[Music] Kneecap

[tomfitz12]

It's ridiculous. People are more outraged about the fact they're saying Genocide is bad, than the Genocide itself.

An MP's job isn't to cancel people who speak up, it's to represent their constituency and enact positive change; something that the entire government is currently falling short of.

 

[Mellor 3 Ward 4]

Oh calm down and stop clutching your pearls, will you. They are a bunch of kids, of course they are going to say inflammatory things. What kind of country do you want if anyone who actually exercises free speech gets punished for it? So much for North Korea. They aren't politicians who you hold to account, they are musicians!

Only cowardly institutions are cancelling their gigs, as soon as the Eden Project crumbled, they rebooked at another venue in the south-west. I'm looking forward to seeing them at the Wide Awake Festival in a few weeks.

36, 30 and 26 so hardly a bunch of kids.

So do you condone the murder of David Amess?

Free speech - we have a woman jailed for 15 months for a facebook post.....

 

[pigmanovich]

Words have consequences.

It's right that they are losing bookings right now. That was an exceptionally stupid thing to say.

However, there's no reason this has to be for ever. Apology and stay away from political stuff in future. They've not done anything so bad there is no way back.

Stop being Kneecap, basically

 

[jackalbion]

36, 30 and 26 so hardly a bunch of kids.

So do you condone the murder of David Amess?

Free speech - we have a woman jailed for 15 months for a facebook post.....

Also not right. As much as I think said person is complete idiot for what they posted jailing those for that crime is a slippery slope.

I don't think simply saying not to take them too seriously is condoning the murder of David Amess.

 

[keaton]

Have they got Eric Clapton for killing a policeman yet?

 

[Hotchilidog]

The Kill Your Local MP comment was a dumb (and in my opinion a wrong) thing to say and will only give the cancel culture warriors the ammunition to discredit their anti-genocide message.

They should apologise to the families of Jo Cox and David Amess in a manner that satisfies both of them as this understandably will cause genuine upset for them.

They should not apologise for their messaging on Gaza. With Israel committing crimes against humanity on a daily basis they are right to continue to amplify that issue.

If Glastonbury drops them then it should get in the sea. The only surprise about the German ban is that it took so long as any criticism of Israel is being suppressed there.

 

[Algernon]

Group are advised by their management that any publicity is good publicity.
A few edgy poorly-researched soundbites ensue and outrage some.

Either have an intelligent discussion which political soundbites aren't going to get you cancelled or come out with whatever you fancy, have the courage of your supposed convictions and suck it up.

 

[Kalimantan Gull]

Yet they said, and I quote

“"The only good Tory is a dead Tory. Kill your local MP."

What is this critical context people are missing, which will completely change the meaning of this statement? They themselves haven’t elaborated or attempted to explain this in way, shape of form, instead saying "an extract of footage, deliberately taken out of all context, is now being exploited and weaponised, as if it were a call to action".

If there were some magical explanation as to why this seemingly crystal clear statement has been misinterpreted, why won’t they say what it is?

Moreover, why apologise at all if they’ve done nothing wrong and this is all a silly misunderstanding?

No, what has happened here is they’ve potentially committed a quite serious crime, are being cancelled by promoters, and are bricking it.

Either a) they believe the things they’ve said and should be investigated by police, b) they don’t believe the things they’ve said, but are playing “characters” for shock value, and should be investigated by police or c) there is this fabled “explanation” as to how what they’ve said has been taken completely out of context, as they allege.

Doesn't it depend if its said as part of their act though? You'll see exactly the same said on TV, in cinema, in stand-up comedy, in the lyrics of countless songs, in football chants. If its an artistic act, that's the critical context.

When I was just a little boy, I asked my mother what should I be, Should I be Brighton, Should I be Palace, Here's what she said to me; Wash yer mouth out son, And go and get your fathers gun, And shoot the Palace scum, Shoot the Palace scum.

If you've ever sung that ....

 

[jcdenton08]

Doesn't it depend if its said as part of their act though? You'll see exactly the same said on TV, in cinema, in stand-up comedy, in the lyrics of countless songs, in football chants. If its an artistic act, that's the critical context.

When I was just a little boy, I asked my mother what should I be, Should I be Brighton, Should I be Palace, Here's what she said to me; Wash yer mouth out son, And go and get your fathers gun, And shoot the Palace scum, Shoot the Palace scum.

Then why apologise?

 

[Kalimantan Gull]

Then why apologise?

They started with the 'its out of context' argument - but the pile on is so big that its the easiest way out I guess. They are being cancelled left right and centre, for something that was only said to their fans who know what they are like.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Yet they said, and I quote

“"The only good Tory is a dead Tory. Kill your local MP."

What is this critical context people are missing, which will completely change the meaning of this statement? They themselves haven’t elaborated or attempted to explain this in way, shape of form, instead saying "an extract of footage, deliberately taken out of all context, is now being exploited and weaponised, as if it were a call to action".

If there were some magical explanation as to why this seemingly crystal clear statement has been misinterpreted, why won’t they say what it is?

Moreover, why apologise at all if they’ve done nothing wrong and this is all a silly misunderstanding?

No, what has happened here is they’ve potentially committed a quite serious crime, are being cancelled by promoters, and are bricking it.

Either a) they believe the things they’ve said and should be investigated by police, b) they don’t believe the things they’ve said, but are playing “characters” for shock value, and should be investigated by police or c) there is this fabled “explanation” as to how what they’ve said has been taken completely out of context, as they allege.

They do not need to explain this any further imo. The "critical context" you are missing is this was a flippant, and arguably ill-advised, comment said in the heat of a gig. This is the context. It is clearly not a call to arms (pun obvs intended).....what more do you need to know?

They have apologised because they appreciate, with hindsite, it was ill-advised.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

The greater issue here, is where can you get "rhino ket'?

 

[crabface]

Badenoch has previous with them, seems like she has seized on a chance.

Kneecap: Kemi Badenoch blames 'cowardly' Labour for settlement

A funding award of £15,000 to the band was blocked by former Business Secretary Kemi Badenoch.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Badenoch has previous with them, seems like she has seized on a chance.

Kneecap: Kemi Badenoch blames 'cowardly' Labour for settlement

A funding award of £15,000 to the band was blocked by former Business Secretary Kemi Badenoch.

www.bbc.co.uk

The government said they decided not to contest the award as "we do not believe it is in the public interest"

The amount was 14k. I'm no legal expert but

1) This was decided in a court of law
2) I'm certain legal fees to challenge this, from the public coffers, will be more than 14k.

The question to Badenoch is why does she feel this is in the public interest?

 

[Deportivo Seagull]

I can promise you, as someone balls-deep into punk rock in 1977, that 'the moors murderers' did not feature on anyone's radar.
There were a few prats who thought that shouting '****' was radical.
I remember a band called 'Raped'.
Stupid name. Shit band.
Changed their name to 'Cuddly toys' and did a (shit) Peel session.

When I was young we could tell the difference between originals and wannabees.
It seems this skill has been lost.

God knows what people would think if Crass made a come back …. I give you ’So What’.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

God knows what people would think if Crass made a come back …. I give you ’So What’.

Coincidentally I saw Jeffrey Lewis last night and he covered a Crass song.

 

[crabface]

The government said they decided not to contest the award as "we do not believe it is in the public interest"

The amount was 14k. I'm no legal expert but

1) This was decided in a court of law
2) I'm certain legal fees to challenge this, from the public coffers, will be more than 14k.

The question to Badenoch is why does she feel this is in the public interest?

That's my point.

She blocked them receiving a grant, then it got taken to court and it was found the grant should be paid.

She is now calling for them to be prosecuted and to be banned full stop. There must be a reason others have not waded into this and just her. They have made some stupid comments that they should not have made and she has now seized on the opportunity.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

That's my point.

She blocked them receiving a grant, then it got taken to court and it was found the grant should be paid.

She is now calling for them to be prosecuted and to be banned full stop. There must be a reason others have not waded into this and just her. They have made some stupid comments that they should not have made and she has now seized on the opportunity.

Sorry, I was not challenging you, more re-asserting what you suggested.

 

[Stato]

I recently read this book: https://lareviewofbooks.org/article/endless-culture-wars-on-kliph-nesteroffs-outrageous/ and would highly recommend it for context and history about how both sides of the political spectrum, particularly in America, have always tried to set audiences and media on to their opponents.

Yes these lot have overstepped the mark in their rebel posturing. They won't be the first and they won't be the last. As Nesteroff's book concentrates mainly on America, it doesn't discuss some of the pre-internet moral panics that we all may remember from the UK: Alice Cooper being banned, McCartney's 'Give Ireland Back...', the Filth and the Fury, the Beastie Boys tour, Frankie Goes to Hollywood's 'Relax', the Macc Lads, Steve Albini's stupidly named post Big Black project, etc. There's an interesting history to be considered over here too.

Nesteroff doesn't try to draw conclusions, although just presenting the facts about where the money has come from for so long, is quite eye opening. What it left me considering was that fame, celebrity and artistic talent make us give far too much credence to the views of many people who are completely ill equipped to do the big thinking. I'm a devourer of popular culture. I couldn't live without music, comedy, TV, film, sport etc. but I try to remember that talent in one area doesn't equate to knowledge in any other. Paul Weller for example, has a knack for turning social issues into great pop songs, but the ability to produce a very satisfying bon mot doesn't mean he knows anything about politics and none of us should pay much attention whenever a journalist asks for his analysis. A look at the interview games played by Bob Dylan in the 1960s when he was being told that he was the voice of a generation show that the more perceptive people who go through this veneration understand its ridiculousness and refuse to play along.

However, we have a multinational industry that makes money from asking famous people for their opinions on things and then gains more money and influence from condemnations of famous people's opinions on things. Whether financial or political gain, the drivers to outrage in an internet world are too quick and too strong. It seems a forlorn hope that we will ever mature to the point where the views of all celebrities are treated like we all tend to treat John Lydon's: 'Thanks for that John. You really are a most entertaining iconoclast. Now, the adults have some rather important things to discuss. Go off to your room and practice and you can come down later to do your little song.'

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

The only surprise about the German ban is that it took so long as any criticism of Israel is being suppressed there.

It was a day or two, not that long. I saw the initial add, looked at tickets, checked with a mate, went to buy tickets and it said they were not for sale and a few hours later said it was cancelled.