[Politics] Are Labour going to turn this country around?

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

Labour deserve some credit for concluding a trade deal with India today. I just hope that it doesn't compromise our ability to re-enter the Single Market / Customs Union should we wish to do so in the future.

Just to put that into context, according to the ONS, India is 2% of our imports and 2% of our exports. The EU is 47% of exports and 53% of imports. USA is 10% of imports, 16% of exports. Therefore, any growth in exports to India will be greatly outweighed by the drop in exports to USA caused by Trump's tariffs. And that's if we can get our stuff through the Suez Canal, which is currently a warzone.

You weren't to know, of course, but that turned out to be a new pinnacle chapter
in the "nothing can possibly go wrong, now" chronicles

 

[jcdenton08]

…. and win a second term?

That old nsc chestnut of the Winter Fuel Payment has come back to bite, even Labour ministers are now accepting this. Reeves has time on her side to do something tangible and generally acceptable before next winter to end this distraction. Otherwise like Nick Clegg and student loans or the Poll Tax, it will really hurt Labour.

I fear for them. Some way off and plenty of time for some crowd pleasing enticers, but it’s not going to end well without a change of course, especially in the perceived treatment of the elderly.

 

[Is it PotG?]

I would think Lucy Powell is now on a very sticky wicket after her damaging g remarks

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...man-bbc-louise-casey-government-b2747134.html

 

[abc]

I heard in the radio someone claiming that if they taxes everyone who has £20m or more (assets, cash? Dunno) an extra 2% on their wealth, this would raise £21bn.

Is this feasible? Accurate? Possible?

I had a coffee yesterday with a friend who is an accountant with some very high net worth clients, so I asked him the question. He was (from his clients perspective) pretty relaxed about the concept of a wealth tax. He said fixed assets such as property and land would just be moved into a Ltd co and thus protected whilst other assets like super yachts and Ferraris would be registered overseas (if they are not already).

He also said he has some that would still be hit by a wealth tax and all are ready to leave the Uk and pay 100% of the tax they do pay to another country.

Please don’t shoot the messenger but whilst I’m sure it’s not quite as simple as he suggested, it does seem to be a risk that we could end up with a lower total tax revenue in total.

Not a tax expert but can’t help feel an increase in CGT and corp tax would be more effective along with the removal of tax free status on so called charities such as the C of E with assets in excess of £10 billion.

 

[Is it PotG?]

I had a coffee yesterday with a friend who is an accountant with some very high net worth clients, so I asked him the question. He was (from his clients perspective) pretty relaxed about the concept of a wealth tax. He said fixed assets such as property and land would just be moved into a Ltd co and thus protected whilst other assets like super yachts and Ferraris would be registered overseas (if they are not already).

He also said he has some that would still be hit by a wealth tax and all are ready to leave the Uk and pay 100% of the tax they do pay to another country.

Please don’t shoot the messenger but whilst I’m sure it’s not quite as simple as he suggested, it does seem to be a risk that we could end up with a lower total tax revenue in total.

Not a tax expert but can’t help feel an increase in CGT and corp tax would be more effective along with the removal of tax free status on so called charities such as the C of E with assets in excess of £10 billion.

Indeed.

Such folk are, and remain wealthy for a reason.

 

[BenGarfield]

I had a coffee yesterday with a friend who is an accountant with some very high net worth clients, so I asked him the question. He was (from his clients perspective) pretty relaxed about the concept of a wealth tax. He said fixed assets such as property and land would just be moved into a Ltd co and thus protected whilst other assets like super yachts and Ferraris would be registered overseas (if they are not already).

He also said he has some that would still be hit by a wealth tax and all are ready to leave the Uk and pay 100% of the tax they do pay to another country.

Please don’t shoot the messenger but whilst I’m sure it’s not quite as simple as he suggested, it does seem to be a risk that we could end up with a lower total tax revenue in total.

Not a tax expert but can’t help feel an increase in CGT and corp tax would be more effective along with the removal of tax free status on so called charities such as the C of E with assets in excess of £10 billion.

Let the rich go if they want to. Their tax doesnt pay for anything at national level. we should tax the rich because they are too rich and powerful not because the state needs their money

 

[Is it PotG?]

Let the rich go if they want to. Their tax doesnt pay for anything at national level. we should tax the rich because they are too rich and powerful not because the state needs their money

Sssh, don't tell the Greens that.

Their entire plans revolve around 'those with the broadest shoulders coughing up a bit more'.

 

[Curious Orange]

Can Labour sort out the energy market in the UK? An interesting discussion with the Octopus Energy CEO.

 

[Fritz the Cat]

Let the rich go if they want to. Their tax doesnt pay for anything at national level. we should tax the rich because they are too rich and powerful not because the state needs their money

The idea that 'the rich are too rich' is profoundly sinister. In the 1920s in the Soviet Union [then including Ukraine] millions of peasants were murdered on the grounds that they were 'too rich'. Who decides who 'the rich' are ? Who decides who is 'too rich' ? Will hammering them with taxes make everyone else richer ? Or will it reduce everyone to the same dismal standard ?
There's a debate to be had about tax and the taxing of wealth in particular in the UK - but if it's nothing more than hatred for people fuelled by a desire for political retribution then you've lost the argument before you've begun.

 

[Biscuit]

Can Labour sort out the energy market in the UK? An interesting discussion with the Octopus Energy CEO.

I remain convinced British-produced energy will get us out of the mess we're in.

We need a renewable grid, for such, but it you need a mix. Nuclear *must* be apart of that.

 

[WATFORD zero]

Sssh, don't tell the Greens that.

Their entire plans revolve around 'those with the broadest shoulders coughing up a bit more'.

Absolutely OUTRAGEOUS

At least you know you won't get any of that nonsense with Nige and Kemi

 

[Is it PotG?]

Absolutely OUTRAGEOUS

At least you know you won't get any of that nonsense with Nige and Kemi

You miss the point, as per the norm.

 

[abc]

Let the rich go if they want to. Their tax doesnt pay for anything at national level. we should tax the rich because they are too rich and powerful not because the state needs their money

That makes no sense. The richest 1% pay 30% of the total tax revenue and the 6 richest paid £3billion between them. I think we might miss their tax just a teeny weeny bit if they all buggered off

 

[Blue3]

It appears Labour are actually doing an lot of good work despite the bad press

 

[Is it PotG?]

It appears Labour are actually doing an lot of good work despite the bad press

Appearances CAN be deceptive.

I think most folk will see where we are in a couple of years down the line.

 

[A1X]

It appears Labour are actually doing an lot of good work despite the bad press

As ever. Being Labour in Government is politics on Difficult mode as the press are basically all gunning for you for things they would give the Conservative party’s completely free pass for.

 

[Commander]

Appearances CAN be deceptive.

I think most folk will see where we are in a couple of years down the line.

They won't though, will they? They'll just side with their tribe, regardless of whatever happens. Just like you will.

 

[Is it PotG?]

They won't though, will they? They'll just side with their tribe, regardless of whatever happens. Just like you will.

Nonsense.

There will be tangible ways to guage the level of success, it won't be down to pure opinion.

 

[Pavilionaire]

I had a coffee yesterday with a friend who is an accountant with some very high net worth clients, so I asked him the question. He was (from his clients perspective) pretty relaxed about the concept of a wealth tax. He said fixed assets such as property and land would just be moved into a Ltd co and thus protected whilst other assets like super yachts and Ferraris would be registered overseas (if they are not already).

He also said he has some that would still be hit by a wealth tax and all are ready to leave the Uk and pay 100% of the tax they do pay to another country.

Please don’t shoot the messenger but whilst I’m sure it’s not quite as simple as he suggested, it does seem to be a risk that we could end up with a lower total tax revenue in total.

Not a tax expert but can’t help feel an increase in CGT and corp tax would be more effective along with the removal of tax free status on so called charities such as the C of E with assets in excess of £10 billion.

High Net Worth individuals are usually much more globally mobile than the rest of us, and so if there are tax havens and jurisdictions offering low tax to attract capital then they will gravitate to those places and place their assets there.

However, such a global system means those that access low tax jurisdictions will see their wealth grow faster than those who try and work within a higher tax, developed economy and - ultimately - by concentrating more wealth into the hands of the few who then take it offshore it means that with stagnant growth but rising inflation the tax burden is increasingly being shifted onto ordinary working people.

If a billionaire makes a gain on the sale of capital assets they pay a top rate here of 24% Capital Gains Tax. However, if a owner-managed director of a UK limited company manages to earn more than c. £50K profit then for each £1 of profit they extract over that figure they're facing c. 25% corporation tax and then c. 34% on the remainder - so a marginal rate of tax of c. 50%, which is more than double the likes of Rishi Sunak pays on gains when he sells some shares or a property in his portfolio.

If that director has kids they will potentially lose some/all of their Child Benefit, which is in effect a 10% tax charge on income between £60k-£80K, so if you have the temerity to exceed the £50,270 Higher Rate you can quickly be facing an effective tax rate of 60% on your trading profits.

This 60% marginal rate rears its ugly head again if your income exceeds £100K as you start losing lose your Personal Allowance.

The only way round this is to invest in pensions, which is good news for the super-rich as they will control the pension funds.

Politically, it is no surprise incumbents leader are increasingly finding it hard to stay in power because they can't deliver on the promises they make on jobs, growth, lower taxes because wealth inequality is getting worse, year-on-year. The problem is then made worse by fertility rates in decline, people living longer and people choosing to opt for a shorter working week for 'work/life balance'.

We are in a doom loop where the only way out is to globally look to reduce the tax havens and get more harmonisation of tax policy. However, with grifters and crooks like Trump and Putin in charge there is little prospect of this happening.

 

[Boys 9d]