Brighton is 5th least affordable city in UK

[mikeyjh]

Census information says household income in Brighton is just below the national average. The same is true of the whole coastal strip between Newhaven and Littlehampton. Household income in Reading is on average a whacking one third higher.

And that includes about 20% commuters to London.

If I can be permitted a pedantic moment, 'household income' is slightly different to 'salaries'......... a whole range of factors can affect HI.... but the poster I responded to referred specifically to salaries, hence my questioning.

Okay, but the point I was trying to make is that income is below average, cost of housing way above and thinking that this can't be easy for people.....

 

[Mellotron]

To buy my first place and not live in somewhere the size of a shed, I had to move to Worthing. Have vague thoughts of moving back closer to Brighton in the future but might be unrealistic while house prices are as they are over that way.

 

[Peter Grummit]

Census information says household income in Brighton is just below the national average. The same is true of the whole coastal strip between Newhaven and Littlehampton. Household income in Reading is on average a whacking one third higher.

And that includes about 20% commuters to London.

But house prices vary hugely along the coastal strip. I had a look at the average prices of houses currently for sale: http://www.home.co.uk/guides/house_prices_menu.htm?location=brighton

Brighton £460k
Hove £491k
Southwick £371k
Seaford £305k
Newhaven £274k
Lancing £221k

So if you do want to stay local and get on the housing market, you probably have to 'start' somewhere a bit further out within the conurbation. If you want to live in then heart of the City then you are more likely to have to rent. I accept that these are still very high prices in affordability terms, but remember these are average asking prices not 'first rung of the ladder' prices.

I don't disagree that the city needs more housing, nor that Londoners selling up for ridiculous prices and moving down to commute hasn't inflated local prices. But the reality is less clearcut than suggested on this thread.

PG

 

[Guinness Boy]

But house prices vary hugely along the coastal strip. I had a look at the average prices of houses currently for sale: http://www.home.co.uk/guides/house_prices_menu.htm?location=brighton

Brighton £460k
Hove £491k
Southwick £371k
Seaford £305k
Newhaven £274k
Lancing £221k

So if you do want to stay local and get on the housing market, you probably have to 'start' somewhere a bit further out within the conurbation. If you want to live in then heart of the City then you are more likely to have to rent. I accept that these are still very high prices in affordability terms, but remember these are average asking prices not 'first rung of the ladder' prices.

I don't disagree that the city needs more housing, nor that Londoners selling up for ridiculous prices and moving down to commute hasn't inflated local prices. But the reality is less clearcut than suggested on this thread.

PG

We moved to Portslade when it was a "rung". Now there is a small enclave (Norway St / St Aubyns Road / St Andrews Rd) that is becoming pretty Hove-esque in terms of price and people living there.

It's good to get started on the property ladder but I wonder what happens when the prices in the rungs start to go up? I'm afraid I'm with Happy Pig. Despite being a home owner myself I wish they were regarded as places to live rather than investments.

 

[Ali_rrr]

My worry entirely.


I'm going to leave Uni this year £20k in debt, and be moving back in with my parents. I haven't got a clue how i'll do it, it's quite worrying to think about in all honesty.

You're lucky you will only be 20k in debt. If I go to uni in England, that will be less than my tuition fees. Exactly why I'm going to Holland for it.

 

[pipkin112]

We moved to Portslade when it was a "rung". Now there is a small enclave (Norway St / St Aubyns Road / St Andrews Rd) that is becoming pretty Hove-esque in terms of price and people living there.

I agree with this bit. I have worked in Norway Street since 1985, and I can't believe how much some of the properties are selling for.

 

[Citrus]

The Planning Inspector (going through the draft City Plan) called on the council to re-think 'the urban fringe'. She is basically saying, if you want 16-20,000 instead of 11,500, forget the notion of parks, greenery and leisure space. (I'm paraphrasing.)

http://www.brighton-hove.gov.uk/sites/brighton-hove.gov.uk/files/ID-21 Letter to council Dec 13.pdf

The Frank Gehry Towers are not the answer - they could have been a small part of the solution, but not the solution.

Housing prices in Brighton and Hove (and London) are obviously reflective of high demand to live in the area - the only realistic solution to this is to create more supply. In reality this means dramatically loosening development restrictions on the urban fringe and planning controls on density in the city centre.

Toronto is facing the exact same problem (but on a much larger scale) right now due to the implementation of Greenbelt policy in the 2000s (house prices have doubled in the past 10 years), although the City and Province have been more open to high-density development and as a result it has experienced the largest condo boom North America has ever seen.

 

[Fungus]

It's work in tourism or nothing. Plus the tourism, with its celebrity chefs and second home owning Londoners also drives the house prices up.

Second homes are a huge problem here in Truro, and generally in Cornwall - I'd vote for a huge tax increase on second/empty homes. There are umpteen housing sites being pushed by developers and central government for new houses, while existing ones stand empty.

 

[The Large One]

Housing prices in Brighton and Hove (and London) are obviously reflective of high demand to live in the area - the only realistic solution to this is to create more supply.

This is a national problem which has been brewing for 30 years.

There are some on here who don't believe that public funds should be used to ease housing supply issues, even though there is a will - especially regarding 'affordable' housing - among local authorities to do so. But if the private sector - which has had to become obliged to include 30% affordable housing in any large project - doesn't see profit in it, nothing happens.

Which had led us to where we are now, sadly.

In reality this means dramatically loosening development restrictions on the urban fringe and planning controls on density in the city centre.

To a point, yes. But negative social conditions can be created with new-build projects in places like 'the urban fringe' if they don't have the proper associated infrastructure and amenities. It's not just a case of plonking housing somewhere. Even if the Planning Inspector is raising concerns, their record in this city isn't that great. Look at how they formed their opinion the last time the Local Plan was discussed 11 years ago - and that includes their opinion on low-cost housing...

 

[Guinness Boy]

I agree with this bit. I have worked in Norway Street since 1985, and I can't believe how much some of the properties are selling for.

We live in St Andrews Rd & one of our friends who rents there has had her house put up for sale by the landlord because he is trying his luck in the current market. When there's a property boom in the Slarde you know something's up.

 

[Citrus]

This is a national problem which has been brewing for 30 years.

There are some on here who don't believe that public funds should be used to ease housing supply issues, even though there is a will - especially regarding 'affordable' housing - among local authorities to do so. But if the private sector - which has had to become obliged to include 30% affordable housing in any large project - doesn't see profit in it, nothing happens.

Which had led us to where we are now, sadly.

Demand is high across many parts of the UK, but definitely not all of it. Plenty of vacant housing in the north of England. Whether or not this is a solution to the problems where demand is high is another conversation (I'm interested to see what the effects of HS2 are on property prices in the north - particularly central Brum).

The rights and wrongs of publicly-subsidised housing is also another discussion, although you have to wonder which kind of government is going to invest in it heavily enough to solve the problem.

To a point, yes. But negative social conditions can be created with new-build projects in places like 'the urban fringe' if they don't have the proper associated infrastructure and amenities. It's not just a case of plonking housing somewhere. Even if the Planning Inspector is raising concerns, their record in this city isn't that great. Look at how they formed their opinion the last time the Local Plan was discussed 11 years ago - and that includes their opinion on low-cost housing...

I agree, within reason. Of course the associated infrastructure to go with new development is fundamental. It is also obvious that poorly planned (/public sector planned) developments in the 70s and 80s (tower blocks in parks) have led to hugely negative social impacts. However, personally I fail to see the problem with allowing for high-rise development where the market dictates (likely the city centre and near the station). Generally speaking, the private sector will build where the market demands. When the choices for my generation are to either rent or relocate before affording property in London/Brighton, then the negative social impacts of the current situation speak for themselves.

 

[CorgiRegisteredFriend]

My two kids 20 and 23 are living at home at the moment and benefiting from being in central Hove- near everything, by the sea etc. However, I cant imagine a time when they will be able to raise a deposit to buy somewhere locally. The days of kids living at home are with us for a while yet and it is increasingly more likely to happen.

 

[CorgiRegisteredFriend]

We live in St Andrews Rd & one of our friends who rents there has had her house put up for sale by the landlord because he is trying his luck in the current market. When there's a property boom in the Slarde you know something's up.

Those St Andrews houses go for as much as 400k and when they go on the market they are not on for long. What I would like to know is who can afford them?

 

[Vegas Seagull]

Second homes are a huge problem here in Truro, and generally in Cornwall - I'd vote for a huge tax increase on second/empty homes. There are umpteen housing sites being pushed by developers and central government for new houses, while existing ones stand empty.

Plenty of work for builders, roofers, sparks & chippies then...trebles all round

 

[Bry Nylon]

I'm 25, I live and work in Brighton.

I'm on a half-decent wage (for my age) and I'm saving up for a deposit for a mortgage...
...to buy in Gloucestershire.

I couldn't afford to pay a mortgage (in Brighton) now and to be honest, I don't want to be struggling each month down in Brighton when I could have a much more affordable house in the Cotswolds.

If it is any consolation I believe you will have a far better quality of life in the Cotswolds. It is a beautiful part of the country.

It is only my opinion, but I believe Brighton is massively over-rated. On the occasions time I come back the rubbish and squalor and shitty service is all too prevalent. Not somewhere I would want to live.

 

[Vegas Seagull]

If it is any consolation I believe you will have a far better quality of life in the Cotswolds. It is a beautiful part of the country.

It is only my opinion, but I believe Brighton is massively over-rated. On the occasions time I come back the rubbish and squalor and shitty service is all too prevalent. Not somewhere I would want to live.

Just because you prefer leaves, doesn't mean someone else doesn't prefer a Theatre

 

[Mellor 3 Ward 4]

Where EXACTLY are these 16,000 + people living NOW?[/QUOT

Not in sussex.

Sussex has become to South London what Essex was to the east end 20 years ago, when the eastenders moved out to Romford, Basildon, Braintree etc...

Anyone who can possibly afford to is moving out of South London, Croydon etc. and heading south. Look at the number of houses going up in and around H Heath, b.hill, Crawley, Horsham etc.

 

[Creaky]

This is all part of an long running trend, and is what happens when housing policy merely encourages market forces. One policy that would have a real effect would be a land value tax, which will act as a disincentive/exorbitant cost for over popular sites (rates on Oxford Street in London, or Churchill Square in Brighton, for instance, would rise substantially), and act as an incentive for people to move into those un- and under-occupied housing that litter so many parts of the country -- mainly those de-industrialised areas. A Land Value Tax has long been a Green Party policy, so Westdene Seagull will no doubt think it's a dreadful idea, but Labour are increasingly warming to the idea under Miliband, and I wouldn't be surprised if they put it into their forthcoming election manifesto.

LVT is based on the value of the land irrespective of what is actually built on it. In order to apply such a tax every plot of land in the UK will need to be valued.

Explain to me, if you have a street, (or a whole area for that matter), that is fully developed with different types of properties and has not had an empty plot come up for sale in decades, how you place a valuation on the land alone?

You can't even make comparisons with similar areas to check if your valuations are close to the mark as sales of empty land plots are relatively rare.

The total tax revenue from LVT will have to be the same as that currently generated by council tax, stamp duty and business rates so those expecting it to reduce the tax they pay would be in for a shock.

 

[StonehamPark]

If it is any consolation I believe you will have a far better quality of life in the Cotswolds. It is a beautiful part of the country.

It is only my opinion, but I believe Brighton is massively over-rated. On the occasions time I come back the rubbish and squalor and shitty service is all too prevalent. Not somewhere I would want to live.

I do agree, in part.

I lived in Gloucestershire for just over two years and it was lovely, although moving back up there will prevent me from watching the football whenever I like and I'll be hours away from my family. Although that does have its benefits!

 

[Guinness Boy]

Those St Andrews houses go for as much as 400k and when they go on the market they are not on for long. What I would like to know is who can afford them?

We paid lots less than that for one of the crappier smaller ones but you're right because that's exactly the figure the chancy landlord's looking for. And to answer "who lives in a house like this" solicitors. management consultants, plumbers (and yes, from your name I guess you're one but he bought cheap), IT consultants and people who do "something to do with finance in Kent" because I drink with them.