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How long will Scotland's period of transition last?
- Thread starter chips and gravy
- Start date
The Orange Seagull
Time Traveller
How long is a piece of string
?
?
Beach Hut
Brighton Bhuna Boy
I didn't realise they were in transition thought it was business as usual
Rougvie
Rising Damp
I was unlucky enough to be at last nights game (thank f*** it was a freebie) and I have to say Scotland played pretty well for the first 30 minutes or so, then it was like watching kids football the errors were just so basic it was untrue.
To be honest I lay the blame squarely at the feet of Vogts who is completely obsessed with very average English first and second division players who hardly get a game for their own clubs, its even more ridiculous that he will pick someone just because they play for a premiership club, well may have played once or twice in pre-season !! Darren Fletcher excepted.
No, they sooner they get shot of the fat little prick (objective) the quicker they will return to the sort of grinding out draws that we have come to expect from the national side.
I think a tenner on Gordon Strachan at the moment to take over after the first qualifing debacle is not a bad bet.
To be honest I lay the blame squarely at the feet of Vogts who is completely obsessed with very average English first and second division players who hardly get a game for their own clubs, its even more ridiculous that he will pick someone just because they play for a premiership club, well may have played once or twice in pre-season !! Darren Fletcher excepted.
No, they sooner they get shot of the fat little prick (objective) the quicker they will return to the sort of grinding out draws that we have come to expect from the national side.
I think a tenner on Gordon Strachan at the moment to take over after the first qualifing debacle is not a bad bet.
¡Cereal Killer!
Whale Oil Beef Hooked
They will go on and win the next world cup! 
It's largely a myth that football success is cyclical. There have been some outstanding Scotland International players over the years who would have been chosen in any World XI. In the sixties and seventies this was particularly true especially from the team which won the 1967 European Cup. I'm fairly certain that not one current Scotland International would feature today, nor for that matter would an England player. Surely Scotland should be able to improve upon their current FIFA ranking and at least make the finals of the 2006 World Cup. Is this wishful thinking?
NMH
Banned
fatbadger said:
Yes I am - Scotland is North of us !
(I know that because I hear the moanin' and wailin' frae ye auld beggars wae doon in Sussex
)
Easy 10
Brain dead MUG SHEEP
Afraid so.whitelion said:
There is absolutely no way I can see Scotland finishing above Italy and Norway in their qualifying group (other teams are Slovenia, Belarus and Moldova). Even if they did somehow scrape into 2nd place behind the Italians, they'd have to get an extremely fortunate draw in the Playoffs to have any chance.
Its sad, I genuinely would like Scotland to qualify. I like to see as many of the home nations at the World Cup as possible cos it just adds interest. But Scotland are just making up the numbers in the qualifying group now.
cheeseroll
New member
I passed this thread to a Blue nose mate of mine and paste his response here, this may (or not) be of interest..
//
I think Gordon is a great guy - but he quit because of stress - the
Scotland job would kill him.
I think my complaint on Vogts is that he is neither capable of
inspirational man-management nor, it seems, giving us a system that makes us hard to beat. At this rate, Andy Roxborough and Craig Brown begin to look good (despite the fact that it was under both these school teachers that Scotland started to lose its traditional fan base - through boredom!)
Sadly Scotland has also lost a huge core of its traditional fan base - most especially from the younger generations of Rangers supporters who grew up without the unspoken tradition of the Scotland team being largely white, Anglo-Saxon, probably Masonic Scots, and protestant Rangers players or fans. The young Rangers fans grew up on a diet of internationalists who
were all better than any peer player in a Scotland jersey - Laudrup, Gascoigne, Butcher, Woods, Hateley and they had no time for a boring Scotland team which frequently had too many non-Rangers players to attract interest. Too many young Rangers fans now prefer to wear England tops and fly Union Flags to indicate their loyalty to the Queen and their bigotry to
the Catholic religion. This saddens me greatly and to call the Scotland team "Jacobites" would cause the past Rangers and Scotland patriots to turn in their graves.
We are desperately crap - and yet we have some decent young talents - but where is our shape and organisation? Where is our professionalism? How can Barry Ferguson say that we need to understand that we can't "pass teams to death" but need to penetrate? Unbelievable. Why are we small and sometimes
not even wiry when average Asian teams now have muscular guys that can heave you off the ball? Why are Middle East countries, Americans and Africans all so much better than us? We don't need Gordon Strachan - we need a complete revamp of the way we teach kids to play the game.
The only guy that I'd like to see in charge of Scotland right now is George Graham - because he at least knew how to coach polayers to defend - he knew how to create a system - he understood players' mentality and he wasn't scared to play hard men that can crunch when required. Trouble is, I like him a lot and I'd hate to see his epitaph being a failed campaign for Scotland.
I'd just like to see the whole way in which the game is played and coached ripped apart and rebuilt.
Lastly on that subject of the bigots - I think you will find that Scots in Scotland get fairly pissed off by the English media and hence become quite vitriolic about England. Most Scots overseas accept the English for the lovely bunch of arrogant barstewards they are!!
//
There you go Jambo/Alba etc. anyone for George Graham ?
//
I think Gordon is a great guy - but he quit because of stress - the
Scotland job would kill him.
I think my complaint on Vogts is that he is neither capable of
inspirational man-management nor, it seems, giving us a system that makes us hard to beat. At this rate, Andy Roxborough and Craig Brown begin to look good (despite the fact that it was under both these school teachers that Scotland started to lose its traditional fan base - through boredom!)
Sadly Scotland has also lost a huge core of its traditional fan base - most especially from the younger generations of Rangers supporters who grew up without the unspoken tradition of the Scotland team being largely white, Anglo-Saxon, probably Masonic Scots, and protestant Rangers players or fans. The young Rangers fans grew up on a diet of internationalists who
were all better than any peer player in a Scotland jersey - Laudrup, Gascoigne, Butcher, Woods, Hateley and they had no time for a boring Scotland team which frequently had too many non-Rangers players to attract interest. Too many young Rangers fans now prefer to wear England tops and fly Union Flags to indicate their loyalty to the Queen and their bigotry to
the Catholic religion. This saddens me greatly and to call the Scotland team "Jacobites" would cause the past Rangers and Scotland patriots to turn in their graves.
We are desperately crap - and yet we have some decent young talents - but where is our shape and organisation? Where is our professionalism? How can Barry Ferguson say that we need to understand that we can't "pass teams to death" but need to penetrate? Unbelievable. Why are we small and sometimes
not even wiry when average Asian teams now have muscular guys that can heave you off the ball? Why are Middle East countries, Americans and Africans all so much better than us? We don't need Gordon Strachan - we need a complete revamp of the way we teach kids to play the game.
The only guy that I'd like to see in charge of Scotland right now is George Graham - because he at least knew how to coach polayers to defend - he knew how to create a system - he understood players' mentality and he wasn't scared to play hard men that can crunch when required. Trouble is, I like him a lot and I'd hate to see his epitaph being a failed campaign for Scotland.
I'd just like to see the whole way in which the game is played and coached ripped apart and rebuilt.
Lastly on that subject of the bigots - I think you will find that Scots in Scotland get fairly pissed off by the English media and hence become quite vitriolic about England. Most Scots overseas accept the English for the lovely bunch of arrogant barstewards they are!!
//
There you go Jambo/Alba etc. anyone for George Graham ?
Ex Shelton Seagull
New member
Scotland are in competition with these sides to qualify for World Cup 2006.
Italy - Were very poor in Portugal but are still one of the best sides in Europe, capable of beating anyone. I do fancy Scotland to get a result against them at Hampden, however I think they'll get a heavy beating in Italy much like Wales did.
Norway - Poor results in World Cup 2002 qualifying but reached the play-offs for Euro 2004 (battered by Spain though). Very strong and tough to beat side.
Slovenia - Qualified for Euro 2000 and World Cup 2002 and reached the play-offs for Euro 2004. One of the best Eastern European sides at the moment. Vogts organised the friendly against Hungary because they are a similar side to Slovenia. Not very encouraging for the 8th September was it?
I wouldn't take the away games against Moldova or Belarus too lightly. Both sides have shown improvment over the years.
The two opening games against Slovenia and Norway are at home and they really have to be looking at gaining at least 3 points, maybe 4, out of those two games. Thankfully they don't play Moldova until Ocotber because a Faroe style result ther would probably scupper the campaign before it has even begun.
It was surprising to read that some Rangers fans support England simply because they hate Celtic so much. I know some Manchester United fans dislike the England national side but at least they don't actively support another Country instead.
Italy - Were very poor in Portugal but are still one of the best sides in Europe, capable of beating anyone. I do fancy Scotland to get a result against them at Hampden, however I think they'll get a heavy beating in Italy much like Wales did.
Norway - Poor results in World Cup 2002 qualifying but reached the play-offs for Euro 2004 (battered by Spain though). Very strong and tough to beat side.
Slovenia - Qualified for Euro 2000 and World Cup 2002 and reached the play-offs for Euro 2004. One of the best Eastern European sides at the moment. Vogts organised the friendly against Hungary because they are a similar side to Slovenia. Not very encouraging for the 8th September was it?
I wouldn't take the away games against Moldova or Belarus too lightly. Both sides have shown improvment over the years.
The two opening games against Slovenia and Norway are at home and they really have to be looking at gaining at least 3 points, maybe 4, out of those two games. Thankfully they don't play Moldova until Ocotber because a Faroe style result ther would probably scupper the campaign before it has even begun.
It was surprising to read that some Rangers fans support England simply because they hate Celtic so much. I know some Manchester United fans dislike the England national side but at least they don't actively support another Country instead.
For Cheeseroll's mate:
Interesting point about the media. When I visit Scotland I'm always appalled by the parochial attitude of the Scottish national press. All the British titles have to proclaim themselves as Scottish, The Sun masthead which in England said 'Dedicated to the people of Britain' in Scotland said 'Dedicated to the people of Scotland'. Everything has to have a Scottish angle, a typical story might read: "President Bush (who once visted Scotland) had a meeting with Colin Powell (who once mentioned Scotland in a speech) yesterday. They didn't discuss Scotland but they discussed France (who were members of the Auld Alliance with Scotland against England). Then they discussed Bosnia which is in Europe, the same continent that Scotland's in."
I suppose given the fact that that newspapers printed in England don't give Scotland quite such a high profile might account for Scottish disdain.
Interesting point about the media. When I visit Scotland I'm always appalled by the parochial attitude of the Scottish national press. All the British titles have to proclaim themselves as Scottish, The Sun masthead which in England said 'Dedicated to the people of Britain' in Scotland said 'Dedicated to the people of Scotland'. Everything has to have a Scottish angle, a typical story might read: "President Bush (who once visted Scotland) had a meeting with Colin Powell (who once mentioned Scotland in a speech) yesterday. They didn't discuss Scotland but they discussed France (who were members of the Auld Alliance with Scotland against England). Then they discussed Bosnia which is in Europe, the same continent that Scotland's in."
I suppose given the fact that that newspapers printed in England don't give Scotland quite such a high profile might account for Scottish disdain.
Jambo Seagull
Well-known member
Good post from Cheeseroll's mate. The most soul=destroying thing about Scotland at the moment is that you see almost as many England tops worn in Scotland than Scotland. One of my best mates,a Gers fan, was at the Aberdeen - Rangers game last week. He sat next to two young lads both wearing England tops. he demanded why they were wearing them and their answer was that Scotland were shite. Some response. Aiden Mcgeady is another case inpoint. 18 years old, a tremendous talent, born and brought up in Glasgow of Scottish parents, scored on his debut for Celtic - his grandparents are Irish. Surprise, surprise, he's already played for the Republic. For that, he is a folk hero to the Celtic support. I hope he gets a career ending injury very soon. Typical weegie bigot.