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[Albion] Fabian Hürzeler **SINGED 15/06/2024**

Would Fabian Hurzeler be a good replacement for RDZ?


  • Total voters
    536
  • Poll closed .


Zeberdi

“Vorsprung durch Technik”
NSC Patron
Oct 20, 2022
5,695
Thought I would throw this one into the mix for fun and guess the next manager lark (apologies if he’s been mentioned before) - Sounds right up our street. A young and talented coach doing great stuff with St Pauli in the 2.Bundesliga - playing attractive football and winning matches on limited budget and losing key players to the Bundesliga. Playing out from the back, ‘De Zerbian progression’, controlling the tempo to invite the press in a possession based system that uses a ball playing GK and a left-sided progresser and a CB that ‘puts his sole on the ball’. The 3rd Key defender is used out of possession as a CB, in possession as a DM and using the two wingbacks/fullbacks to stretch the oppos defence. In attack, an inverted left winger with a talented striker. All sounds familiar?

https://analyticsfc.co.uk/blog/2023...laying-the-best-football-in-the-2-bundesliga/

Difference is, St Pauli are scoring goals.

EDIT - Following media releasing news that Brighton is interested - Poll added 6th June.
 
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GT49er

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Feb 1, 2009
47,667
Gloucester
Thought I would throw this one into the mix for fun and guess the next manager lark (apologies if he’s been mentioned before) - Sounds right up our street. A young and talented coach doing great stuff with St Pauli in the 2.Bundesliga - playing attractive football and winning matches on limited budget and losing key players to the Bundesliga. Playing out from the back, De Zerbian progression, controlling the tempo to invite the press in a possession based system that uses a ball playing GK and a left-sided progresser and a CB that puts his sole on the ball. The 3rd Key defender is used out of possession as a CB, in possession as a DM and using the two wingbacks/fullbacks to stretch the oppos defence. In attack, an inverted left winger with a talented striker. All sounds familiar?

https://analyticsfc.co.uk/blog/2023...laying-the-best-football-in-the-2-bundesliga/

Difference is, St Pauli are scoring goals.
"Playing out from the back, De Zerbian progression, controlling the tempo to invite the press in a possession based system that uses a ball playing GK" you say. Finding a manager that does that these days must be a rare trial - rare as hen's teeth! :lolol:
 




scwiffy

Well-known member
Jun 24, 2011
243
I think the “invite the press” /sole on the ball, De Zerbi trick was worked out and lost its effectiveness pretty quickly.

The main issue is when you play against opposition who are happy to sit back and counter - a style we notoriously did very bad against - they don’t mind you fannying about with the ball at the back. Against better teams they just soon realised it was a bait and stopped taking the bait when they saw it - good example was the bizarre Man City match at end of last season.

The second issue is that you need two extremely good and in tune central mids. It worked perfectly with Calciedo and Mac and although players like Gilmour and Gross did well and have better passing ability they didn’t have the speed and strength required to turn oncoming players or race back and win the ball adequately.

I get the feeling the ‘inviting the press’ genius is dead already
 




peterward

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Nov 11, 2009
11,760
I think the “invite the press” /sole on the ball, De Zerbi trick was worked out and lost its effectiveness pretty quickly.

The main issue is when you play against opposition who are happy to sit back and counter - a style we notoriously did very bad against - they don’t mind you fannying about with the ball at the back. Against better teams they just soon realised it was a bait and stopped taking the bait when they saw it - good example was the bizarre Man City match at end of last season.

The second issue is that you need two extremely good and in tune central mids. It worked perfectly with Calciedo and Mac and although players like Gilmour and Gross did well and have better passing ability they didn’t have the speed and strength required to turn oncoming players or race back and win the ball adequately.

I get the feeling the ‘inviting the press’ genius is dead already
💯 it's brilliant when it works and was more so when it was new and nobody could work it out.

Now everybody had worked it out, low block, don't press high, counter...... they win, we lose.

It's lost its edge.
 


Zeberdi

“Vorsprung durch Technik”
NSC Patron
Oct 20, 2022
5,695
I think the “invite the press” /sole on the ball, De Zerbi trick was worked out and lost its effectiveness pretty quickly.

The main issue is when you play against opposition who are happy to sit back and counter - a style we notoriously did very bad against - they don’t mind you fannying about with the ball at the back. Against better teams they just soon realised it was a bait and stopped taking the bait when they saw it - good example was the bizarre Man City match at end of last season.

The second issue is that you need two extremely good and in tune central mids. It worked perfectly with Calciedo and Mac and although players like Gilmour and Gross did well and have better passing ability they didn’t have the speed and strength required to turn oncoming players or race back and win the ball adequately.

I get the feeling the ‘inviting the press’ genius is dead already
Hurzeler has just got St Pauli promoted to the Bundesliega after a long run of wins so I would say his system is working wouldn’t you? One of the differences is he has reduced the height of his press out of possession and plays 3 at the back among other things after conceding too many goals - it’s not De Zerbi ball but similar with the tweaks I think we could benefit from.

Rather than provide an appraisal of RDZ’s system which Hürzeler‘s system isn’t - it’s very much his own - perhaps read the analytics posted above?.

You may not have like RDZ and there was admittedly a weakness in his DNA (IMO it required a level of skill we didn’t possess after selling our MF) but however you see it, whatever manager succeeds him will likely build on what he developed as he built on Potterball. To me FH is a good fit ( as I’m sure are quite a few other young managers in top flight that PB/TB has tracked)
 
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GJN1

Well-known member
Nov 4, 2014
1,473
Brighton
I think there might be something in this. Here's what I saw at the weekend...
Screenshot 2024-05-23 at 11.48.16.png
 






Beanstalk

Well-known member
Apr 5, 2017
2,766
London
I think the “invite the press” /sole on the ball, De Zerbi trick was worked out and lost its effectiveness pretty quickly.

The main issue is when you play against opposition who are happy to sit back and counter - a style we notoriously did very bad against - they don’t mind you fannying about with the ball at the back. Against better teams they just soon realised it was a bait and stopped taking the bait when they saw it - good example was the bizarre Man City match at end of last season.

The second issue is that you need two extremely good and in tune central mids. It worked perfectly with Calciedo and Mac and although players like Gilmour and Gross did well and have better passing ability they didn’t have the speed and strength required to turn oncoming players or race back and win the ball adequately.

I get the feeling the ‘inviting the press’ genius is dead already
It's been copied by Arteta and Pep to become quite a key part of their style. I don't think it's dead at all. We just lost the three players who were best at it (Colwill, Caicedo and Mac Allister).
 


scwiffy

Well-known member
Jun 24, 2011
243
Hurzeler has just got St Pauli promoted to the Bundesliega after a long run of wins so I would say his system is working wouldn’t you? One of the differences is he has reduced the height of his press out of possession and plays 3 at the back among other things after conceding too many goals - it’s not De Zerbi ball but similar with the tweaks I think we could benefit from.

Rather than provide an appraisal of RDZ’s system perhaps read the analytics posted above of Hürzeler ’s System.

You may not have like RDZ and there was admittedly a weakness in his DNA (IMO it required a level of skill we didn’t possess after selling our MF) but however you see it, whatever manager succeeds him will likely build on what he developed as he built on Potterball. To me FH is a good fit ( as I’m sure are quite a few other young managers in top flight that PB/TB has tracked)
I'm not talking about the bigger picture or about Hurzeler in particular. Of course the whole tactic can be different with style similarities, I'm only making a point about one element you drew similarities to RDZs tactics that I think has lost its potency in the EPL.

It's been copied by Arteta and Pep to become quite a key part of their style. I don't think it's dead at all. We just lost the three players who were best at it (Colwill, Caicedo and Mac Allister).
I'm saying the genius of it is dead, oppositions figured that part of our game out pretty quickly and unlike Arteta and Pep we didn't have a plan B or same calibre of players.

----
All this is to say that if we are looking for a new manager, I think 'baiting the press' isn't something unique and maybe isn't even a potent tool for our team anymore.
 




Zeberdi

“Vorsprung durch Technik”
NSC Patron
Oct 20, 2022
5,695
Indeed, it’s not unique - many teams play out from the back when facing/inviting a high press as an element of an overall system of play. Some combine it effectively and with long balls over the top as does Hürzeler ( that’s part of the plan B when the oppo refuses to engage) but you need a good forward to hold up play ( like Haaland does at Citeh) when hoofing it long which we seem to be struggling with a bit.

Pauli also have some great finishers too which make a difference again something we have struggled with.

But this is all just to say, here’s a relatively unknown manager to Brighton fans that maybe hadn’t come under anyone’s radar here so just to say casually and in passing that this is the type of talented and young manager (who’s just got his Bundesleiga2 team into the Bundesleiga after something like losing 7 out of 38 games) - that I think could improve us by building on what RDZ left us with.
 
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A1X

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Sep 1, 2017
19,203
Deepest, darkest Sussex




Coldwaltham Seagull

Active member
Mar 8, 2024
95
Perhaps one for the future if whoever we appoint in the next couple of weeks doesn't work out. Will definitely be keeping an eye on St Pauli's progress next season
 


Zeberdi

“Vorsprung durch Technik”
NSC Patron
Oct 20, 2022
5,695
Perhaps one for the future if whoever we appoint in the next couple of weeks doesn't work out. Will definitely be keeping an eye on St Pauli's progress next season

And he’s keeping his eye on us 😉

He visited Brighton in the winter break - at the time, his contract was running down (by this window) and he was in drawn out negotiations with SP over renewing his contract (he wanted an exit clause apparently).

“St. Pauli's Hürzeler studying soccer in England​

Coach Hürzeler took inspiration from England during the winter break.

Fabian Hürzeler also used the short winter break to study English soccer. The FC St. Pauli coach watched matches from Arsenal, Manchester City and Brighton & Hove Albion, a club currently celebrated for its style of play. "It's no secret that I simply see principles that suit us and that we try to implement," said the coach at the second division [promoted now to Bundesliga] club's training kick-off on Tuesday - referring in particular to Brighton's game.

Hürzeler spoke of a great experience in England. "New ideas and new possibilities have also been added," said the coach. "Of course, they are still different types of players. So it makes no sense to copy another team. But you can extract elements." He watched four games in five days.”

January 2 2024


 
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Zeberdi

“Vorsprung durch Technik”
NSC Patron
Oct 20, 2022
5,695
You're certainly doing the homework Zeb!
Not really, the link just came up on something else I was looking at relating to the Bundesliga so found this article by accident but I really like this coach better than McK or some of the others being discussed in the media or on here (such as Potter ffs!) - he seems to fit our profile and ethos.

It would be hard to entice him away from SP this season though.
 








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