[News] Nigel Farage and Reform

[Weststander]

Dubai's tax gets mentioned on social media posts regularly and it's the home of a couple of prominent Reform fans. I was there a few weeks ago and there are a few other things about it that could be relevant to this thread.

First and foremost, the vast majority of people there are immigrants, around 80%. And there's a very broad mix of people and cultures. Westerners can drink and go to the beach - within reason. But it is baseline Islamic. Immigration workers at the airport don't wear a uniform as such and hand you a sim card for the duration of your stay. From then on the whole immigration system works on face recognition and you don't need to see a human. But, of course, that's not the result of liberal democracy. It's a federal authoritarian monarchy with a terrible record on human rights. Basically Singapore in the Middle East. And the facial recognition, while convenient, is also Orwellian.

When I was going @hart's shirt was good enough to provide me with extensive and excellent visitor info, which was immensely kind and I really liked the place. I like particularly how people rub along no matter where they're from. But I wouldn't want to get on the wrong side of the government.

My suspicion is, with Reform, that they quite fancy the authoritarian control and tax position but I think achieving it by having 80% of the population as immigrants would give most of their voters a coronary.

There are two entirely differing worlds for foreigners settling there.

"I Already Bought You"

This 79-page report documents how the UAE’s visa sponsorship system, known as kafala, and the lack of labor law protections leave migrant domestic workers exposed to abuse. Domestic workers, most from Asia and Africa, cannot move to a new job before their contracts end without the employer’s...

www.hrw.org

 

[rogersix]

We have 1.77milliom claiming unemployment benefits (I'm not too clued up on the benefits system) - I'd like to hope some of them could be convinced (maybe if the jobs paid more money?) to work.

They don't seem very keen, that may present a problem in the future

 

[TomandJerry]

Check out the greens and socialists, they are usually keen on not supporting such things.

Will do

 

[nicko31]

Interesting the way Farage is trying to make a big thing about the NI on the Indian trade deal, an arrangement that already exists with some 50 other countries including USA and Canada.

Suffice to say he is very quiet on the potential £5B increase to GDP, a drop in the ocean compared to the 5% hit to our economy from Brexit. He's clever enough to realise any mention of this will remind us of what he did to the UK.

But he's there to fool the gullible and it will work on some. A few an year have clear had their brains boiled, refusing to access reliable sources of information.

 

[Fritz the Cat]

Idiots.

You are correct. Trying to out Farage Farage is not the path that the Labour Party should be following. Some of these back benchers are panicking bedwetters. Labour needs to get inflation and interest rates down, get signs of real growth in the economy and some tangible improvement in the NHS.

 

[nicko31]

You are correct. Trying to out Farage Farage is not the path that the Labour Party should be following. Some of these back benchers are panicking bedwetters. Labour needs to get inflation and interest rates down, get signs of real growth in the economy and some tangible improvement in the NHS.

If Labour try to out Farage Farage they will lose the next election, for every voter they don't lose to Reform they will lose 3 to the LD and Greens.

Need to stay the course and not get too distracted by the noise, 4 years to an election FFS. Legal immigration is falling and with French co-operation so should boat numbers. The economic situation is challenging for most countries right now

Farage has got nothing new to offer, Reform is just pretending to be some thing different from UKIP, its not

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Seemingly, Darren Grimes' mother and brother were paper candidates for Durham, but got themselves elected, much to their horror.
Jackie Teasdale (mother)appears to be a Tommy supporter so Farage won't be happy.

 

[abc]

Seriously?
Which of these human rights do you object to?

European Convention on Human Rights (simplified version) - Manual for Human Rights Education with Young people - www.coe.int

coe.int

Why do we need a European Court of human Rights rather than a British one? Genuine question as I have no idea why and to me it doesn't matter provided humans rights are respected, but is the issue (for some) the European nature of the ECHR and therefore if we had a BCHR with exactly the same remit and rights, would the arguments go away?

 

[abc]

The problem is that to get people to work in areas they don't want to you need to offer decent money and decent security.

In the farming industry this is rubbish. Salaries are generally good but the work is harder compared to in many industries and you cant WFH. If there is an issue with the level of wages then it will be related to ability pay given the low profitability of farms largely because of the intense price pressure from supermarkets. This work for consumers of course but also for the multiples that report huge annual profits.

There is also a seasonal issue. Veg farmers, for example, need a very large workforce for c 4 months of the year but only a very small number out of season. The only affordable and practical solution is seasonal/temporary labour. The pay can be extremely good but it is by its nature also extremely hardwork and can be in inclement weather. Neither appeals to 99% of our so called unemployed workforce.

 

[nicko31]

Why do we need a European Court of human Rights rather than a British one? Genuine question as I have no idea why and to me it doesn't matter provided humans rights are respected, but is the issue (for some) the European nature of the ECHR and therefore if we had a BCHR with exactly the same remit and rights, would the arguments go away?

Indeed Russia and Belarus get away without it and they're doing great.

And who needs the Good Friday agreement and an FTA with the EU anyway? We've got India now, gonna buy shit loads of Scotch

 

[WATFORD zero]

Seemingly, Darren Grimes' mother and brother were paper candidates for Durham, but got themselves elected, much to their horror.
Jackie Teasdale (mother)appears to be a Tommy supporter so Farage won't be happy.

I'd just file them alongside these other Reform councillors

Chorley rural west - Mark Wade "The Queen spent a long time scrounging" Investigation ongoing
Hodent - Donna Edmonds "defecting from Reform" Suspended and resigned
Aylesbury East - Miriam Thomas - "offensive and racist Facebook posts" Suspended
Banbury Hardwick - Stephen Hartley "Jimmy Saville was a working class hero" Suspended

It's been a busy few days. Just have to be thankful that Reform have 'tightened up' their vetting procedures

 

[BadFish]

In the farming industry this is rubbish. Salaries are generally good but the work is harder compared to in many industries and you cant WFH. If there is an issue with the level of wages then it will be related to ability pay given the low profitability of farms largely because of the intense price pressure from supermarkets. This work for consumers of course but also for the multiples that report huge annual profits.

There is also a seasonal issue. Veg farmers, for example, need a very large workforce for c 4 months of the year but only a very small number out of season. The only affordable and practical solution is seasonal/temporary labour. The pay can be extremely good but it is by its nature also extremely hardwork and can be in inclement weather. Neither appeals to 99% of our so called unemployed workforce.

Is your first paragraph contradicting itself. Are the wages low or not?

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Why do we need a European Court of human Rights rather than a British one? Genuine question as I have no idea why and to me it doesn't matter provided humans rights are respected, but is the issue (for some) the European nature of the ECHR and therefore if we had a BCHR with exactly the same remit and rights, would the arguments go away?

No, they wouldn't. We have a Supreme Court in this country and people object to their findings too.

 

[Berty23]

In the farming industry this is rubbish. Salaries are generally good but the work is harder compared to in many industries and you cant WFH. If there is an issue with the level of wages then it will be related to ability pay given the low profitability of farms largely because of the intense price pressure from supermarkets. This work for consumers of course but also for the multiples that report huge annual profits.

There is also a seasonal issue. Veg farmers, for example, need a very large workforce for c 4 months of the year but only a very small number out of season. The only affordable and practical solution is seasonal/temporary labour. The pay can be extremely good but it is by its nature also extremely hardwork and can be in inclement weather. Neither appeals to 99% of our so called unemployed workforce.

Yep. My cousin used to get gang masters in to do the crops. Post Brexit he lost that workforce so went combinable only.

 

[abc]

Is your first paragraph contradicting itself. Are the wages low or not?

Mmmm…. Yes and no?! I think I’m trying to say they are probably higher than many might think but given the type of work and hours worked, they really should be much higher. There is not a farmer or farm worker I have come across that does not work crazy hours in all conditions and with utter dedication. They deserve a lot more but the income to pay more just isn’t there.

 

[TomandJerry]

Mmmm…. Yes and no?! I think I’m trying to say they are probably higher than many might think but given the type of work and hours worked, they really should be much higher. There is not a farmer or farm worker I have come across that does not work crazy hours in all conditions and with utter dedication. They deserve a lot more but the income to pay more just isn’t there.

I know a guy who plucks turkeys two/three week's at a time in December, hard graft doing the dirty business. Paid handsomely.