[Politics] The General Election Thread

Pavilionaire · Nov 24, 2019

JC Footy Genius said:
Only repeating what was reported in the Times ...

The Institute for Fiscal Studies said the plans would create the biggest tax burden since World War II while the Resolution Foundation, another think tank, said the size of the state would reach a post-war high and outstrip even Germany.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/labour-launches-tax-and-spend-manifesto-j7pgr0ll6

But what does that mean? In absolute numbers, average per person? 50 years ago tax rates were higher but the population of the UK was 12 million less and more women were housewives not working.

Right now we have low tax rates compared to other western economies and even Corbyn's increases would put us in the middle of that bunch.

Bozza · Nov 24, 2019

supaseagull said:
a new and more credible Labour leader will be elected and they’ll go on to win the next election.

I think there's a decent chance of that happening.

Can Corbyn really carry on, should he suffer a second election loss. He is (an admittedly youthful) 70 now, and if the next government goes full term, he'd be approaching his 75th birthday at the next election.

Life after Corbyn seems to be a discussion that's growing in volume already, and Rebecca Long-Bailey feels well placed to step into Corbyn's shoes right now after her performance at the last conference and seems socialist enough for the Momentum nutters to support.

Hampster Gull · Nov 24, 2019

supaseagull said:
, a new and more credible Labour leader will be elected and they’ll go on to win the next election.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

That is very likely. The only issue is that Momentum and the Union barons have enough power to stop that happening given the way the Labour Party constitution has changed in recent years. It will depend where they want to go over the next few years

rogersix · Nov 24, 2019

BensGrandad said:
Join those getting benefit.I presume

so you didn't understand what they had actually said then?

WATFORD zero · Nov 24, 2019

melias shoes said:
WATFORD zero said:

I bet it was the tax increases for PAYE employees earning over 80K that swung it for you, too

Click to expand...

Amongst others.

Would the other reasons be that he is an IT consultant and also runs The PBR Racing Motorcycle racing team alongside his dad, whilst lying about being an 80K pa PAYE employee ?

I'm afraid that yet again, you've been lied to and believed it :facepalm:

His name is Rob "Bullet" Barber if you want to look it up

WATFORD zero · Nov 24, 2019

Bozza said:
I think there's a decent chance of that happening.

Can Corbyn really carry on, should he suffer a second election loss. He is (an admittedly youthful) 70 now, and if the next government goes full term, he'd be approaching his 75th birthday at the next election.

Life after Corbyn seems to be a discussion that's growing in volume already, and Rebecca Long-Bailey feels well placed to step into Corbyn's shoes right now after her performance at the last conference and seems socialist enough for the Momentum nutters to support.

I agree there is a decent chance of Corbyn being replaced and Labour getting into power at the election after this one, although I've always thought that since the SNP took off, any chance of a Labour majority has gone for generations.

However, if that has come about as a result of Johnson getting his majority, we will be out of the EU by then (although still paying in and abiding by their rules and regulations) and be halfway through the trade negotiations with the EU (and even I wouldn't like to guess where we will be in negotiating the replacements for all the other EU deals and agreements with the rest of the world).

It could be a very different Britain by the time of the next election

dazzer6666 · Nov 24, 2019

Tried to watch the Andrew Marr show this morning (session with each leader a bit like the QT programme the other night) objectively and without getting annoyed. Failed. One-line summary :

Rayner - ****ing hell she is throw-stuff-at-the-telly ANNOYING. Won't answer a question and constantly raises her voice over the presenter when being asked something she can't answer
Gove - patronising and smug, tried to divert every question on Tory policy to what Labour were doing. Similar to QT, though, Marr interrupted him far more than he did Rayner (or Gove was less rude and allowed him to perhaps)
Swinson - deeply unimpressive. Simple questions had her floundering
Plaid Cymru bloke - seemed to at least talk some sense but who even cares really

Hugo Rune · Nov 24, 2019

WATFORD zero said:
His name is Rob "Bullet" Barber if you want to look it up

He races in the Isle Of Man TT. Based on his level of poor judgement, you’d have to assume that he’ll be qualifying as a nominee for a Darwin Award in the coming years.

lawros left foot · Nov 24, 2019

Hampster Gull said:
That is very likely. The only issue is that Momentum and the Union barons have enough power to stop that happening given the way the Labour Party constitution has changed in recent years. It will depend where they want to go over the next few years

The Labour Party constitution is one member, one vote.It had was away from the old block vote for the unions by Red Ed Milliband, so all members get equal representation.

Momentum’s and the ‘Union Barons’ can only advise their members who their preferred choice is.

Hampster Gull · Nov 24, 2019

lawros left foot said:
The Labour Party constitution is one member, one vote.It had was away from the old block vote for the unions by Red Ed Milliband, so all members get equal representation.

Momentum’s and the ‘Union Barons’ can only advise their members who their preferred choice is.

I said power.

The voting changes has swung power away the more centre leaning parliamentary Labour Party.

It’s a party of extremists that won’t win power until they lean back to the centre left.

Stat Brother · Nov 24, 2019

To continue on with this mornings bibbling

vegster · Nov 24, 2019

Hampster Gull said:
That is very likely. The only issue is that Momentum and the Union barons have enough power to stop that happening given the way the Labour Party constitution has changed in recent years. It will depend where they want to go over the next few years

A couple of interesting points about the "Union Baron's " of which you speak, a, Union membership has collapsed over many years to about 6 million members in the last year or so thanks to the gig economy/zero hours contracts. b, A " Baron " is the lowest rank of the nobility and it is usually hereditary.

So, you fear a union membership of less than a tenth of the population ( many of which are NHS staff who would probably NEVER strike ) and their leaders who are in fact elected rather than in a job for life or millennia ?

Have you just turned up from the '70's ?

Kinky Gerbil · Nov 24, 2019

Stat Brother said:
To continue on with this mornings bibbling

View attachment 117500

Labour/Lib Dems etc are playing into the Tories hands.

Well done everyone.

melias shoes · Nov 24, 2019

WATFORD zero said:
Would the other reasons be that he is an IT consultant and also runs The PBR Racing Motorcycle racing team alongside his dad, whilst lying about being an 80K pa PAYE employee ?

I'm afraid that yet again, you've been lied to and believed it

His name is Rob "Bullet" Barber if you want to look it up

No not at all. Once again you've jumped to conclusions as to what amongst others means.

You really do keep on doing that don't you. You're very excitable aren't you.

Hampster Gull · Nov 24, 2019

vegster said:
A couple of interesting points about the "Union Baron's " of which you speak, a, Union membership has collapsed over many years to about 6 million members in the last year or so thanks to the gig economy/zero hours contracts. b, A " Baron " is the lowest rank of the nobility and it is usually hereditary.

So, you fear a union membership of less than a tenth of the population ( many of which are NHS staff who would probably NEVER strike ) and their leaders who are in fact elected rather than in a job for life or millennia ?

Have you just turned up from the '70's ?

Union membership peaked in the 70’s when it was over double what it is now. It has declined pretty well ever since. For what’s if worth, which is probably not much, if anything that decline has slowed down in the gig economy years. I am no fan of zero hours though, needs addressing.

I saw the end of the 70s, the U.K. cap in hand to the IMF for money, rubbish tips left in the streets etc. But no, I prefer to look forward not backwards.

And I don’t fear anything in this context. Momentum Labour has little hope of winning and they seem to know it, they are getting more desperate with giveaways by the day. If they somehow win they'll be out again the next time. And if they stay in, fine, whatever.

Stat Brother · Nov 24, 2019

Corbyn refuses to give as well as take in Remain constituencies – that’s why voters still need the Lib Dems

https://www.independent.co.uk/voice...l-voting-corbyn-labour-lib-dems-a9208736.html

Fortunately for the Liberal Democrats, Labour is far too politically tribal, cautious and flat-footed to do anything so smart. Under the surface bluster, I doubt that Corbyn’s team is truly serious about winning. The half-baked proposal for nationalised, free broadband suggests they are not. Perpetual protest and opposition suits them better. - That'll help Vince!!!

Chicken Run · Nov 24, 2019

dazzer6666 said:
Tried to watch the Andrew Marr show this morning (session with each leader a bit like the QT programme the other night) objectively and without getting annoyed. Failed. One-line summary :

Rayner - ****ing hell she is throw-stuff-at-the-telly ANNOYING. Won't answer a question and constantly raises her voice over the presenter when being asked something she can't answer

She’s a ginger, what do you expect!

Hampster Gull · Nov 24, 2019

Kinky Gerbils said:
Labour/Lib Dems etc are playing into the Tories hands.

Well done everyone.

The Liberals aren’t a subset of the Labour Party, they stand on their own and agenda. You should be screaming out against the FPTP electoral system, which I presume you voted against when it there was a referendum

Kinky Gerbil · Nov 24, 2019

Hampster Gull said:
The Liberals aren’t a subset of the Labour Party, they stand on their own and agenda. You should be screaming out against the FPTP electoral system, which I presume you voted against when it there was a referendum

Nope you are right, but neither party can moan or complain if we leave without a deal.

No one is asking them to be tied by the hip, but to give way on a couple of seats helps both parties end game.

ozzygull · Nov 24, 2019

I could really see John Deadwood loose his seat in Wokingham. There has been so much housing built in this area as in thousands, in a true blue area the new residents may not be Tory and it showed in the last local election where an independent and labour did very well

Also it is a remain area and his has constantly voted against the will of his constituents.

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