[Politics] Keir Starmer getting constantly heckled in his keynote conference speech

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

Starmer has done well

What he really needs is a visible and credible front bench to take it to the tories.

Starmer would make a decent PM, but can't get there all on his own

Indeed. I like his non-confronational approach, but if there is open rebellion from a shadow cabinet member he will sack them. I suspect that's why that twerp walked the other week.

I like the fact that he is not focused on 'internal' issues (so boring), and it will take time for new labour heavyweights to emerge (it is ten years almost since the last of the old 'new labour' types began to fade away, and the Corbyn era was obviously a cross between a nuclear wasteland and perma frost as far as the flourishing of centre labour is concerned) but I agree with you - bring forth the talents, and let's see a good team. I am ashamed to say I can't name the shadow chancellor, foreign secretary or defence secretary unless I look them up.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

Indeed. I like his non-confronational approach, but if there is open rebellion from a shadow cabinet member he will sack them. I suspect that's why that twerp walked the other week.

I like the fact that he is not focused on 'internal' issues (so boring), and it will take time for new labour heavyweights to emerge (it is ten years almost since the last of the old 'new labour' types began to fade away, and the Corbyn era was obviously a cross between a nuclear wasteland and perma frost as far as the flourishing of centre labour is concerned) but I agree with you - bring forth the talents, and let's see a good team. I am ashamed to say I can't name the shadow chancellor, foreign secretary or defence secretary unless I look them up.

Edit - I just looked them up and I have heard of only half of them and know something about only 3 or 4 of them. Crikey!

 

[crodonilson]

Starmer has done well

What he really needs is a visible and credible front bench to take it to the tories.

Starmer would make a decent PM, but can't get there all on his own

There is plenty of talent in the Labour ranks to take it to the Tories.

Thornberry, Lammy, Rayner, Burgeon, Eagle, Dodds.

 

[Bry Nylon]

Edit - I just looked them up and I have heard of only half of them and know something about only 3 or 4 of them. Crikey!

John Healey? Who he?

Doubt he even gets asked to switch on the Christmas lights in his own house.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

John Healey? Who he?

Doubt he even gets asked to switch on the Christmas lights in his own house.

Is he the love child of Denis and Austin?

 

[jcdenton08]

There is plenty of talent in the Labour ranks to take it to the Tories.

Thornberry, Lammy, Rayner, Burgeon, Eagle, Dodds.

Rayner. she's exactly what I don't want

 

[Is it PotG?]

There is plenty of talent in the Labour ranks to take it to the Tories.

Thornberry, Lammy, Rayner, Burgeon, Eagle, Dodds.

Thornberry

She strikes me as the type still struggling with light switches. As smug as you like too.

 

[peterward]

In his conference speech he explicitly referred to Brexit as not reversible, hence the quip from pot gnoodle about upsetting people on NSC, and the follow up conversation.

My main point was to question gnoodle, for mocking nonexisrant posters for their nonexistent outrage at Starmer's 'new' stance.

As for the shadow cabinet, the first few are always a reflection of the past because disruptive change doesn't sit well with anyone, ever. Thatcher's first shadow cabinet was dripping with 'wets'. Blair, admittedly, had a decent shadow cabinet, with Kinnock and Smith seeing of most of the hairy arse brigade, although he twice included Michael Meacher who went mad later. Starmer even gave Wrong Baily a platform, till she conveniently machined gunned herself in the face a few weeks later by retweeting an antisemitic trope (or something - it matters not, she made her position untenable and has now vanished).

I am personally pleased that those queuing up to punch Starmer, presently, are old labour dinosaurs and worried right wing conservatives.

It did feel like a starting gun was fired on his leadership/direction. And I really liked what I heard yesterday mostly in the positioning of where labout will sit on the political spectrum. People say "same old tories" but they have also shifted a lot from a long way to the right under Maggie to much more centrist under Cameron to some mishmash of right, centre and liberal under the blonde bull$hitter.

I am not a tribal labour voter/support, I have often gravitated towards the lib dems policies, calm most often, sensible centre left social justice polices with fiscal competence but could never vote for them due to their one size fits all stance on the EU,so its going to be somewhere most moderate and centrist.

I do love the majority of Labours thrust on social justice, looking after, protecting and helping the poorest, sickest and most vulnerable in society is paramount. I dont want to live in a society of individual islands, we are a connected web and not everybody is born with the same chances or physcial abilites, but I do genuinely fear the madness of the hard left, the trots and die hard marxists who live in a cloud cukoo land of a theoretical socialist utopia that doesnt exist.
It ends up as a currupt entity like the Soviet Union, a corrupt entity like Cuba, Venezuela or outright dictatorship and it doesnt make the poor richer, it makes everybody poorer, stifling aspiration, motivation and innovation. I do genuinely believe these loons would be happy to try and impose their "superior" ideology on those who utterly reject it and theyre most often vociferous of everything and everyone they stand against than defending what they stand for.

And why are so many of them on the very left genuinely filled with hate towards others, those more to the right in their own party and those in other parties, the woman yeterday heckling Startmer was almost foaming at the mouth. I see little difference in the hard left and the hard right, both are politics of hate and divison.

There is little pragmatism, or real politik, its based more on an entrenched position that those with a different outlook and certainly those with money are all bad and must be destroyed/punished.

So Starmer following the Blairist stance of being pro business, sensible, but potentially fairer. I find really really encouraging,and dare i say it, exciting after the Corbyn years. It makes Labour a genuine opposition again, let the hard leftists and trots form their own political fringe movement and they can reside with the other extremeists like UKip in their own echo chambers.

Labour party should represent all, not just blue collar workers in Northern heartlands, it should represent the middle classes and those with money/business and under Starmer hopefully thats the paradigm shift away from the toxicity and lunacy of Corbynism.

fwiw, I think Rayner made a mistake with the "scum" comments, its just not needed and sounds thuggish. It will be cheered by die hard tribalists, but ouside that bubble it will do more harm than good. Even if you think it, she should be above the fray and trying to win the arguments rather than hurling petty abusive insults... but that endemic anti tory tribalism is a hindrance in the Labour party, its petty and there are plenty of decent people that will be in that party (as there are in all mainstream parties) or may vote conservative.

There is so much more that needs to be done including a modernisation of the trade unions, theyre essential and I am in one (and I know you are too), but many of those in leadership are still very much locked in 1970's, 1980's tribal labour politics. Time for the next generation me thinks Red Len.

Its time to change, grow up and become a 21st century party that represents everyone from the exec to the cleaner. Ditch the divisiveness, bin the hate, promote what you are for more than what you are against, cut loose those locked in the past, sideline the extremists and become a credible government in waiting for the majority. Good luck Sir Kier.

Viva La Revolucion!

 

[sparkie]

The highlights I heard of his speech seemed impressive.

He's pretty much got my vote in May 2024 or whenever it is.

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

Indeed. I like his non-confronational approach, but if there is open rebellion from a shadow cabinet member he will sack them. I suspect that's why that twerp walked the other week.

I like the fact that he is not focused on 'internal' issues (so boring), and it will take time for new labour heavyweights to emerge (it is ten years almost since the last of the old 'new labour' types began to fade away, and the Corbyn era was obviously a cross between a nuclear wasteland and perma frost as far as the flourishing of centre labour is concerned) but I agree with you - bring forth the talents, and let's see a good team. I am ashamed to say I can't name the shadow chancellor, foreign secretary or defence secretary unless I look them up.

Shadow Chancellor is Rachel Reeves. I saw her interview on the BBC on Sunday. Very impressive.

There is plenty of talent in the Labour ranks to take it to the Tories.

Thornberry, Lammy, Rayner, Burgeon, Eagle, Dodds.

 

[JC Footy Genius]

Despite some positive reviews, mainly from people desperate for a functioning opposition, I'm not sure a one and a half hour conference speech (zzz), punctuated by numerous hecklers is going to get much of a poll bounce for Labour ..

https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politic...9/29/voting-intention-con-39-lab-31-28-29-sep

... time will tell.



Sent from my SM-G970F using Tapatalk

 

[KeegansHairPiece]

I cannot remember a time when a political party conference generated so much interest. Amazing. Must be a shoe in.

 

[sparkie]

There is plenty of talent in the Labour ranks to take it to the Tories.

Thornberry, Lammy, Rayner, Burgeon, Eagle, Dodds.

Top, top fishing.

 

[peterward]

Despite some positive reviews, mainly from people desperate for a functioning opposition, I'm not sure a one and a half hour conference speech (zzz), punctuated by numerous hecklers is going to get much of a poll bounce for Labour ..

https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politic...9/29/voting-intention-con-39-lab-31-28-29-sep

... time will tell.



Sent from my SM-G970F using Tapatalk

as you say time will tell, that poll is meaningless as the sampling was on 28th and 29th and his speech on 29th. Next one will tell more

 

[A1X]

Indeed. I like his non-confronational approach, but if there is open rebellion from a shadow cabinet member he will sack them. I suspect that's why that twerp walked the other week.

I like the fact that he is not focused on 'internal' issues (so boring), and it will take time for new labour heavyweights to emerge (it is ten years almost since the last of the old 'new labour' types began to fade away, and the Corbyn era was obviously a cross between a nuclear wasteland and perma frost as far as the flourishing of centre labour is concerned) but I agree with you - bring forth the talents, and let's see a good team. I am ashamed to say I can't name the shadow chancellor, foreign secretary or defence secretary unless I look them up.

There was a time when nobody had heard of the likes of Gove, Osborne, Cameron etc. (many would say happier times). The point is if you keep picking people because they're "known" you end up in the situation of having an aging group lacking in new ideas. Much like football teams, new blood has to be given a chance.

 

[Nobby Cybergoat]

There was a time when nobody had heard of the likes of Gove, Osborne, Cameron etc. (many would say happier times). The point is if you keep picking people because they're "known" you end up in the situation of having an aging group lacking in new ideas. Much like football teams, new blood has to be given a chance.

Well yes, but it has to take that chance.

On this thread people have admitted having no idea who the labour shadow cabinet are the day after their conference has ended.

It's tough, I know, but they need to be properly out there getting their name known and gaining credibility.

 

[Billy the Fish]

I read a jokey opinion piece suggesting Mandelson had engineer the hecklers to make Keir look good. Even if it wasn't engineered they've done him a massive favour because they all looked like complete wrong'uns! As did the weirdos with the red cards.

He's also done well with his speech, nobody outside the room listens to the whole 90 mins unless they're trying to cure insomnia so there's bound to be a few TV and twitter friendly sound bites in that time.

 

[peterward]

Guardian columnist not that complimentary

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/sep/29/keir-starmer-support-politician-national-mood

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

It did feel like a starting gun was fired on his leadership/direction. And I really liked what I heard yesterday mostly in the positioning of where labout will sit on the political spectrum. People say "same old tories" but they have also shifted a lot from a long way to the right under Maggie to much more centrist under Cameron to some mishmash of right, centre and liberal under the blonde bull$hitter.

I am not a tribal labour voter/support, I have often gravitated towards the lib dems policies, calm most often, sensible centre left social justice polices with fiscal competence but could never vote for them due to their one size fits all stance on the EU,so its going to be somewhere most moderate and centrist.

I do love the majority of Labours thrust on social justice, looking after, protecting and helping the poorest, sickest and most vulnerable in society is paramount. I dont want to live in a society of individual islands, we are a connected web and not everybody is born with the same chances or physcial abilites, but I do genuinely fear the madness of the hard left, the trots and die hard marxists who live in a cloud cukoo land of a theoretical socialist utopia that doesnt exist.
It ends up as a currupt entity like the Soviet Union, a corrupt entity like Cuba, Venezuela or outright dictatorship and it doesnt make the poor richer, it makes everybody poorer, stifling aspiration, motivation and innovation. I do genuinely believe these loons would be happy to try and impose their "superior" ideology on those who utterly reject it and theyre most often vociferous of everything and everyone they stand against than defending what they stand for.

And why are so many of them on the very left genuinely filled with hate towards others, those more to the right in their own party and those in other parties, the woman yeterday heckling Startmer was almost foaming at the mouth. I see little difference in the hard left and the hard right, both are politics of hate and divison.

There is little pragmatism, or real politik, its based more on an entrenched position that those with a different outlook and certainly those with money are all bad and must be destroyed/punished.

So Starmer following the Blairist stance of being pro business, sensible, but potentially fairer. I find really really encouraging,and dare i say it, exciting after the Corbyn years. It makes Labour a genuine opposition again, let the hard leftists and trots form their own political fringe movement and they can reside with the other extremeists like UKip in their own echo chambers.

Labour party should represent all, not just blue collar workers in Northern heartlands, it should represent the middle classes and those with money/business and under Starmer hopefully thats the paradigm shift away from the toxicity and lunacy of Corbynism.

fwiw, I think Rayner made a mistake with the "scum" comments, its just not needed and sounds thuggish. It will be cheered by die hard tribalists, but ouside that bubble it will do more harm than good. Even if you think it, she should be above the fray and trying to win the arguments rather than hurling petty abusive insults... but that endemic anti tory tribalism is a hindrance in the Labour party, its petty and there are plenty of decent people that will be in that party (as there are in all mainstream parties) or may vote conservative.

There is so much more that needs to be done including a modernisation of the trade unions, theyre essential and I am in one (and I know you are too), but many of those in leadership are still very much locked in 1970's, 1980's tribal labour politics. Time for the next generation me thinks Red Len.

Its time to change, grow up and become a 21st century party that represents everyone from the exec to the cleaner. Ditch the divisiveness, bin the hate, promote what you are for more than what you are against, cut loose those locked in the past, sideline the extremists and become a credible government in waiting for the majority. Good luck Sir Kier.

Viva La Revolucion!

Very good post

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

There was a time when nobody had heard of the likes of Gove, Osborne, Cameron etc. (many would say happier times). The point is if you keep picking people because they're "known" you end up in the situation of having an aging group lacking in new ideas. Much like football teams, new blood has to be given a chance.

That isn't my point. My point is they need to work on being known. Hopefully that will happen (and I mean, known for gravitas rather than for calling people 'scum').

And I say all that as a Labour party member, not a pinch-faced Daily Express reader threatened by 'coloured' people and 'weirdos'.