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[Football] Mason Holgate.







Brovion

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Jul 6, 2003
19,363
Oh wow! Are you that bloke I heard down the pub, expounding on how the Arabs traded slaves?
I don't want to join in (so I'm going to post this and leave it), but I 'sort of' see where he's coming from. When I first heard about this I immediately assumed it was white people who were guilty as, let's face it, that's where nearly all the racism comes from in this country. However in this instance it seems that white people were not the culprits (or certainly not the main ones). Slapped wrist for me for making the assumption, and a reminder that racism is not just a 'white' problem.
 


Harry Wilson's tackle

Harry Wilson's Tackle
NSC Patron
Oct 8, 2003
49,927
Faversham
We can’t know for sure where it comes from. Just because a profile appears to look a certain way I.e in this case Asian, you don’t know it really is, it’s not hard to write in another language, or use a misleading profile picture. VPN’s can mask location. Plenty of Asian people reside in the UK as well.

I’m only saying this because sometimes you see people saying that as though there aren’t racists in the UK and it’s the problem of other countries being inflicted upon us, when I don’t think it’s true at all. (Not that I think you were saying that).
I seem to recall that the death threatener has be caught and punished. He was located in Singapore. His own ethnicity is irrelevant, nor can it be assumed. The population there is:

74% Chinese
13% Malay
9% Indian
3% other (Brits and Aussies in the main)
 




drew

Drew
Oct 3, 2006
23,048
Burgess Hill
I think it is fair to expect more than just a private apology (and the in-club ones) in sport at this level. It's a bad example to set to say that just apologising to your team and (possibly) a private apology is acceptable for a professional sportsperson.
Well we'll have to agree to disagree.
 






Eric the meek

Fiveways Wilf
NSC Patron
Aug 24, 2020
5,278
So am I right in thinking you believe this is being raised by Holgate/Sheffield to try and reduce his punishment? Personally, I don't see this as conflating the issues at all. Wilder has already said that Holgate has to take responsibility for his actions and he seemed to accept in this day and age, it is a sending off offence. The ban will be based on the ref's report, not some panel. He's got a three game ban.

What do you think is worse, the tackle or the racism?
I thought my comment was quite clear.

But you seem to be contradicting yourself. Elsewhere, you say that racism is an unacceptable standalone issue, which I agree with, but here you are asking me 'what do you think is worse, the tackle or the racism?'. By comparing them, you are conflating them. To repeat, they are two separate things. They cannot be compared.
 


Littlemo

Well-known member
Aug 25, 2022
1,205
I seem to recall that the death threatener has be caught and punished. He was located in Singapore. His own ethnicity is irrelevant, nor can it be assumed. The population there is:

74% Chinese
13% Malay
9% Indian
3% other (Brits and Aussies in the main)
Ahh I’d missed that they’d caught him.

I guess that my point agrees with yours, you can’t really assume anything about the person behind an internet profile.
 




ConfusedGloryHunter

He/him/his/that muppet
Jul 6, 2011
2,045
All those defending racism because the victim attempted to maim someone in a football match need to take a look at themselves.

There is no excuse for racism. This guy should be vilified for his actions not for his ancestry.
 


smillie's garden

Am I evil?
Aug 11, 2003
2,595
I don't want to join in (so I'm going to post this and leave it), but I 'sort of' see where he's coming from. When I first heard about this I immediately assumed it was white people who were guilty as, let's face it, that's where nearly all the racism comes from in this country. However in this instance it seems that white people were not the culprits (or certainly not the main ones). Slapped wrist for me for making the assumption, and a reminder that racism is not just a 'white' problem.
Which poster do you "sort of" understand? The one who stereotypes 50% of the world's population, or the one who defends that poster?
 


Nobby Cybergoat

Well-known member
Jul 19, 2021
6,966
Mason Holgate should be receiving the support of our, club and our fans and the football community for the abuse he has suffered.

I find all this "asians are racist", "the abuse was from outside the UK" stuff embarrassing and unnecessary. Racism must have unequivocally called out wherever it comes from and club loyalties must be completely set aside. I hope the police are now involved and doing what they can.
 




Eric the meek

Fiveways Wilf
NSC Patron
Aug 24, 2020
5,278
Which poster do you "sort of" understand? The one who stereotypes 50% of the world's population, or the one who defends that poster?
OK, I'm a self-confessed statistics geek, but I've googled 'how many Asians are there in the world'. This is the result.

'The current population of Asia is 4,773,513,754 as of Tuesday, February 20, 2024, based on the latest United Nations estimates. Asia population is equivalent to 59.22% of the total world population.'
 


Commander

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Apr 28, 2004
12,887
London
“Asians are notoriously racist”.

I don’t think there’s a larger human stereotype or generalization than that possible.
'Humans' are notoriously racist" would be.

It would also be true.

I think what @NorthstandRacoon was trying to say, was that there are large parts of Asia that are nowhere near as multi-cultural as the UK, and where racism towards black people is more prevalent than it is here. I would find it difficult to argue with that, personally.

But let's not miss an opportunity to cry RACIST! at somebody who was actually trying to condemn racism, and used his words clumsily eh? BURN HIM! BAN HIM!
 


smillie's garden

Am I evil?
Aug 11, 2003
2,595
OK, I'm a self-confessed statistics geek, but I've googled 'how many Asians are there in the world'. This is the result.

'The current population of Asia is 4,773,513,754 as of Tuesday, February 20, 2024, based on the latest United Nations estimates. Asia population is equivalent to 59.22% of the total world population.'
Thank you for that clarification.
 




Nobby Cybergoat

Well-known member
Jul 19, 2021
6,966
It amazes me people have this belief about “winning the ball”….it’s irrelevant and has absolutely nothing to do with the laws regarding fouls.
I have this belief about winning the ball. But it goes out of the window for serious foul play, like Holgate on Mitoma or if excessive force has been used.
If a referee is considering giving an ordinary foul winning the ball is the main factor they will consider. The best example I can think of is an instance where a goalie has come off his line, fallen on the ball and the onrushing striker collides and goes over him. No foul, play on, I think we can agree. But had the striker got there first and tapped it round him, then then goes over the goalie, foul is given.

It may not say it in the laws but years of watching football tells me that's how refs interpret what a foul is. What I think you are referring to is when refs are adjudicating on serious foul play. But that's a different thing.
 


atomised

Well-known member
Mar 21, 2013
5,111
We can’t know for sure where it comes from. Just because a profile appears to look a certain way I.e in this case Asian, you don’t know it really is, it’s not hard to write in another language, or use a misleading profile picture. VPN’s can mask location. Plenty of Asian people reside in the UK as well.

I’m only saying this because sometimes you see people saying that as though there aren’t racists in the UK and it’s the problem of other countries being inflicted upon us, when I don’t think it’s true at all. (Not that I think you were saying that).
I thought it was confirmed at the time by police that much of it came from overseas
 


Milano

Well-known member
Aug 15, 2012
3,346
Sussex but not by the sea
Racism is the lowest form of human nature and our club and fanbase need to support Holgate.

A side effect of this is that now Holgate can deflect away from what should be a 6 game ban IMO. So well done to the braindead racist keyboard warrior.
 


Greg Bobkin

Silver Seagull
May 22, 2012
14,841
He's probably not met them all I admit, but crying out loud he's allowed an opinion. It's usually assumed that it's the white bloke that has done the dirty deed.
That's not written as an opinion, though. And, if it is, it's clearly wrong.
 




Commander

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Apr 28, 2004
12,887
London
Racism is the lowest form of human nature and our club and fanbase need to support Holgate.

A side effect of this is that now Holgate can deflect away from what should be a 6 game ban IMO. So well done to the braindead racist keyboard warrior.
Bullshit do we. He deliberately tried to injure one of our players. I don't see how him getting racist abuse from overseas has anything to do with us. Had it come from our actual fanbase, then that would be a different story, but it didn't.

He won't be getting any 'support' from me, whatever that means.
 




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