[Albion] Mercurial, majestic, magnificent Mitoma [20/10/23: New deal signed]

[Baldseagull]

He didn't make the squad for Japan's upcoming WC qualifiers against Saudi Arabia and Australia......

https://www.france24.com/en/live-news/20210928-japan-name-squad-for-world-cup-qualifiers

If we're waiting on him getting enough Japan caps to qualify for a work permit it may be a while.

I believe he will qualify for a work permit if he plays 40% or more of the league minutes USG play.

 

[Wellesley]

Looks great but I think he needs to spend a bit of time in the gym to be ready for the Premier League. Trossard has transformed himself so hopefully he can do the same.

 

[Mental Lental]

I believe he will qualify for a work permit if he plays 40% or more of the league minutes USG play.

Dunno if I've got this right but here goes....

https://resources.premierleague.com...2da4467/PL_2021_22_Handbook_DIGITAL_23.09.pdf

So he needs 15 points. Belgian top tier is band 2. Table 6 (p. 629) seems to say a player gets 10 points just for 1 appearance in band 2. So he gets 10 points for 1 appearance for USG. Then he needs 5 more points. Table 2 (p.627) says that if he plays over 40% of games in the 12 months before the application he gets 5 more points. So if we want him to play for us NEXT season he should easily make that. If he gets more Japan caps and USG finish high in the league he'll get even more I guess. But it seems that the earliest we'll be seeing him in a Brighton shirt would be the start of next season.

Reading up on this it actually looks like it's now EASIER to sign non-EU players than it was before Brexit. Have we found a Brexit benefit at last?

 

[schmunk]

Reading up on this it actually looks like it's now EASIER to sign non-EU players than it was before Brexit. Have we found a Brexit benefit at last?

Only if they can drive petrol tankers after training and spend their summer breaks picking fruit.

 

[Change at Barnham]

Reading up on this it actually looks like it's now EASIER to sign non-EU players than it was before Brexit. Have we found a Brexit benefit at last?

I believe that is why we have increased our investment in scouting and recruitment in South America.

 

[Joey Jo Jo Jr. Shabadoo]

Dunno if I've got this right but here goes....

https://resources.premierleague.com...2da4467/PL_2021_22_Handbook_DIGITAL_23.09.pdf

So he needs 15 points. Belgian top tier is band 2. Table 6 (p. 629) seems to say a player gets 10 points just for 1 appearance in band 2. So he gets 10 points for 1 appearance for USG. Then he needs 5 more points. Table 2 (p.627) says that if he plays over 40% of games in the 12 months before the application he gets 5 more points. So if we want him to play for us NEXT season he should easily make that. If he gets more Japan caps and USG finish high in the league he'll get even more I guess. But it seems that the earliest we'll be seeing him in a Brighton shirt would be the start of next season.

Reading up on this it actually looks like it's now EASIER to sign non-EU players than it was before Brexit. Have we found a Brexit benefit at last?

You are totally correct, apart from it's 40% of minutes (including injury time) rather than 40% of games. He can also pick up points depending on how well USG do in the league and domestic cup in Belgium this season.

I made the following post where I broke down how Kjell Scherpen should qualify for a work permit (and did) before we signed him.

https://www.northstandchat.com/show...-16-07-2021)&p=9926092&viewfull=1#post9926092

The criteria is the same except that Mitoma won't get any points for appearing in European competition. At the moment he's also only made 4 sub appearances which equate to just over 50 mins of playing time (including injury time) which is about 8% of playing time (he won't be penalised for games missed before he signed for them as he wasn't avaliable, he also won't be penalised if he was injured and missed games at any point of the season), so he'll need to start games to get to the 40% of mins required. The key for him getting the work permit could be USG having a very good season and qualifying for one of the European competitions.

 

[Super Steve Earle]

He is quality. Watching Kawasaki Frontale for the last few years has been very exciting and he played a huge part in that, often playing in a front three with Leandro Damiao and Kobayashi (not the Celtic one). Was always perfect lunch time football when no other league was playing. Lots of Japanese players did well in Europe over the years and I think Mitoma will be no exception to that.

That said, will he be good enough for the Premier League? Thats too early to tell. But I'm quite sure the club will at least get back the £2.5-3m it spent on him.

That front three - brilliant. Not to mention inventing the Kobayashi Maneuvre while still playing.

 

[Audax]

Tau played for both Club Brugge and Anderlecht in the Belgian Pro League.

And from memory he wasn't exactly tearing up trees for either - he looked decent, but not PL quality as an answer to our striker troubles. Mitoma's got a long way to go yet. Writing him off after just a handful (relatively) of minutes because a completely different player didn't make it as a Brighton player is nonsensical.

 

[amexer]

He didn't make the squad for Japan's upcoming WC qualifiers against Saudi Arabia and Australia......

https://www.france24.com/en/live-news/20210928-japan-name-squad-for-world-cup-qualifiers

If we're waiting on him getting enough Japan caps to qualify for a work permit it may be a while.

Why didnt he make Japan squad. ? Thought he was there star player

 

[Nobby Cybergoat]

And from memory he wasn't exactly tearing up trees for either - he looked decent, but not PL quality as an answer to our striker troubles. Mitoma's got a long way to go yet. Writing him off after just a handful (relatively) of minutes because a completely different player didn't make it as a Brighton player is nonsensical.

Agree. The club should and do look at much more than what league the player comes from.

Though if we're looking at getting the fella in and around the first team next season, you'd like to think he can get in the Japan squad (though I've no idea if this non selection was due to quarantine protocols, injury or just plain old not picked) and that he can play more minutes for USG than he doesn't.

If neither of those are true than it's irrelevant whether he qualifies as a work permit or not as he's not likely to help our first team squad and I guess we'll be looking to move him on for a small profit.

 

[GT49er]

Can somebody enlighten me - is this work permit and points requirement a UK Government ruling, or is it something imposed by the football authorities (presumably the PL or the FA - I can't see how UEFA and FIFA would have different rules for England and Belgium)?

 

[nwgull]

Can somebody enlighten me - is this work permit and points requirement a UK Government ruling, or is it something imposed by the football authorities (presumably the PL or the FA - I can't see how UEFA and FIFA would have different rules for England and Belgium)?

Ultimately it’s the U.K. government. Although it’s up to the FA as the sport’s governing body to endorse the application as an elite level sportsperson. I guess they do this via the aforementioned points system.

 

[Joey Jo Jo Jr. Shabadoo]

Why didnt he make Japan squad. ? Thought he was there star player

He's never made the Japan squad. He's only played at U21 level (and U23's at this years Olympics)

Can somebody enlighten me - is this work permit and points requirement a UK Government ruling, or is it something imposed by the football authorities (presumably the PL or the FA - I can't see how UEFA and FIFA would have different rules for England and Belgium)?

The criteria for a player qualifying for a work permit is set by each countries Football Association (working with their government), the English FA have refreshed their criteria following us leaving the European Union. It's easier now to sign players from South American countries as competitions like the Copa Sudamericana now carry the same weight for points as their European equivalent.

The current rules can be found here as part of the Premier League handbook

https://resources.premierleague.com...2da4467/PL_2021_22_Handbook_DIGITAL_23.09.pdf

A document focusing on just the requirements for a work permit is available from here.

https://www.thefa.com/football-rules-governance/policies/player-registration/points-based-system

 

[Mental Lental]

Why didnt he make Japan squad. ? Thought he was there star player

Not even had a full cap yet. I suspect regular starts for USG will get him there though. Nearly all Japan's midfielders play in Europe at similar level or higher so there's actually quite a lot of competition. He isn't a shoe in yet.

 

[Baldseagull]

Dunno if I've got this right but here goes....

https://resources.premierleague.com...2da4467/PL_2021_22_Handbook_DIGITAL_23.09.pdf

So he needs 15 points. Belgian top tier is band 2. Table 6 (p. 629) seems to say a player gets 10 points just for 1 appearance in band 2. So he gets 10 points for 1 appearance for USG. Then he needs 5 more points. Table 2 (p.627) says that if he plays over 40% of games in the 12 months before the application he gets 5 more points. So if we want him to play for us NEXT season he should easily make that. If he gets more Japan caps and USG finish high in the league he'll get even more I guess. But it seems that the earliest we'll be seeing him in a Brighton shirt would be the start of next season.

Reading up on this it actually looks like it's now EASIER to sign non-EU players than it was before Brexit. Have we found a Brexit benefit at last?

Yes, it is easier to sign players direct from some South American clubs, Copa Libertadores is classed as a tier 1 competition, Copa Sudamerica tier 2, and the Brazilian and Argentine top divisions are classsed as tier 3, but as we are doing with Mitoma, outside of those, we need a European League to take him, to get him games in a tier 1 or 2 league first, so we are reliant on the Visa system for non EU footballers in an EU country, to get them up to the points, unless they are a regular international in a well ranked national side.

However, there are downsides too on player recruitment, EU and especially young EU players are now not so straightforward, Robert Sanchez for example, could not have come here when he did, if the current rules were in place at the time.

The top 6 clubs will benefit most I reckon, as mostly they are looking at players already playing to a high standard, and shouldn't be restricted on the type of signing they tend to make of EU players. But for clubs like us that need to develop younger players, I think it is tougher, you could argue that we and others will end up bringing more English lads into the academy, and overall that may be good for the National game, just not so good for the club. But you could also argue that our English lads will not be playing with and against players of such high quality as they could have been in the Academies, and English elite youngsters don't develop as well as they otherwise might have.

 

[GT49er]

Ultimately it’s the U.K. government. Although it’s up to the FA as the sport’s governing body to endorse the application as an elite level sportsperson. I guess they do this via the aforementioned points system.

So basically the Government says, OK, elite sportsmen can come in and work here, and it's left to the FA to define what counts as an elite sportsman, and decide what hoops have to be jumped through to qualify.

 

[nwgull]

Yes, it is easier to sign players direct from some South American clubs, Copa Libertadores is classed as a tier 1 competition, Copa Sudamerica tier 2, and the Brazilian and Argentine top divisions are classsed as tier 3, but as we are doing with Mitoma, outside of those, we need a European League to take him, to get him games in a tier 1 or 2 league first, so we are reliant on the Visa system for non EU footballers in an EU country, to get them up to the points, unless they are a regular international in a well ranked national side.

However, there are downsides too on player recruitment, EU and especially young EU players are now not so straightforward, Robert Sanchez for example, could not have come here when he did, if the current rules were in place at the time.

The top 6 clubs will benefit most I reckon, as mostly they are looking at players already playing to a high standard, and shouldn't be restricted on the type of signing they tend to make of EU players. But for clubs like us that need to develop younger players, I think it is tougher, you could argue that we and others will end up bringing more English lads into the academy, and overall that may be good for the National game, just not so good for the club. But you could also argue that our English lads will not be playing with and against players of such high quality as they could have been in the Academies, and English elite youngsters don't develop as well as they otherwise might have.

I’m not sure that the easing of work-permit points requirements will make much difference to the big clubs. Most of the non-EU players that they signed in the past were established full internationals for sufficiently high ranking nations anyway. It probably benefits clubs like us that are taking on young players for development the most, particularly when we have a club in a country with an even lower bar on work permits to send them to first.

As for downsides, you’re right, there have been a load of EU players at BHA over the last 20 years that possibly wouldn’t have qualified to work in the U.K. under the new system: Kuipers, Calderon, Orlandi, Ulloa, Spanish Dave and probably a load more.

 

[nwgull]

So basically the Government says, OK, elite sportsmen can come in and work here, and it's left to the FA to define what counts as an elite sportsman, and decide what hoops have to be jumped through to qualify.

There are a couple of other criteria to be met, but yes, the decision on whether or not a pro sportsperson is sufficiently talented to have a positive effect on the standard of that sport in the U.K. is left up to the sport’s respective governing body.

 

[Baldseagull]

I’m not sure that the easing of work-permit points requirements will make much difference to the big clubs. Most of the non-EU players that they signed in the past were established full internationals for sufficiently high ranking nations anyway. It probably benefits clubs like us that are taking on young players for development the most, particularly when we have a club in a country with an even lower bar on work permits to send them to first.

As for downsides, you’re right, there have been a load of EU players at BHA over the last 20 years that possibly wouldn’t have qualified to work in the U.K. under the new system: Kuipers, Calderon, Orlandi, Ulloa, Spanish Dave and probably a load more.

That might be because they couldn't sign anyone that wasn't an EU citizen or a regular full international. Pablo Mari, a Spaniard that has never had a Spain Cap is at Arsenal, because he qualified under EU freedom of movement to come to England, but he was playing in Brasil. If he had been a Brazilian playing in that league, he would not have been able to come at that time, but would be eligble on todays rules which give weight to the Brazilian League that it did not previously.

 

[warmleyseagull]

Only if they can drive petrol tankers after training and spend their summer breaks picking fruit.

Not quite right; they have to drive for a top 4 company and make at least 30 appearances lasting not less than 60% of driving time; fruit picking only counts if they wear a cap from their home country and manage to chuck an apple in the basket from 10 metres.