Hung parliament who does it work ?

[Gwylan]

...vote for political reform to get rid of our crap electoral system.

And a form of PR is part of the Labour thinking. One of the bills going through parliament at the moment is proposing changing first past to the post to alternative voting ( I can't remember whether it's the proposal itself or a suggestion to put it to a referendum). The Conservatives are dead against AV but Libs aren't - that could be a useful lever for any horse trading.

 

[Leekbrookgull]

Would have to agree with you Withdean !

 

[Goldstone Rapper]

If it IS a hung Parliament,inevitably it will be the Lib Dems who are hanged.This is because such a parliament will be short lived,do nothing,and a new election will soon follow.But the LibDems will have had to show their hand.Tory Lib Dems will be appalled if the LibDems back Labour.Likewise Labour LibDems will be horrified if they back the Tories.

In the follow up election these supporters will return to their natural,possibly traditional,parties,and the LibDem support will collapse,allowing their six remaining MPs to divide up their non existant "opposition" posts,and promise us income tax of 3%,bread,circuses,free university education,free foreign holidays ,the penny and the bun.

While it may happen as you describe I wouldn't say it was inevitable as such. The first election (1979) after the brief Lib-Lab pact of the 1970s led to the Liberal party losing 2 of their 13 seats. Not that big a drop. There are other countervailing factors that may be at play if the LibDems help to form a government - e.g. if the Lib Dems get a whiff of power, they may not be seen in future as a wasted vote by some voters.

 

[Lord Bracknell]

If the Lib Dems are serious, they will negotiate a deal that delivers proportional representation - and a PERMANENT state of affairs where ALL future general elections result in a hung parliament, with the government chosen by whoever is Lib Dem leader at the time.

 

[jakarta]

Or if you want to be a bit sneaky CMD encourages the SNP to break up the UK thereby ensuring a permanent Tory majority based on English votes?

What is the problem with that if you are a democrat - i.e. the people who live in your country deciding who they want in their Parliament?

As far as I am concerned the Sweatys, Welsh and Ulster Mob should all go fully independent, have their own Parliaments, legal systems, boundaries, political parties and policies and send no MPs to Westminster as it would no longer be any of their business.

Of course seeing as they wouldn't then be subsidised by the Cash Cow that is Englands Tax money it would all fall to bits in five minutes.....

 

[Dandyman]

What is the problem with that if you are a democrat - i.e. the people who live in your country deciding who they want in their Parliament?

As far as I am concerned the Sweatys, Welsh and Ulster Mob should all go fully independent, have their own Parliaments, legal systems, boundaries, political parties and policies and send no MPs to Westminster as it would no longer be any of their business.

Of course seeing as they wouldn't then be subsidised by the Cash Cow that is Englands Tax money it would all fall to bits in five minutes.....

Well there is a branch of "Loyalism" that views or used to view an independent Nord Iron as a last ditch alternative to an re-united Ireland.

 

[Dandyman]

They would cease to be the Conservative and Unionist Party if that happened.

True - although the Tories ability to whip up the Orange vote in Scotland has been steadily declining since the 1950s.

 

[Hatterlovesbrighton]

Don't forget the SNP.

They are campaigning with the apparently serious belief that they might determine the colour of the next UK government. If 30-odd SNP MPs are elected and neither of the main parties has an overall majority, the SNP will back whichever of Brown or Cameron "offers the most to Scotland".

This probably means "offers the biggest cash grant to the Scottish Parliament" to allow the [SNP] Scottish government to splash out on one of its flagship policies - such as better free social care for the elderly or free university education.

A big result for the SNP could very easily lead to this sort of horse trading. My guess is that Brown might do the deal - justifying it on the grounds that a Tory government of the UK would have no real legitimacy, since the Tories had won practically no seats in Scotland, Wales or Northern Ireland and winning the vote in England alone isn't good enough.

But Labour and the SNP despise each other north of the border. More likely to do a deal with the tories perhaps with the promise that they would support an indepndence move if there was a positive referendum result. No chance of them gettting that out of Labour.

Labour will probably either need to get the most seats or be pretty close to the tories for them to be able to make a lib/lab coalition work.

It might though come down to a few quirks in the make up of Parliament. For instance, Sinn Fein will most likely win about 5-7 seats but they never take up their seats effectively reducing the majority you need.

 

[Cian]

It might though come down to a few quirks in the make up of Parliament. For instance, Sinn Fein will most likely win about 5-7 seats but they never take up their seats effectively reducing the majority you need.

Theres been mutterings that if SF were in a position where their seats could actually have major influence that they'd have an emergency meeting to change that policy - like the one on policing support for St. Andrews. Relying on SF support would be suicidal for a party though, I suspect!

Conversely you can basically add one or two (currently 3 but I can see them slipping further) to Labours figures from the SDLP who do take their seats and have gone under the Labour whip for quite a while.

 

[Pavilionaire]

If it IS a hung Parliament,inevitably it will be the Lib Dems who are hanged.This is because such a parliament will be short lived,do nothing,and a new election will soon follow.But the LibDems will have had to show their hand.Tory Lib Dems will be appalled if the LibDems back Labour.Likewise Labour LibDems will be horrified if they back the Tories.

In the follow up election these supporters will return to their natural,possibly traditional,parties,and the LibDem support will collapse,allowing their six remaining MPs to divide up their non existant "opposition" posts,and promise us income tax of 3%,bread,circuses,free university education,free foreign holidays ,the penny and the bun.

I disagree totally. Firstly, the Lib Dem national vote has consistently been around the 20% mark nationally for the past few elections, of which I suspect half would NEVER vote for one of the other two main parties.

Secondly, is there really such a thing as a "Tory Lib Dem" or a "Labour Lib Dem"? If someone votes Lib Dem then they're not Tory, are they?

Thirdly, there's the bloody-minded factor. If I'd have voted for a minority party and the result was a hung Parliament I'd regard that as a triumph. The climate is such that most poeple want to see the 2 main parties both get a bloody nose, and I believe it will take more than a second election to get the electorate to "fall into line" behind Brown or Cameron.

 

[Rookie]

If it does go to hung parliament the West Lothian question gets all the more important. Scottish MPs deciding what happens in England and all that

 

[beorhthelm]

Secondly, is there really such a thing as a "Tory Lib Dem" or a "Labour Lib Dem"? If someone votes Lib Dem then they're not Tory, are they?

there are left and right wings to any party, with the Lib Dem being more generally more centre than Labour. there is also a hell of alot of tactical protest votes that go their way. so i think its fair to say there are Tory/Labour Lib Dems

 

[Pavilionaire]

And I'd argue that's more than cancelled out by people who vote main party because although they like the sound of the Lib Dems best they believe the "wasted vote" theory.

 

[looney]

Any number of things could happen.

1. The Conservatives try and form a coalition government with another party. The most likely candidates are the LibDems, but not necessarily.

2. The Tories went into the General Election in 1997 as a minority government, propped up by the Unionists.

1 The most likley candidates have always been the unionists.

2. That isn't true, they won a 30 seat majority that was wittled down to about 18 I beleive.

 

[looney]

With PR one of the final blocks will be in place for the BNP to get into Government.

Although the tories hate them they hate the idea of a leftwing stitch up of the political system more and all bets would be off, so to speak.



Look at Israel, do you really think Likud want to share power with the religous crazies?

Never underestimate what the lust for power will do to men.

 

[Billy the Fish]

I thought a hung parliament just meant that it had a very big penis

 

[Gully]

there are left and right wings to any party, with the Lib Dem being more generally more centre than Labour. there is also a hell of alot of tactical protest votes that go their way. so i think its fair to say there are Tory/Labour Lib Dems

Very true, tactical voting definitely comes into play at General Elections, with many people trying to keep their least preferred choice of two options out of office.

I would place myself on the left wing of what used to be the Liberal party...more of a Liberal Socialist than anything else, until Labour moved more towards the centre. I would hate to see the Lib Dems doing a deal with the Tories...it would be like siding with the devil.

 

[looney]

.....it would be like siding with the devil.

But thankfully most people dont see democracy as some kind of religous covenant and more about the application or reason.

..

 

[Half Time Pies]

If the Lib Dems are serious, they will negotiate a deal that delivers proportional representation - and a PERMANENT state of affairs where ALL future general elections result in a hung parliament, with the government chosen by whoever is Lib Dem leader at the time.

This is the key for me and the reason why I will be voting Lib Dem. If they are able to form a coalition with either of the parties and force through a referendum on proportional representation then we might stand a chance of dispensing with our hugely unfair and undemocratic voting system. A system in which millions of people place votes that have no influence on which candidates are elected and hands power to a single party which enjoys the support of nowhere near a majority of voters.

 

[Gwylan]

2. That isn't true, they won a 30 seat majority that was wittled down to about 18 I beleive.

No, TLO was right. They lost their majority after the Barnsley East by-election in December 1996.

Major limped on as a minority government for five more months.