MP stabbed in Yorkshire. ***RIP Jo Cox***

[spring hall convert]

Whilst the Nigel Farage video does remove the context within he said it, he did definitely say it. Don't you feel that as a massive figure in this debate he has an obligation to avoid that kind of inflammatory language? Whether he intended to or not, by painting it as an inevitability (which it completely isn't) he legitimises that response.

And this is what people are taking about. We have an environment where both sides are making suppositions and passing them off as fact allied to a press massively overemphasizing the importance of this decision. It's not 'being political' to point this out. It's acknowledging circumstances that clearly could be an influence.

The referendum has just made an already bad situation worse.

 

[spring hall convert]

You need to get a grip... one nutcase kills an MP with strong pro refugee focus in her work... then we see a wave of subtle, and not so subtle links to the Leave campaign. He was a racist, he was local, he was a lunatic, he was a dangerous individual.... not a representative of the Leave supporters.... that's a plain insult.

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SOME is in capitals. I don't think he could have gone much more out of his way to emphasize this.

 

[sydney]

i am eligible to vote , however i won't as i don't live and work in the U.K any more .......there are so many pros and cons to be considered that frankly i think it makes most peoples brains hurt , there can be no doubt that a major concern is the possible massive influx of eastern euro's and turks into the country along with the tens of thousands who are currently waiting at calais, if this does happen it will basically change the country forever and will be virtually irreversible.............that is what has a lot of people scared.....is this not understandable....??

on the other hand the threat of being isolated by the u.s and europe is surely equally worrying........my personal opinion is that we are screwed whatever we do , and i can understand that some people who are already close to their whits end may be pushed over the edge by the constant , endless avalanche of propaganda from both sides.

 

[whitelion]

Tributes in Parliament currently being made.

 

[spring hall convert]

Well, well, well

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news...-mair-to-face-judge-under-terrorism-protocols

"Mair’s lawyer, Keith Allen, said his client was making no application for bail. The judge, Mr Justice Sweeney, remanded Mair in custody until Thursday this week. Then Mair will appear before another judge, Mr Justice Saunders, for a pre-trial hearing under terrorism-related protocols."

Anyone know what this actually means?

 

[Wrong-Direction]

i am eligible to vote , however i won't as i don't live and work in the U.K any more .......there are so many pros and cons to be considered that frankly i think it makes most peoples brains hurt , there can be no doubt that a major concern is the possible massive influx of eastern euro's and turks into the country along with the tens of thousands who are currently waiting at calais, if this does happen it will basically change the country forever and will be virtually irreversible.............that is what has a lot of people scared.....is this not understandable....??

on the other hand the threat of being isolated by the u.s and europe is surely equally worrying........my personal opinion is that we are screwed whatever we do , and i can understand that some people who are already close to their whits end may be pushed over the edge by the constant , endless avalanche of propaganda from both sides.

I've been trying to tell people this for months!

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[Tom Hark Preston Park]

The sad and beautiful irony is that the freak who murdered Jo Cox has done more than any amount of debating and campaigning could ever do to make up the minds of the undecided.

 

[hans kraay fan club]

there can be no doubt that a major concern is the possible massive influx of eastern euro's and turks into the country along with the tens of thousands who are currently waiting at calais, if this does happen it will basically change the country forever and will be virtually irreversible.............that is what has a lot of people scared.....is this not understandable....??

It is absolutely an understandable concern. However, its a misplaced concern:

The prospect of Turkey joining the EU within the next 20 years is extremely remote. The suggestion that there are '70 million Turks' about to arrive on our shores, is probably the single most blatant lie told by either side during the entire campaign. The Leave campaign were censured for spreading it, I believe.

The migrants at Calais are a different issue altogether, in that they are in NO way, an EU issue at all. They are migrants / refugees (their exact status is a whole other argument) from outside the EU seeking to enter the UK. Two things here: 1. Our responsibilities to accept a number of refugees is set down by international law / protocol - this would be absolutely unchanged by the IN/OUT vote. 2. It is only due to our good relationship with our EU partner, France, that these camps are in Calais at all, and not in Dover. If we leave, and lose the arrangement that allows OUR border posts on their soil, then what incentive do the French have for continuing to tolerate this very inconvenient and unpopular state of affairs?

 

[drew]

Well, well, well

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news...-mair-to-face-judge-under-terrorism-protocols

"Mair’s lawyer, Keith Allen, said his client was making no application for bail. The judge, Mr Justice Sweeney, remanded Mair in custody until Thursday this week. Then Mair will appear before another judge, Mr Justice Saunders, for a pre-trial hearing under terrorism-related protocols."

Anyone know what this actually means?

Well the first part is clear. He hasn't requested to be let out of jail until the trial. With regard to pre-trial hearing, I presume that is going to go into detail as to how the trial is going to be conducted, ie whether there could be reporting restrictions, where the trial will be held etc etc.

https://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/procedure-rules/civil/rules/pd_pre-action_conduct

 

[spring hall convert]

Well the first part is clear. He hasn't requested to be let out of jail until the trial. With regard to pre-trial hearing, I presume that is going to go into detail as to how the trial is going to be conducted, ie whether there could be reporting restrictions, where the trial will be held etc etc.

https://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/procedure-rules/civil/rules/pd_pre-action_conduct

Thanks, I was especially interested in the 'terrorism-related protocols' bit.

 

[heathgate]

SOME is in capitals. I don't think he could have gone much more out of his way to emphasize this.

Ok... so using that logic, there are for certain SOME in the Remain campaign support pool, that fit this profile too.

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[alfredmizen]

The first wave of Asians came here in the 50s, so the third generation will just be young children now. I lived in a Asian area in Yorkshire, & could see slight cultural changes happening.
Don't assume all Asian men are groomers, just as all Sussex men aren't paedophiles despite recent convictions in Lewes Crown Court.
Generalisations like that breed racial hatred.

Are you serious ?? Have you got any clue whatsoever about Pakistani Birth and marriage patterns ?

 

[The Albion Roar]

It is absolutely an understandable concern. However, its a misplaced concern:

The prospect of Turkey joining the EU within the next 20 years is extremely remote. The suggestion that there are '70 million Turks' about to arrive on our shores, is probably the single most blatant lie told by either side during the entire campaign. The Leave campaign were censured for spreading it, I believe.

The migrants at Calais are a different issue altogether, in that they are in NO way, an EU issue at all. They are migrants / refugees (their exact status is a whole other argument) from outside the EU seeking to enter the UK. Two things here: 1. Our responsibilities to accept a number of refugees is set down by international law / protocol - this would be absolutely unchanged by the IN/OUT vote. 2. It is only due to our good relationship with our EU partner, France, that these camps are in Calais at all, and not in Dover. If we leave, and lose the arrangement that allows OUR border posts on their soil, then what incentive do the French have for continuing to tolerate this very inconvenient and unpopular state of affairs?

This particular agreement is a bi-lateral agreement, separate from the EU.

I'm sure that a good, ongoing relationship with France has enabled this agreement to be in place, it doesn't necessarily follow that the agreement will be torn up if the UK eventually leaves the EU, though as you say, their tolerance will be tested to the limit.

 

[spring hall convert]

Ok... so using that logic, there are for certain SOME in the Remain campaign support pool, that fit this profile too.

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And I guess to speculate as to the percentage in each camp would be 'political.'

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

The sad and beautiful irony is that the freak who murdered Jo Cox has done more than any amount of debating and campaigning could ever do to make up the minds of the undecided.

I wish it weren't the case, because this is an isolated act of a madman and does not have any relevance to the genuine and legitimate opinion of Brexit supporters. But judging by the reports of a shift back in the polls, perhaps you are right.

However, as a scientists I have to say that when a single variable is measured repeatedly over time it is not logically possible to conclude anything about the reasons for shifts up and down. Unless the phenomenonon is repeated (e.g., the increase in sudden cardiac deaths - heart attacks - recorded every night that Saddam repeated his launch of scuds into Israel, with no such increase on other nights - I have the data somewhere in case the usual suspects ask me for it). Nobody in their right mind would hope for a repetition of this particular experiment, it goes without saying.

Quite separately, (I emphasize that before some idiot again quotes me out of context 'for Brexit') I hate all this and can't wait for the vote to be over. People on both sides have acted disgracefully. Damn Cameron's eyes for selling his soul to win the last election by agreeing to a referendum he never wanted nor indeed ever expected to have to hold.

 

[spring hall convert]

"Medical evidence ‘not an issue’ in MP Jo Cox murder trial"

"His case is being handled under the “terrorism protocol” as part of a terror list before Mr Justice Saunders. He is due to appear at the Old Bailey on October 4 for a plea hearing and will stand trial in November."

http://www.spenboroughguardian.co.u...-an-issue-in-mp-jo-cox-murder-trial-1-8133481