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The Government’s 80% wage pledge



Hornblower

Hornblower

Well-known member
Jul 7, 2003
1,707
Wrong-Direction said:
That's all great but I'm talking about the shelf stackers, delivery drivers, those on minimum wage, NHS staff, the key workers havent been given any extra for what they're doing and I very much doubt they will once this is all over. I just dont think it's fair that someone that currently doesn't have a key job can get at least 80% of their earnings whilst someone like me that's self employed can claim £94 a week sick pay, thanks but no thanks I'll take my chances and carry on working instead of going bankrupt

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This Government has thrown the self-employed under a bus. My business (musicians) is effectively finished if they don’t come up with something better than 90 odd quid a week. That’s less than a quarter of the minimum wage, who can possible pay all there bills and provide food for their family on that money. I’m disgusted with the lack of consideration for self-employed people who in many cases are creating new businesses and wealth for the economy up until now.
 




Weststander

Weststander

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Aug 25, 2011
64,070
Withdean area
Wrong-Direction said:
That's all great but I'm talking about the shelf stackers, delivery drivers, those on minimum wage, NHS staff, the key workers havent been given any extra for what they're doing and I very much doubt they will once this is all over. I just dont think it's fair that someone that currently doesn't have a key job can get at least 80% of their earnings whilst someone like me that's self employed can claim £94 a week sick pay, thanks but no thanks I'll take my chances and carry on working instead of going bankrupt

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Several unrelated points there. Breaking it down:

Shop workers and delivery drivers - shirley they’re paid by the hour for overtime, whatever their contract. Their employers are breaking the law, if not. No mention of this law breaking in the media at the moment.

NHS staff, including my family - I’ve not heard one complaint in this crisis about their pay. As this pans out, this new unity amongst politicians, union and business leaders will hopefully look at this. At the moment they’re getting on with saving lives.

Self employed - if you and your partner now have zero work, have the government mentioned yet what’s happening? They’re 5 million self employed, without help on rent ir mortgage, the cost of living, you’re right, huge numbers would go bankrupt. At present it looks like you now access to SSP, your personal tax won’t be payable this year, plus other benefits through universal credit. Your partners income in the household and your accounts record keeping will be important. A specialist area, you need to contact the department a.s.a.p.
https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/benefits/universal-credit/on-universal-credit/how-the-minimum-income-floor-works-if-youre-self-employed/
 


Weststander

Weststander

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Aug 25, 2011
64,070
Withdean area
Hornblower said:
This Government has thrown the self-employed under a bus. My business (musicians) is effectively finished if they don’t come up with something better than 90 odd quid a week. That’s less than a quarter of the minimum wage, who can possible pay all there bills and provide food for their family on that money. I’m disgusted with the lack of consideration for self-employed people who in many cases are creating new businesses and wealth for the economy up until now.
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Looking at the CAB website, you need to apply for Universal Credit.
 


Beach Hut

Beach Hut

Brighton Bhuna Boy
Jul 5, 2003
71,974
Living In a Box
Hornblower said:
This Government has thrown the self-employed under a bus. My business (musicians) is effectively finished if they don’t come up with something better than 90 odd quid a week. That’s less than a quarter of the minimum wage, who can possible pay all there bills and provide food for their family on that money. I’m disgusted with the lack of consideration for self-employed people who in many cases are creating new businesses and wealth for the economy up until now.
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I think the Government will deal with self-employed early next week, they have stated very clearly they will assist all working people through this crisis
 


vegster

vegster

Sanity Clause
May 5, 2008
27,894
Lots of confusion at my shop. Recent new joins have been sacked, staff they want to keep have been told their hours are reduced by 50% in order to keep their jobs. Will the government pay that 50% of lost hours so the company pays half/ Gov pays half or will the Gov pay 80% of current wages even if staff hours have been cut by 50 % ? Obviously it's daft going to work and being in close proximity to fellow staff if most of you are not actually needed..... Do we turn up, risk exposure to Covid-19 in order to claim our 80% ? I'm not sure and neither are our bosses.
 




Weststander

Weststander

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Aug 25, 2011
64,070
Withdean area
vegster said:
Lots of confusion at my shop. Recent new joins have been sacked, staff they want to keep have been told their hours are reduced by 50% in order to keep their jobs. Will the government pay that 50% of lost hours so the company pays half/ Gov pays half or will the Gov pay 80% of current wages even if staff hours have been cut by 50 % ? Obviously it's daft going to work and being in close proximity to fellow staff if most of you are not actually needed..... Do we turn up, risk exposure to Covid-19 in order to claim our 80% ? I'm not sure and neither are our bosses.
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It’s 80% of the gross pay the employer is actually paying, so hours and other complications don’t come into it.

It’s now up to all employers to do use their heads and at the same time do the honourable thing, at potentially zero cost to them.

If they cut hours, they can still pay the 80% (or 100% if they can afford it) of the original hours gross pay for that employee. Someone can be completely or partly at home not working, on 80% of their original pre-crisis pay, and it won’t cost the employer a penny.
 


vegster

vegster

Sanity Clause
May 5, 2008
27,894
Weststander said:
It’s 80% of the gross pay the employer is actually paying, so hours and other complications don’t come into it.

It’s now up to all employers to do use their heads and at the same time do the honourable thing, at potentially zero cost to them.

If they cut hours, they can still pay the 80% (or 100% if they can afford it) of the original hours gross pay for that employee. Someone can be completely or partly at home not working, on 80% of their original pre-crisis pay, and it won’t cost the employer a penny.
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If so this is really good news, i'd take 80%, i'd never get 100% from my company.
 


F

fallowfield32

New member
Apr 22, 2016
16
I am confused as to the terms of the 80% payment from an employers perspective. is it that I pay staff a minimum of 80%of their salary and they stay home or can I ask them to work? My business has been effectively closed down by the government so absolutely no sales until restrictions lifted but there are improvements we can make to the building that my staff could help with. Is that allowed under the terms of the scheme?
 




C

clarkey

Well-known member
Jan 3, 2006
3,498
fallowfield32 said:
I am confused as to the terms of the 80% payment from an employers perspective. is it that I pay staff a minimum of 80%of their salary and they stay home or can I ask them to work? My business has been effectively closed down by the government so absolutely no sales until restrictions lifted but there are improvements we can make to the building that my staff could help with. Is that allowed under the terms of the scheme?
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They have to be not working, effectively furloughed. How they will ever track that I have no idea.

Question I’m still not clear on is if employers are expected to top up the portion of wages the government aren’t covering.
 


Weststander

Weststander

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Aug 25, 2011
64,070
Withdean area
fallowfield32 said:
I am confused as to the terms of the 80% payment from an employers perspective. is it that I pay staff a minimum of 80%of their salary and they stay home or can I ask them to work? My business has been effectively closed down by the government so absolutely no sales until restrictions lifted but there are improvements we can make to the building that my staff could help with. Is that allowed under the terms of the scheme?
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My understanding (it was only announced yesterday) is that through PAYE the government will pay employers 80% of employees usual pay, subject to a max of £2,500 per month (i.e. someone on up to £36,000 a year gross when on 100% pay) .... for staff on leave and not working, with effect from 1st March 2020.

The grants in hard cash grants will reach employers “within weeks”.
 














C

clarkey

Well-known member
Jan 3, 2006
3,498
Weststander said:
https://smallbusiness.co.uk/government-launches-business-coronavirus-job-retention-scheme-2549979/
https://www.icaew.com/insights/coronavirus/uk-practical-business-advice-covid-19

The government link is open, but without the paper just yet.
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Thanks, the first one links through to Sunak’s transcript which does say it very clearly.

Gives a lifeline for at least 3 months. My businesses are facing such a black hole as a result of all this, we will have to lay off once the support ends, but hopefully at that point the market is moving again so at least people have places to go rather than being left with no options, as is currently the case.
 


Weststander

Weststander

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Aug 25, 2011
64,070
Withdean area
clarkey said:
Thanks, the first one links through to Sunak’s transcript which does say it very clearly.

Gives a lifeline for at least 3 months. My businesses are facing such a black hole as a result of all this, we will have to lay off once the support ends, but hopefully at that point the market is moving again so at least people have places to go rather than being left with no options, as is currently the case.
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Genuinely very sorry to hear that, and good luck.

Are you aware of all the financial/tax measures to help you, the second ICAEW link lists them, there may be more to come.

Do you pay rent? For example, I work with commercial landlords who are receiving requests from tenants to halve rent, and/or pay monthly instead of quarterly. Amicable arrangements are being struck.

That might be the same where you owe some suppliers. Better for them to get some money in over time, than none with an insolvency. Their own cost bases have just been slashed with no business rates, nil payroll costs effectively for staff put on leave, no VAT or corporation tax due for the foreseeable future. Meaning they’re suddenly under far less pressure than they thought they were, so they might make arrangements with you.

P.S. The payroll scheme is only for 3 months, but imho you can bank on it for the whole of this crisis. It would be political suicide to abandon it too early, and put the country in a 1930’s depression.
 


vegster

vegster

Sanity Clause
May 5, 2008
27,894
Weststander said:
Genuinely very sorry to hear that, and good luck.

Are you aware of all the financial/tax measures to help you, the second ICAEW link lists them, there may be more to come.

Do you pay rent? For example, I work with commercial landlords who are receiving requests from tenants to halve rent, and/or pay monthly instead of quarterly. Amicable arrangements are being struck.

That might be the same where you owe some suppliers. Better for them to get some money in over time, than none with an insolvency. Their own cost bases have just been slashed with no business rates, nil payroll costs effectively for staff put on leave, no VAT or corporation tax due for the foreseeable future. Meaning they’re suddenly under far less pressure than they thought they were, so they might make arrangements with you.

P.S. The payroll scheme is only for 3 months, but imho you can bank on it for the whole of this crisis. It would be political suicide to abandon it too early, and put the country in a 1930’s depression.
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Yes, Government said quite clearly that this will be for an initial 3 months but will be extended as long as is necessary .
 


KZNSeagull

KZNSeagull

Well-known member
Nov 26, 2007
19,829
Wolsingham, County Durham
Wrong-Direction said:
That's all great but I'm talking about the shelf stackers, delivery drivers, those on minimum wage, NHS staff, the key workers havent been given any extra for what they're doing and I very much doubt they will once this is all over. I just dont think it's fair that someone that currently doesn't have a key job can get at least 80% of their earnings whilst someone like me that's self employed can claim £94 a week sick pay, thanks but no thanks I'll take my chances and carry on working instead of going bankrupt

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Re Shelf stackers, Tesco are giving us all a 10% bonus backdated to 9/3 for initially the next 2 months, maybe longer. They have also increased our staff discount and if we have to self isolate we get paid our contracted hours from day 1.

The government HAS to do something for the self employed and I am sure that they will. Anything they do can only really be based on historical, declared earnings. I don't see any other way of doing it.
 






Blue Valkyrie

Blue Valkyrie

Not seen such Bravery!
Sep 1, 2012
32,165
Valhalla
ewe2 said:
So any employees on PAYE ,the employer can claim the grant....... Is that correct?
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It seems so.

Not forgetting the cap applies so it will be less than 80% for any employee earning over about 36-38k.
 


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