Panorama Tonight 10.30pm Man Utd

[Withdean Wanderer]

For goodness sake, will you stop going on about the bloody sheep simply because an opinion does not align with yours! Didn't you admit to supporting Man Utd (as your first team) until Brighton moved to Withdean? Wouldn't that make you slightly biased on this sort of issue?

Manchester United are not a football club first and foremost. They were a leading party in commercialising football and reaped huge benefits from becoming a PLC which left them open to takeovers and at the mercy of market forces. They are the red devils. They are not the only crass enterprise in football, but they are up there at the top of the league.

A host of NSCers have confessed to 'following' a different team in the first few years of their football life as a kid, before they started actually going to watch their team at an age where they could properly understand it. I don't hear their opinions being questioned for that reason every time they pass comment.

Still, I would like to see you find me regularly going on about following sheep - it wasn't me in the other Man U thread, it was several others. I deliberately kept out of the 'reasons for hating United' thread so I didn't have to listen to the same lot of predictable dullard bores try and mock my opinion knowing full well they'd have a go at me as if I'm some hugeley biased son of Matt Busby or somethin. But I look forward to you latching on to my next post on the subject, and the next one after that - carry on with your tiresome pettyness if you insist.

Again, I don't see every other PLC that's open to takeover being mocked and laughed at if they get taken over by twats...but please carry on and ignore this point of mine anyhow so you can once again press home the fact that I "support Man U". Oh, and if I'm not allowed to talk about the football team because of an alledged bias and because they are "not a football club first and foremost" (whatever the f*** that means, just because they've revolutionised the way football clubs are run), I'll talk about them from a business perspective. I hope having completed a business degree qualifies me to have a balanced opinion on commercial activity in your eyes, but I won't be holding my breath. Maybe you'll choose to mention this in reply to every post of mine that concerns an organisation of some sort, but I doubt you'll be able to score any points off me in doing so, and will therefore decide not to bother.

 

[clapham_gull]

I hope having completed a business degree qualifies me to have a balanced opinion on commercial activity in your eyes, but I won't be holding my breath.

I completed one of those as well, but I'd imagine the investment analyst (whose investigation the programme was based on) has a head start on both of us in having a balanced opinion on the state of the finances of the club.

I'm not entirely how sure how Manchester United have "revolutionised" the way football clubs are run.

Football at that end is so dictated by finances then perhaps the revolution you refer to is actually your beloved club being knocked of it's perch, just as Liverpool were when they failed to capitalise on the new financial possibilities.

 

[Withdean Wanderer]

I completed one of those as well, but I'd imagine the investment analyst (whose investigation the programme was based on) has a head start on both of us in having a balanced opinion on the state of the finances of the club.

I'm not entirely how sure how Manchester United have "revolutionised" the way football clubs are run. Can you enlighten me ?

Oh don't get me wrong, my degree means bugger all, I just thought that would be enough for me to have an opinion on the subject.

The revolution in question was the globalisation & clear marketing, branding and merchandise strategy, as well as off the pitch business activity e.g. their own TV subscription channel.

I was under the impression they were the first, or at least amongst the first, to recognise the potential in such activities, which is what Bof is presumably talking about when he says they are "not first and foremost a football club".

I wonder if without MUFC, I would have the option to subscribe to Seagulls World, or buy BHAFC curtains and pyjamas from the club shop.

 

[the wizard 3]

 

[the wizard 3]

Oh don't get me wrong, my degree means bugger all, I just thought that would be enough for me to have an opinion on the subject.

The revolution in question was the globalisation & clear marketing, branding and merchandise strategy, as well as off the pitch business activity e.g. their own TV subscription channel.

I was under the impression they were the first, or at least amongst the first, to recognise the potential in such activities, which is what Bof is presumably talking about when he says they are "not first and foremost a football club".

I wonder if without MUFC, I would have the option to subscribe to Seagulls World, or buy BHAFC curtains and pyjamas from the club shop.

 

[El Presidente]

I'll talk about them from a business perspective.

I used to support United, have done the accounts there, worked at JP Morgan who were United's advisors the day the deal went through, have lived in Manchester for 30 years, and subscribe to a United fanzine each month....and I think they're a bunch of cockjuggling thunderc*nts.

 

[Barrel of Fun]

A host of NSCers have confessed to 'following' a different team in the first few years of their football life as a kid, before they started actually going to watch their team at an age where they could properly understand it. I don't hear their opinions being questioned for that reason every time they pass comment.

Still, I would like to see you find me regularly going on about following sheep - it wasn't me in the other Man U thread, it was several others. I deliberately kept out of the 'reasons for hating United' thread so I didn't have to listen to the same lot of predictable dullard bores try and mock my opinion knowing full well they'd have a go at me as if I'm some hugeley biased son of Matt Busby or somethin. But I look forward to you latching on to my next post on the subject, and the next one after that - carry on with your tiresome pettyness if you insist.

Again, I don't see every other PLC that's open to takeover being mocked and laughed at if they get taken over by twats...but please carry on and ignore this point of mine anyhow so you can once again press home the fact that I "support Man U". Oh, and if I'm not allowed to talk about the football team because of an alledged bias and because they are "not a football club first and foremost" (whatever the f*** that means, just because they've revolutionised the way football clubs are run), I'll talk about them from a business perspective. I hope having completed a business degree qualifies me to have a balanced opinion on commercial activity in your eyes, but I won't be holding my breath. Maybe you'll choose to mention this in reply to every post of mine that concerns an organisation of some sort, but I doubt you'll be able to score any points off me in doing so, and will therefore decide not to bother.

Christ on a bike. Stop playing the victim. I was talking about you overusing the word 'sheep' along with 'creaming themselves', 'idiots' and all the other boring words you tend to come out with.

I have only 'attacked' you once on the Man Utd subject. If you can't see how Man Utd have moved on from being a football team to some monstrous commercial giant then I don't think we should necessarily carry on this argument.

Your posts in general, over the past few years, point towards a soft spot when it comes to Man Utd, so I was questioning your impartiality or not.

I have a degree in Real Estate, but I wouldn't have the foggiest when it comes to commenting, from an expert view, on some sort of property empire.

I'm not trying to score points. That is just a bit sad.

 

[El Presidente]

I have a degree in Real Estate

I have a degree in Surreal Estate......Fish

 

[Barrel of Fun]

I wonder if without MUFC, I would have the option to subscribe to Seagulls World, or buy BHAFC curtains and pyjamas from the club shop.

Computers struggled to run even the simplest of programs in the late eighties. I had a Brighton duvet cover set pre-premiership, so the clubs did cope with minimal commercialisation.

 

[clapham_gull]

I wonder if without MUFC, I would have the option to subscribe to Seagulls World, or buy BHAFC curtains and pyjamas from the club shop.

Clearly bollocks since all football clubs have been selling tat for years and I'm not sure which day you slept in at college but Matt Busby didn't invent the world wide web.

You really do need to read up on the break away of the Premiership.

Otherwise you will be under the illusion that the top clubs are simply up there because they are "better run".

 

[Withdean Wanderer]

Christ on a bike. Stop playing the victim. I was talking about you overusing the word 'sheep' along with 'creaming themselves', 'idiots' and all the other boring words you tend to come out with.

I have only 'attacked' you once on the Man Utd subject. If you can't see how Man Utd have moved on from being a football team to some monstrous commercial giant then I don't think we should necessarily carry on this argument.

Your posts in general, over the past few years, point towards a soft spot when it comes to Man Utd, so I was questioning your impartiality or not.

I have a degree in Real Estate, but I wouldn't have the foggiest when it comes to commenting, from an expert view, on some sort of property empire.

I'm not trying to score points. That is just a bit sad.

You raise my childhood supporting in what feels like every post on the subject. Some of us aren't blessed with memories of standing on the Goldstone terraces since the age of 2 - I'd love to say if have, but I haven't. Big deal. It's tedious bringing it up to be honest - if that's only really been once then fair enough, but I'm not entirely convinced, and therefore it certainly seems like point scoring to me. Only Conboy seems to have more to say on the subject. And I haven't really overused the word sheep, have I?

I used to support United, have done the accounts there, worked at JP Morgan who were United's advisors the day the deal went through, have lived in Manchester for 30 years, and subscribe to a United fanzine each month....and I think they're a bunch of cockjuggling thunderc*nts.

That's cool - I actually find your opinion quite interesting, you obviously have reasons behind that.

 

[Chicken Runner61]

Oh don't get me wrong, my degree means bugger all, I just thought that would be enough for me to have an opinion on the subject.

The revolution in question was the globalisation & clear marketing, branding and merchandise strategy, as well as off the pitch business activity e.g. their own TV subscription channel.

I was under the impression they were the first, or at least amongst the first, to recognise the potential in such activities, which is what Bof is presumably talking about when he says they are "not first and foremost a football club".

I wonder if without MUFC, I would have the option to subscribe to Seagulls World, or buy BHAFC curtains and pyjamas from the club shop.

Originally that wasn't Manure that recognised the "potential" it was the companies behind the activity. Without Sky those clubs wouldn't have a football channel.

Its hardly rocket science selling to your fans is it?

 

[Withdean Wanderer]

Clearly bollocks since all football clubs have been selling tat for years.

You really do need to read up on the break away of the Premiership.

Otherwise you will be under the illusion that the top clubs are simply they because they are "better run".

Manchester United have simply capitalised on a huge fan base, the only other team that would have been in a position to do at the time was Liverpool but they missed the boat. Probably a lot to do with their limited gate receipts.

I was under the impression that MUFC started the mass 'tat selling' merchanise, although that is based on a single newspaper article I read at some point doing some marketing research for Uni, which perhaps has its limitations.

Point me in the direction of the reading I need to do and I will happily do it, I quite enjoy football literature of all sorts (hence the fact that I've been reading and contributing to some of the ramblings on here since I was 13!) - although I don't think it'll change my views radically to be honest.

 

[clapham_gull]

That's cool - I actually find your opinion quite interesting, you obviously have reasons behind that.

 

[clapham_gull]

Its hardly rocket science selling to your fans is it?

Especially when you have more world wide than any other team, even dating back to a time before Matt Busby made that fateful call to Tim Berners Lee.

 

[Barrel of Fun]

You raise my childhood supporting in what feels like every post on the subject. Some of us aren't blessed with memories of standing on the Goldstone terraces since the age of 2 - I'd love to say if have, but I haven't. Big deal. It's tedious bringing it up to be honest - if that's only really been once then fair enough, but I'm not entirely convinced, and therefore it certainly seems like point scoring to me. Only Conboy seems to have more to say on the subject. And I haven't really overused the word sheep, have I?

I have only mentioned it a few times and only 'bashed' you once

Whether or not you do/did support Man Utd, I have never seen you say a bad word against them as opposed to plenty when it comes to Brighton.

You conveniently forget that I have (pretty much) always responded to you in eloquent fashion (I hope) as opposed to the 'stop f***ing moaning'.

On the tat front, I was simply suggesting that Man Utd were not the pioneers of bed clothes and such like. Not forgetting to mention that videos were obsolete when it came to computers for a long long time. I wasn't really talking about lamp shades, more along the lines of globalisation and reining in foreign markets to boost their coffers. Two entirely different things. I guess I am a bit of a socialist at heart when it comes to football.

The whole game is obscene. Players in League Two earning four times the amount of our Prime Minister. That all stems from the leading clubs over-inflating the market and which Man Utd are more than culpable of doing so (but not on their own).

 

[Chicken Runner61]

Here was the formula

A good team + Munich + Sympathy + Some Success + George Best + Gloryhunting + Worldwide television broadcasting + merchandising + speculators = £M in debt

 

[Withdean Wanderer]

I have only mentioned it a few times and only 'bashed' you once

Whether or not you do/did support Man Utd, I have never seen you say a bad word against them as opposed to plenty when it comes to Brighton.

What do you want? Me to sign up to a Man United forum, pretend to be a Man United fan, and link you to every negative post? As you asked - I don't like the way my 8 year old cousin has fallen into the trap and proudly wears a Manchester United shirt despite being born in Sussex. I don't like most of their team (no co-incidence that with exception of Rooney, the only players I would go as far as saying I "like" are Giggs and Scholes) and looking back now, I don't like the way they are able to impose themselves on young kids like my cousin and myself - how the hell did they get away with having their own shop in town? I could go on, but can't be arsed really, as I think with 22000 posts on an Albion message board, god knows how much time and money wasted on watching Brighton home and away, having a stash of Albion merchandise myself, and having a real desire for Brighton to beat every club in the world (amongst other things) makes me a supporter of Brighton & Hove Albion, nobody else. I write positive and negative about the Albion because I am the most passionate about them.

You conveniently forget that I have (pretty much) always responded to you in eloquent fashion (I hope) as opposed to the 'stop f***ing moaning'.

True, and I appreciate that, but it makes you bringing up this slightly delicate scenario at every opportunity particularly frustrating, especially as it means it encourages others to snipe away at me also (as if I need more of that.)


On the tat front, I was simply suggesting that Man Utd were not the pioneers of bed clothes and such like. Not forgetting to mention that videos were obsolete when it came to computers for a long long time. I wasn't really talking about lamp shades, more along the lines of globalisation and reining in foreign markets to boost their coffers. Two entirely different things. I guess I am a bit of a socialist at heart when it comes to football.

Righty - but from what I've seen, United do seem to be the experts of marketing, branding and merchandise sales and have utilised technology to do so. The reasons why they are experts appears to be debatable - I was under the impression it was because they got in their first. I might be wrong, although I'm not particularly bothered either way. I am not a "football socialist", i see right and wrong in much of their activity.

The whole game is obscene. Players in League Two earning four times the amount of our Prime Minister. That all stems from the leading clubs over-inflating the market and which Man Utd are more than culpable of doing so (but not on their own).

Don't think anyone can disagree with that.

Goodnight.

 

[Jimmy Grimble]

You raise my childhood supporting in what feels like every post on the subject. Some of us aren't blessed with memories of standing on the Goldstone terraces since the age of 2 - I'd love to say if have, but I haven't. Big deal. It's tedious bringing it up to be honest - if that's only really been once then fair enough, but I'm not entirely convinced, and therefore it certainly seems like point scoring to me. Only Conboy seems to have more to say on the subject. And I haven't really overused the word sheep, have I?




That's cool - I actually find your opinion quite interesting, you obviously have reasons behind that.

Why am I being brought into this again?! What do I have more to say on?!

I've intentionally steered clear of any debate on Man United because I've outlined my dislike for them enough times before - and as you fully well know it's for the same reasons as the likes of clapham_gull and BoF. Fortunately for me they have a better grasp of English language than I do and are able to put it into context much better than I am as they have greater knowledge on the subject (I suspect the have greater knowledge than you on it as well - no intended disrespect). I just get pissed off at you making needless snide comments and end up losing track of what I'm trying to explain.

You seem to have this idea that I said Man United solely destroyed English football. I have never, ever said that. I have said they partially contributed to parts of the downfall (in my OPINION) of our game. They are two very different things. I may have made some reckless comments on the subject in the past as a naïve teenager but the underlining idea of my posts have remained the same, even if it was not expressed efficiently. (something I'm sure you can empathise with having posted on here as a youngster.)

Can you please just accept that some people DO have some kind of rationale behind their dislike - even if you don't agree with it - and let it go without the need to make sarcastic comments about said people. It is just tiresome now and I’m not sure why you continue to pick me out. Probably because you feel better equipped against someone younger and rash like me, rather than BoF or clapham_gull. I don’t have a problem with you, so please can you drop what appears to be your problem with me, cause I really need to get down and do some revision for my A2’s and could do without you dragging me into another debate. (again something I'm sure you can empathise with)


*note: I’ve managed to avoid resorting to childish name-calling

 

[Laughing Gravy]

The Glazers are a group of dispicable parasites who are slowly sucking the life out of that club, sending them on a downward spiral of debt and mediocrity.



Lovely stuff.