vs Rights, it is more like 3:1.

This is exactly why I always describe NSC are in a bubble, they need to look at the bigger picture.

The bubble caught them out with Brexit and the election.

Although they will still slur me in one way or another, I live in the real world, like yourself, some could say we are the voices of reason.

 

[Guinness Boy]

Very true, but if you look at just the farthest Left vs Rights, it is more like 3:1.

This is exactly why I always describe NSC are in a bubble, they need to look at the bigger picture.

The bubble caught them out with Brexit and the election.

Although they will still slur me in one way or another, I live in the real world, like yourself, some could say we are the voices of reason.

If you live in the real world and already describe NSC as a bubble then why comment? As I said to JCFG this is a message board for Brighton fans and the city has two Labour and one Green MP, a Labour council and voted Remain. I'd be absolutely amazed if the outcome had been any different.

Is the City of Brighton and Hove in a "bubble"? Compared to everything around it, yes it is. It's largely a self fulfilling prophecy too. Liberal people will move here, wealthy Tories will retire to the Sussex and Surrey countryside and less well off places will blame the EU for their plight and vote Brexit.

 

[Giraffe]

Generally right, but it depends on the issue. I'd expect the poll to show a significant centre to left leaning though.

 

[Deleted member 2719]

If you live in the real world and already describe NSC as a bubble then why comment? As I said to JCFG this is a message board for Brighton fans and the city has two Labour and one Green MP, a Labour council and voted Remain. I'd be absolutely amazed if the outcome had been any different.

Is the City of Brighton and Hove in a "bubble"? Compared to everything around it, yes it is. It's largely a self fulfilling prophecy too. Liberal people will move here, wealthy Tories will retire to the Sussex and Surrey countryside and less well off places will blame the EU for their plight and vote Brexit.

The reason for my comment GB, is that I like others have been trying to bring some neutrality to the board for some time now just to be jumped on by 3+ poster who arrogantly believe they know better and have some type of superior intelligence.


I would suggest that most are not, because their brain is unable to see the bigger picture even when people have said what is coming, I have said for a long time blood will be spilt on our streets, and people mocked me.

I am here to help some of the closed minds on this board, but it is rather like repeatedly running into a brick wall.

Do you feel it would be a better board to have only people who have a narrow vision in one direction?

 

[Eeyore]

Most hard working people who accumulate a little bit of wealth in pensions, savings or their home would portray a dislike in paying more tax/state intervention to those who have grafted/studied less in life - which is why most people become more sanguine about politics as they get older & move along the scale left-right; hence why the young tend to vote left & the retired right. Unfortunately for the Labour Party who are masters in losing elections - even swathes of the young saw through their empty promises last time around!

So you automatically link wealth with hard working people.

I hope you considered this before taking part in the NHS clap.

As I got older my personal wealth increased. And I've moved to the left.

 

[Guinness Boy]

The reason for my comment GB, is that I like others have been trying to bring some neutrality to the board for some time now just to be jumped on by 3+ poster who arrogantly believe they know better and have some type of superior intelligence.

I expect if you go forward on the Brexit thread from now on with a completely neutral position that is neither pro Leave or pro Remain the jumping on will slow down or stop altogether. You're welcome

Do you feel it would be a better board to have only people who have a narrow vision in one direction?

No. Except for when it comes to opinions on CPFC2010.

 

[Deleted member 2719]

I expect if you go forward on the Brexit thread from now on with a completely neutral position that is neither pro Leave or pro Remain the jumping on will slow down or stop altogether. You're welcome
Kind offer, but I spent way to many hours on that thread.





No. Except for when it comes to opinions on CPFC2010.

I will leave it to the same old gang that just like to keep reassuring themselves with one another that they are right.

 

[Chicken Run]

As I got older my personal wealth increased. And I've moved to the left.

Ahhh a champagne socialist [emoji23][emoji23][emoji23][emoji106]