Labour

[Mellor 3 Ward 4]

I think it should bother you - I'm just rejoicing that someone (or in this case over half a million someones) have just voted to upset the cosy Westminster apple-cart. Bring it on. Respect to all those that upset the apple cart by voting UKIP and SNP too - for too long we've just had two rival bunches of fat cats in Parliament.

Just to get the figures right, Corbyn got 251,417 votes.

Turnout for the leadership vote was 76.3% of the 554,272 eligible members, with 207 spoilt ballots.

 

[Bladders]

And the Diane Abbott situation, espousing one thing for the people and doing another for her son?

Diane Abbot is one of the biggest jokes of a politician there is, the fact she's now in the shadow cabinet is extremely worrying.

I can only presume she was last on the list of women Jezza wanted to make up his 'right on' shadow cabinet.

 

[GT49er]

I get the lack of repsect for politicians, they have not excelled for a while. But wanting to damn the country with destructive economic and social policies isnt going to help society

Hmm.....yes. If the rich suddenly stop getting richer, that'll really be the road to hell, won't it. Bankers out of work, on their uppers.....disaster!

No, I don't agree with all that JC believes in (and it's good, IMHO, that he's appointed someone who doesn't share his views on Trident to a major major position) but I do rejoice in the hope that the cosy Westminster clique of 'middle of the road-ish neo labour', and 'trying hard not to appear to be far right Tories' have currently been cast in the role of pigeons, awaiting the cat amongst them.

 

[GT49er]

Just to get the figures right, Corbyn got 251,417 votes.

Turnout for the leadership vote was 76.3% of the 554,272 eligible members, with 207 spoilt ballots.

Sorry, yes, my error (I was thinking of the first digit as five plus, but that was in the percentage). A quarter of a million then. More than enough for even the Tories to accept as a strike ballot in the new bill.

 

[Hampster Gull]

Hmm.....yes. If the rich suddenly stop getting richer, that'll really be the road to hell, won't it. Bankers out of work, on their uppers.....disaster!.

Capitalism needs some tempering but it and rhe core principle to it, incentivisation, is what has driven the world to where it is. People are far better for it

 

[Honky Tonx]

I think it"s all going to end in tears. After watching the evening news it's sounds as if Labour are in one hell of a mess. Corbyn looked totally uncomfortable on the labour front bench this afternoon. One has to give the man a chance but if he does try and take Labour too far to the left, I can honestly see some of the moderate centre MPs looking to cross the house.

 

[Dandyman]

I think it"s all going to end in tears. After watching the evening news it's sounds as if Labour are in one hell of a mess. Corbyn looked totally uncomfortable on the labour front bench this afternoon. One has to give the man a chance but if he does try and take Labour too far to the left, I can honestly see some of the moderate centre MPs looking to cross the house.

They are not moderates if they even think of joining a Government as extreme as the current one.

 

[Bladders]

Its understandable why traditional Labour voters are excited, since 1979 they were in the wilderness for nearly 20 years, then only got back in as trendy Tories under Blair.

Once that went to the wall they again had no idea who they were or where they were going. Corbyns appointment has given them, and the public at least a real alternative supposedly.


However, once the fanfare dies down and we get back to the nitty gritty of day to day politics I feel that this is going to go badly for the left leaning Labour followers who have pinned their hopes on this guy.



I'm just happy that politics will be interesting over the next 12 months or so, and beyond hopefully.

 

[Mellor 3 Ward 4]

Sorry, yes, my error (I was thinking of the first digit as five plus, but that was in the percentage). A quarter of a million then. More than enough for even the Tories to accept as a strike ballot in the new bill.

The point I was trying to make is that approx a quarter of a million people voted for Corbyn.

The UK electorate is approx 46 million.

He's got to persuade an awful lot of middle Englanders to go back to Labour if he's to have a chance of winning an election.

 

[Bladders]

The point I was trying to make is that approx a quarter of a million people voted for Corbyn.

The UK electorate is approx 46 million.

He's got to persuade an awful lot of middle Enlanders to go back to Labour if he's to have a chance of winning an election.

Not just Labour, but 70's Labour is would seem.

 

[GT49er]

Capitalism needs some tempering but it and rhe core principle to it, incentivisation, is what has driven the world to where it is. People are far better for it

Some people.

Bankers, for example. And politicians (yes, Labour as well as Tory). The growth of capitalism through the 19th. and first part of the 20th. century was matched and balanced by the growth of socialism and the trade unions. The pinnacle was probably reached in the fifties and sixties, when all the benefits of the reforms of the 40s - NHS, welfare state and nationalisation of essential utilities - kicked in. The virtual economy we now have, thanks mainly to Thatcherism, has widened the gap between those 'who are better for it' (capitalism) and those who are not.
Anything that upsets the cosy status quo between centrist blue-ish Labour and neo-centrist Tories at Westminster is welcome.

 

[GT49er]

The point I was trying to make is that approx a quarter of a million people voted for Corbyn.

The UK electorate is approx 46 million.

He's got to persuade an awful lot of middle Englanders to go back to Labour if he's to have a chance of winning an election.

Time will tell. I think you may well be right, that Corbyn will not be able to get Labour back into power - but, maybe the lack of support for milky Labour and bland Milliband last time around was just because they were so bland. And maybe, just maybe, many people will decide that both lots, Tory and Labour, have been such a load of **** over the years (all grabbing expenses like they actually NEEDED the money, for example) that something completely off the wall would be a good idea - like UKIP nearly made a breakthrough this year - and would have done with PR.

But PR - that's another debate I don't want to get into!

 

[Trevor]

We live in interesting times (yes a Dickensian curse). My views are a touch left of centre and I have become a little peeved about the fact that the two most popular parties in this country have very similar policies to each other - and don't represent me at all.

I'm guessing that Corbyn will have to compromise in many areas in order to present something that can be acceptable to large enough people - but I'm looking forward to the journey

 

[Hampster Gull]

Its understandable why traditional Labour voters are excited, since 1979 they were in the wilderness for nearly 20 years, then only got back in as trendy Tories under Blair.

Once that went to the wall they again had no idea who they were or where they were going. Corbyns appointment has given them, and the public at least a real alternative supposedly.


However, once the fanfare dies down and we get back to the nitty gritty of day to day politics I feel that this is going to go badly for the left leaning Labour followers who have pinned their hopes on this guy.



I'm just happy that politics will be interesting over the next 12 months or so, and beyond hopefully.

This is where i am

 

[glasfryn]

5 mins ago I rejoined the Labour party, something at last to pin your hopes on and give the tories a bloody nose at least

 

[Beach Hut]

Diane Abbot is one of the biggest jokes of a politician there is, the fact she's now in the shadow cabinet is extremely worrying.

I can only presume she was last on the list of women Jezza wanted to make up his 'right on' shadow cabinet.

Right up there with the ultimate champagne socialist Billy Bragg who lives n a £6m house in Dorset, the hypocrisy defies belief but it is seriously funny.

 

[Bry Nylon]

5 mins ago I rejoined the Labour party, something at last to pin your hopes on and give the tories a bloody nose at least

Fair play to you for putting your money where you mouth is, getting involved and getting active. I don't agree with your solution but the more people who get involved from every side of the debate can only be a good thing.

 

[beorhthelm]

Some people.

show me the people worse off than 100, 50, even 25 years ago. you cant, i know you'll point to a poor group and ignore what the level was back then. capitialist economics has paid for socialism, you just cant bring yourself to recognise this manifest fact. you worry about and focus on a gap, ignoring that the base has risen substantially while not counting the economic benefits available to all.

 

[larus]

5 mins ago I rejoined the Labour party, something at last to pin your hopes on and give the tories a bloody nose at least

When was the last time a 'left-wing' party won a UK general election? New Labour was a business friendly, left-of-centre party.
Ed Milliband - er no. (Red Ed as he was known, so was viewed as more left-wing than Blair/Brown).
Gordon Brown - er no.
Neil Kinnock - er no.
Michael Foot - er no.

Yep. Harold Wilson - 1974.

So by the time of the next election, it will be about 46 years since a left leaning party has won a UK general election.

No matter what you want to think, the reality is that this country is slight right-of-centre. Most intelligent people dismiss the scare tactics of '24 hours to save the NHS" and shit like that. Most people realise that the country cannot afford everything that everyone wants. Get over it. Life ain't fair. Lief ain't ever been fair. Life ain't ever going to be fair. Those in power always look after themselves. Look at Russia, China, North Korea, America. Wherever you look; power and nepotism thrives. Now, I know it appeals to certain sections of society to believe that we can build a fairer society, but the biggest problem to achieving this is international co-operation relating to company taxation and off-shore tax-shelters. Taxing someone earning say £250k at 50% won't make a blind bit of difference. It's the super-rich and the multi-nationals where the problems really exist, but that's too much of a problem to sort.

 

[Bry Nylon]

When was the last time a 'left-wing' party won a UK general election? New Labour was a business friendly, left-of-centre party.
Ed Milliband - er no. (Red Ed as he was known, so was viewed as more left-wing than Blair/Brown).
Gordon Brown - er no.
Neil Kinnock - er no.
Michael Foot - er no.

Yep. Harold Wilson - 1974.

So by the time of the next election, it will be about 46 years since a left leaning party has won a UK general election.

No matter what you want to think, the reality is that this country is slight right-of-centre. Most intelligent people dismiss the scare tactics of '24 hours to save the NHS" and shit like that. Most people realise that the country cannot afford everything that everyone wants. Get over it. Life ain't fair. Lief ain't ever been fair. Life ain't ever going to be fair. Those in power always look after themselves. Look at Russia, China, North Korea, America. Wherever you look; power and nepotism thrives. Now, I know it appeals to certain sections of society to believe that we can build a fairer society, but the biggest problem to achieving this is international co-operation relating to company taxation and off-shore tax-shelters. Taxing someone earning say £250k at 50% won't make a blind bit of difference. It's the super-rich and the multi-nationals where the problems really exist, but that's too much of a problem to sort.

Good analysis.
I jut can't see this working, no matter how much the Corbynistas want it to. I reckon he'll be gone by this time next year, ousted by a vote of no confidence by the PLP. Had he chosen a different shadow Chancellor he may have had a chance of getting through to the next General Election but with John McDonnell I reckon he is holed below the water line.