[Politics] Brexit

Herr Tubthumper · Mar 23, 2019

JC Footy Genius said:
You don't believe in enacting the democratic results of elections, therefore, don't respect democracy

We do. We really do. But, I have no idea what the public think of Brexit three years on from the referendum. There’s been general elections in less time. And I have no idea what they think of Mays plan. So bring on democracy and see what the will of the people is.

nicko31 · Mar 23, 2019

pastafarian said:
Eh? You just said there were a million dick heads there

Glad you are keeping up your fine contributions to this thread, well done

JC Footy Genius · Mar 23, 2019

birthofanorange said:
Again, democracy gives people the right to change their minds/think again.
You are trying to deny them that democratic right.
But thank you for your opinion.

Yes, change their mind after the previous democratic result has been enacted. Only accepting and enacting democratic results you like and keep asking the question until you get the right answer if you don't .... all very EU.

You're welcome.

birthofanorange · Mar 23, 2019

nicko31 said:
Glad you are keeping up your fine contributions to this thread, well done

Yes, I was willing to engage with him/her, but I see no need now.

nicko31 · Mar 23, 2019

Herr Tubthumper said:
We do. We really do. But, I have no idea what the public think of Brexit three years on from the referendum. There’s been general elections in less time. And I have no idea what they think of Mays plan. So bring on democracy and see what the will of the people is.

Its OK to keep asking parliament over and over again, intersperse with bullying and bribes. Yet the public are denied any say

May isn't quite a facist but she is authoritarian. That's her style...

pastafarian · Mar 23, 2019

birthofanorange said:
Again, democracy gives people the right to change their minds/think again.
You are trying to deny them that democratic right.
But thank you for your opinion.

No one is denying your right to change your mind, follow the correct democratic path, and vote to rejoin the EU after we have left.
All you need is a willing government in charge to apply to be members of the EU and then the public voting to rejoin. Good luck.
Lets see if the membership terms will win over staying out if the EU is so wonderful......for some reason remainers are aghast at this democratic option

JC Footy Genius · Mar 23, 2019

Herr Tubthumper said:
We do. We really do. But, I have no idea what the public think of Brexit three years on from the referendum. There’s been general elections in less time. And I have no idea what they think of Mays plan. So bring on democracy and see what the will of the people is.

We had a general election in 2017 over 80% of the public voted for parties promising to enact the referendum ... how many goes do you want?

birthofanorange · Mar 23, 2019

JC Footy Genius said:
Yes, change their mind after the previous democratic result has been enacted. Only accepting and enacting democratic results you like and keep asking the question until you get the right answer if you don't .... all very EU.

You're welcome.

The only options were Leave or Remain. I, (as a Remainer) would have liked more information about the pros & cons of both.
Nearly 3 years on, I have it.....as have you. My opinion may (or may not) have changed, given the intervening years.
Are you denying my (and others) democratic right to change my mind?

Herr Tubthumper · Mar 23, 2019

JC Footy Genius said:
We had a general election in 2017 over 80% of the public voted for parties promising to enact the referendum ... how many goes do you want?

They might have promised that, and promised it with good and honest intentions....but the reality is they’re clearly incapable of doing so.

Hampster Gull · Mar 23, 2019

JC Footy Genius said:
We had a general election in 2017 over 80% of the public voted for parties promising to enact the referendum ... how many goes do you want?

birthofanorange · Mar 23, 2019

pastafarian said:
No one is denying your right to change your mind, follow the correct democratic path, and vote to rejoin the EU after we have left.
All you need is a willing government in charge to apply to be members of the EU and then the public voting to rejoin. Good luck.
Lets see if the membership terms will win over staying out if the EU is so wonderful......for some reason remainers are aghast at this democratic option

Why would anyone want to vote to re-open the stable door after the horse has bolted?
This is way too important for making a stand on a (I use the term loosely) principle of what you interpret 'democracy' to be.
I honestly think you'd be happy to cut off the country's nose to spite it's face, just for the sheer Hell of it.
Let the people decide, now you, me and they, all know a little more.
What are you afraid of?

Herr Tubthumper · Mar 23, 2019

Hampster Gull said:

He believes the promises of MPs.....bless.

pastafarian · Mar 23, 2019

birthofanorange said:
Why would anyone want to vote to re-open the stable door after the horse has bolted?
This is way too important for making a stand on a (I use the term loosely) principle of what you interpret 'democracy' to be.
I honestly think you'd be happy to cut off the country's nose to spite it's face, just for the sheer Hell of it.
Let the people decide, now you, me and they, all know a little more.
What are you afraid of?

What do you know now about the EU that you didnt know before you voted?

JC Footy Genius · Mar 23, 2019

birthofanorange said:
The only options were Leave or Remain. I, (as a Remainer) would have liked more information about the pros & cons of both.
Nearly 3 years on, I have it.....as have you. My opinion may (or may not) have changed, given the intervening years.
Are you denying my (and others) democratic right to change my mind?

Yes, and a majority voted to leave. Nope, I'm just expecting you to respect UK democratic norms of enacting democratic results. Once we have left we can rejoin if a majority change their mind.

PILTDOWN MAN · Mar 23, 2019

birthofanorange said:
The only options were Leave or Remain. I, (as a Remainer) would have liked more information about the pros & cons of both.
Nearly 3 years on, I have it.....as have you. My opinion may (or may not) have changed, given the intervening years.
Are you denying my (and others) democratic right to change my mind?

You have a democratic right to change your mind at any time but that doesn't give you the right to call for referendum every time.

Do we really know the outcome of leave/stay three years on? I still don't, there's still loads from both sides that is frankly bullshit. We might have a slightly more informed choice however it's still laced with supposition.

A women come in to my local earlier who had just come back from the march. We had a chat about things and whilst I believe a second referendum is wrong I can appreciate it may give clarity (hopefully). She then started on about the fact the EU had kept peace in Europe blah blah blah. I said to her now your losing all credibility in your argument and here is the problem. If we could stop this tosh and spoke of the true benefits of staying and changing from within and showing Europe we're not going to be the cash cow we are at the moment, then remain would win.

JC Footy Genius · Mar 23, 2019

Herr Tubthumper said:
They might have promised that, and promised it with good and honest intentions....but the reality is they’re clearly incapable of doing so.

Good and honest intentions?! They are politicians.

If it's Ok to ignore referendum results and general election manifesto commitments what's the point of democracy/voting ?

birthofanorange · Mar 23, 2019

pastafarian said:
What do you know now about the EU that you didnt know before you voted?

That certain folk would be happy to gamble (for that's what it is) with the future of this country, based on what, exactly? For what purpose or benefit?
If nothing else, it's taught me a lot about people here, and that in itself would be enough to want to remain a part of a bigger, more inclusive picture.
In the long term, it will happen, anyway, despite the more destructive elements.
Anyhoo, no offence, but I have no desire to converse with you anymore, so I will leave you to your weirdness.

PILTDOWN MAN · Mar 23, 2019

birthofanorange said:
Oh, I respect democracy, I just don't believe it starts and finishes with a single vote on something of utmost importance. Do you? Really?

So if remain won you would respect the calling for a re-run by the leavers?

I voted remain but do respect the majority who bothered to vote did so to leave the EU

pastafarian · Mar 23, 2019

birthofanorange said:
That certain folk would be happy to gamble (for that's what it is) with the future of this country, based on what, exactly? For what purpose or benefit?
If nothing else, it's taught me a lot about people here, and that in itself would be enough to want to remain a part of a bigger, more inclusive picture.
In the long term, it will happen, anyway, despite the more destructive elements.
Anyhoo, no offence, but I have no desire to converse with you anymore, so I will leave you to your weirdness.

In conclusion then,you dont know anymore about the EU now than you did before you voted.
cheerio.

Javeaseagull · Mar 23, 2019

I ask myself why Johnson, Farage, Rees-Mogg et al are so keen to leave. Has it anything to do with impending Tax rules coming in within the EU for more transparency and exposing tax havens like the Cayman Islands?
Surely just a coincidence.

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