[Albion] Jim Davidson on Piers Morgan's Life Stories

[Pavilionaire]

Humour is a powerful tool in helping integration of different races and shows like Til Death Us Do Part, Love Thy Neighbour, Rising Damp do not get enough credit for being brave enough to ridicule racists at a time when the majority of the UK population were mild racists.

That said, Davidson was what I'd call a benign racist but didn't do anything to make people less racist. He was of his time.

 

[spring hall convert]

His mates were Ian Duncan Smith, Michael Gove, Nigel Farage, Dappy from NDubz and Bobby Davro.

I think we can safely surmise that he is a massive ****.

 

[TheJasperCo]

The definition of 'countryside': To kill Piers Morgan


Admittedly, that joke works better spoken than written.

Ahh, finally I get it now! Because when spoken aloud it sounds like ****-icide. And Piers Morgan is a ****. And "-icide" is a suffix that derives from the Latin verb caedere, meaning "to slay".

 

[BensGrandad]

I watched the program last night and couldnt see anything for people to be offended about. He was a top comedian in the 70s but then as far as stage shows go Roy Chubby Brown sold out theatres and I thought that he was just crude and all swearing and not funny.unliker JD who mixed both.

 

[spence]

I watched the program last night and couldnt see anything for people to be offended about. He was a top comedian in the 70s but then as far as stage shows go Roy Chubby Brown sold out theatres and I thought that he was just crude and all swearing and not funny.unliker JD who mixed both.

I also watched it. Conclusion = people like to be offended

 

[Bob'n'weave]

To be fair, love they neighbour was a very clever way, as was till death us do part, in showing how it was and the main characters being derided in their prejudice.

In love thy neighbour, the northerner who had such views was derided by both black leads and his wife, who all showed that he was alone in his views. Btw. The black actor is in East Enders.

I was pre-teen when LTN was on air and my endearing memory of the show was the sporadic use of the words 'nig-nog' and 'sambo', followed by canned laughter. Maybe as a youngster I did not get the subtlety of the parody?

 

[The Clamp]

I don’t want to get drawn into this discussion as I have time for both [MENTION=33848]The Clamp[/MENTION] and [MENTION=31796]alfredmizen[/MENTION]. But it’s only fair to say the idea Frau Tubthumper was in any way “door stepped” or threatened is wrong. And I’ve said this before.

But if you want to draw the wife into this.... when I explained what had happened her response was “so you two have been goading each other on the Internet and now he wants to box your ears in, how ****ing old are you two?” I think she called it right.

Fairs fair. My apologies to both of you for that and to Frau T. And with that I shall respectfully withdraw from the topic.

 

[Baldseagull]

You're making massive assumptions about me and all of them are incorrect. Sheffield is home to me and I've seen a hell of a lot of changes in the time I've been here.

But more importantly, I'm married to a woman from Sheffield and her family are all from Sheffield. Not to mention the hundreds of people who I know here who are all born and bred in South Yorkshire. So I have experience of the attitudes of generations of people who have seen the city change beyond recognition over the years. I'm not "just another newcomer" and I do not dismiss people's opinions without considering why they might feel that way.

Make whatever excuses you want for racism. It's not gonna wash with me.

You're part of the problem, you are changing Sheffield with your Southern ways, you should try and integrate more, buy a flat cap and use thee and thar, see Charlie Williams.

 

[Baldseagull]

I was pre-teen when LTN was on air and my endearing memory of the show was the sporadic use of the words 'nig-nog' and 'sambo', followed by canned laughter. Maybe as a youngster I did not get the subtlety of the parody?

If you have ever been to see Al Murray Pub Landlord, you look around and see only half the audience realise he is taking the mick out of xenophobic and misogynistic people, the other half think he is their hero.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

I was pre-teen when LTN was on air and my endearing memory of the show was the sporadic use of the words 'nig-nog' and 'sambo', followed by canned laughter. Maybe as a youngster I did not get the subtlety of the parody?

Exactly. The audience were invited, by the way the programme was presented, to laugh with the brainless racism of the white male character (and indeed also that of the black male character when he said 'honky'). That was the reason I hated the programme. As a young teenager if found 'nig nog' to be peurile, and I fund the little fat balding loud mouthed white bloke (and the tall reactionary black bloke) impossible to empathise with, and being 'canned laugh' pressed into empathizing with them, and consequently accepting thir racism as a valid and understandable attitude, was excruciating.

By contrast, as a much younger kid, it seemed obvious from the way it was presented that Alf Garnett was a rediculous fool, who was being left behind by all the 'white heat' of the 1960s. And the 'scarse git' and the wife and daughter were three against one, not getting racist back at him ('honky') but mocking and laughing at him. The audience knew which side they should be on. The joke in doors was that when my dad got aeriated (he was from docklands - Millwall - and went on and on about long haired layabouts - never himself racist, but Portslade was 99.0% white) he sounded like Alf Garnett. He did not like that one bit - because Alf Garnett was not a sympathetic character, obviously outmoded and deluded in his views (mostly directed at Jews and 'yer labour').

The two programmes therefore were very much not alike. One was quite well written, whimsical even. The other was a lazy attempt at stereotyping. Or was it even that clever? I have never met anyone like the LTN male leads. So, not even a parody - just crap writing.

 

[Bob'n'weave]

Exactly. The audience were invited, by the way the programme was presented, to laugh with the brainless racism of the white male character (and indeed also that of the black male character when he said 'honky'). That was the reason I hated the programme. As a young teenager if found 'nig nog' to be peurile, and I fund the little fat balding loud mouthed white bloke (and the tall reactionary black bloke) impossible to empathise with, and being 'canned laugh' pressed into empathizing with them, and consequently accepting thir racism as a valid and understandable attitude, was excruciating.

By contrast, as a much younger kid, it seemed obvious from the way it was presented that Alf Garnett was a rediculous fool, who was being left behind by all the 'white heat' of the 1960s. And the 'scarse git' and the wife and daughter were three against one, not getting racist back at him ('honky') but mocking and laughing at him. The audience knew which side they should be on. The joke in doors was that when my dad got aeriated (he was from docklands - Millwall - and went on and on about long haired layabouts - never himself racist, but Portslade was 99.0% white) he sounded like Alf Garnett. He did not like that one bit - because Alf Garnett was not a sympathetic character, obviously outmoded and deluded in his views (mostly directed at Jews and 'yer labour').

The two programmes therefore were very much not alike. One was quite well written, whimsical even. The other was a lazy attempt at stereotyping. Or was it even that clever? I have never met anyone like the LTN male leads. So, not even a parody - just crap writing.

Fair point, can't argue with that.

 

[Baldseagull]

Exactly. The audience were invited, by the way the programme was presented, to laugh with the brainless racism of the white male character (and indeed also that of the black male character when he said 'honky'). That was the reason I hated the programme. As a young teenager if found 'nig nog' to be peurile, and I fund the little fat balding loud mouthed white bloke (and the tall reactionary black bloke) impossible to empathise with, and being 'canned laugh' pressed into empathizing with them, and consequently accepting thir racism as a valid and understandable attitude, was excruciating.

By contrast, as a much younger kid, it seemed obvious from the way it was presented that Alf Garnett was a rediculous fool, who was being left behind by all the 'white heat' of the 1960s. And the 'scarse git' and the wife and daughter were three against one, not getting racist back at him ('honky') but mocking and laughing at him. The audience knew which side they should be on. The joke in doors was that when my dad got aeriated (he was from docklands - Millwall - and went on and on about long haired layabouts - never himself racist, but Portslade was 99.0% white) he sounded like Alf Garnett. He did not like that one bit - because Alf Garnett was not a sympathetic character, obviously outmoded and deluded in his views (mostly directed at Jews and 'yer labour').

The two programmes therefore were very much not alike. One was quite well written, whimsical even. The other was a lazy attempt at stereotyping. Or was it even that clever? I have never met anyone like the LTN male leads. So, not even a parody - just crap writing.

I have never met anyone exactly like Del Boy, or Victor Meldrew, they are charicatures, but otherwise, I agree shite writing.

 

[alfredmizen]

I don’t want to get drawn into this discussion as I have time for both [MENTION=33848]The Clamp[/MENTION] and [MENTION=31796]alfredmizen[/MENTION]. But it’s only fair to say the idea Frau Tubthumper was in any way “door stepped” or threatened is wrong. And I’ve said this before.

But if you want to draw the wife into this.... when I explained what had happened her response was “so you two have been goading each other on the Internet and now he wants to box your ears in, how ****ing old are you two?” I think she called it right.

i think frau tubthumper is more grown up than either of us mate , if.you ever meet my other half ( yes i know im punching above my weight ) which is entirely feasible as i take her boy to football , then i beg you not to mention the "episode"

 

[alfredmizen]

Fairs fair. My apologies to both of you for that and to Frau T. And with that I shall respectfully withdraw from the topic.

 

[Lenny Rider]

I thought it was an interesting hour of TV.

IMHO I thought he came across well, clearly like all of us there’s a touch of marmite about him and he has his flaws, but if you step back and look at the whole picture, there’s a lot worse people out there.

His charity work with the ex servicemen is especially commendable although no doubt a number of people on here would choose to gloss over it.

And perhaps most importantly for all his faults, and the five marriages, he has a great relationship with all of his children.

 

[Publius Ovidius]

I was pre-teen when LTN was on air and my endearing memory of the show was the sporadic use of the words 'nig-nog' and 'sambo', followed by canned laughter. Maybe as a youngster I did not get the subtlety of the parody?

It was very much the same with Alf garnett. The way that johnny Speight wrote till death us so part was to parody the working man, in his case an east end ex docker type and the prejudice he had ingrained in him. He was constantly picked up by his daughter( una Stubbs) his son in law,( tony booth, who was Cheri blair's father) and the brilliant Dandi Nichols and his view challenged and ridiculed. But in the same way as a lot of people now a days will revert to " it's all banter" when referring to so called homophobic abuse, he saw absolutely nothing wrong in his views which today would be seen as totally acceptable. The terms " sambo" and " nig nog" and " wog" were as much a part of his vocabulary and he didn't see anything wrong at all.

As you say, very much a different day and age.

I seem also to remember the show was recorded live, so no canned laughter there.

 

[Charlies Shinpad]

The name WOGS actually stood for Workers On Government Service in Africa and the British soldiers out there at the time were known as Gollys ( not sure of the exact spelling )
The workers made these coloured dolls and the Soldiers returning home brought them back with them as gifts
Hence Golliwogs came to be

 

[Motogull]

The name WOGS actually stood for Workers On Government Service in Africa and the British soldiers out there at the time were known as Gollys ( not sure of the exact spelling )
The workers made these coloured dolls and the Soldiers returning home brought them back with them as gifts
Hence Golliwogs came to be

As a kid, I heard that a WOG was a western oriental gentleman.

Back to JD, I think to some degree he has been a bit of a godsend for the tabloids and 'we' have almost been encouraged to hate him. Reminds me when Barrymore went from national favourite to murderer in the blink of an eye. It reached the point when I thought the tabloids were hoping he would close his own account such was the frenzy. JD was fine on that snooker programme as I recall.

I bet the next kunnt off is with Katie Hopkins,

 

[symyjym]

Humour is a powerful tool in helping integration of different races and shows like Til Death Us Do Part, Love Thy Neighbour, Rising Damp do not get enough credit for being brave enough to ridicule racists at a time when the majority of the UK population were mild racists.

That said, Davidson was what I'd call a benign racist but didn't do anything to make people less racist. He was of his time.

I can just about remember Love Thy Neighbour being on as a child, but checking out some episodes on Youtube they are quite funny and only mocks racism.

 

[Questions]

The name WOGS actually stood for Workers On Government Service in Africa and the British soldiers out there at the time were known as Gollys ( not sure of the exact spelling )
The workers made these coloured dolls and the Soldiers returning home brought them back with them as gifts
Hence Golliwogs came to be

The Major: I must have been rather keen on her because I took her to see... India!
Basil: India?
The Major: At the Oval... fine match, marvellous finish... now, Surrey had to get thirty-three in about half an hour... she went off to powder her... powder her hands or something... women... er... never came back.
Basil: What a shame.
The Major: And the strange thing was... throughout the morning she kept referring to the Indians as niggers. "No no no," I said, "the niggers are the West Indians. These people are wogs.

I bet there are people who feel uncomfortable with that scene nowadays..... god help us.