Trump

Weststander · Oct 29, 2020

peterward said:
I respect the economist too, and always read it.....however it doesn't really count for much when it comes to polling - Its a very difficult science and a lot of pollers do differ by some margins - its hard and perhaps naive to pick one - the poll of polls maybe the best reflection? Biden wins 19 times out of 20 will only be based on their polling methodology, which if wrong will invalidate that model.

Regarding the House and Senate votes, they can’t deliver the huge injustice of a presidential candidate losing despite having more popular votes. Expect a Democrat congress.

So it boils down to the Electoral College route for the presidency. The Economist is using an immense amount of data, then modelled to each state. Looking good.

On both BBC and CNN tonight they’ve highlighted the number of ways Republican state mechanisms are being used to inhibit the poor and immobile from voting, for example, long drives to polling stations. Highlighting a desperate GOP, scrambling for every Democrat not to vote. Let’s hope not telling.

drew · Oct 30, 2020

dingodan said:
So, people on the right are racists, homophobes and misogynists?

Given that the left right political divide is around 50/50, and given that half of people clearly are not racists, homophobes and misogynists, have you ever considered that it might be you who is the bigot? Prejudiced against people for their political views and demonizing them and casting them as evil?

I know lot's of people on the political right and the political left, and yet I don't know a single racist, homophobe or misogynist. Infact I know black people, gay people and women who are on the political right.

Did you ever consider that you might actually be the one who is an extremist and a bigot, blinded by your own self righteousness and misplaced sense of moral superiority?

On what side of the political divide do expect to find most misogynists, racists and homophobes then?

Don't think anyone is saying that all those on the right fall into those categories but most on the far right fall into at least one of those groups.

beorhthelm · Oct 30, 2020

Weststander said:
I respect the objective Economist.

Click on the various tabs, the US is heading for a Democrat clean sweep of President, Senate and House.

https://projects.economist.com/us-2020-forecast/president

Trump won last time by taking the large rust belt states, Pennsylvania, Michigan and Wisconsin normally Democrat (also Ohio, but that swings each election). Economist has them 97% chance going to Biden, 46 EC votes and he gets over the line. Arizona, Florida, a few other toss ups seal it as a clear win. it only needs for a % in those states to not vote Trump and he loses them, had by slim numbers last time. he not something new anymore, that mystique of a fresh style of politics has gone.

Weststander · Oct 30, 2020

beorhthelm said:
Trump won last time by taking the large rust belt states, Pennsylvania, Michigan and Wisconsin normally Democrat (also Ohio, but that swings each election). Economist has them 97% chance going to Biden, 46 EC votes and he gets over the line. Arizona, Florida, a few other toss ups seal it as a clear win. it only needs for a % in those states to not vote Trump and he loses them, had by slim numbers last time. he not something new anymore, that mystique of a fresh style of politics has gone.

Only the Electoral College system can give Trump a second term now. Or politicised state supreme court battles eliminating the postal votes of Democrats, after Trump’s been beaten. That’s getting so bad, Democrats are now asking voters to walk their postal votes to election offices.

Tyrone Biggums · Oct 30, 2020

Weststander said:
I respect the objective Economist.

Click on the various tabs, the US is heading for a Democrat clean sweep of President, Senate and House.

https://projects.economist.com/us-2020-forecast/president

Which would leave the just The Supreme Court as potentially the last bastion protecting racists, homophobes and misogynists.

The Alt Right’s four year experiment is about to come crashing down.

White Liberals are the most deceitful racists you'll find.

Seems to be a bit of theme with white Liberals coming out and telling black people that they aren't black if they don't back the Democrats.

Slave master mentality is still alive and well in the party of slavery.

knocky1 · Oct 30, 2020

Tyrone Biggums said:
White Liberals are the most deceitful racists you'll find.

Seems to be a bit of theme with white Liberals coming out and telling black people that they aren't black if they don't back the Democrats.

Slave master mentality is still alive and well in the party of slavery.

Joe Biden spent 8 years working for a Black man ‘born in a hut in Africa’.
His second in command was born to a father born in Jamaica and mother born in Chennai, India.

Trump has Mike Spence.

A1X · Oct 30, 2020

spence said:
Red wave is coming

Fake news, lies, corruption, socialism, racism etc will see the democrats defeated heavily on November 3rd

Trump 2020

Most of the reason why I dearly want Trump to lose next week is because it'd be the best thing for virtually everyone on the planet.

However, I'd be lying if I didn't say that an enormous part of me wants to see him lose just to see how so many of the die-hards who've convinced themselves of the likes of the quoted post react when it doesn't happen.

CHAPPERS · Oct 30, 2020

[tweet]1322008536902037505[/tweet]

Jr has been on the gak again

highflyer · Oct 30, 2020

oh look

https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/securi...undwork-hunter-biden-conspiracy-deluge-n12453

I mean, it may or may not be true. Just like EVERYTHING ELSE with this story. Which is the real point. When the story is so obviously a mix of truth and fiction, and has so obviously been cobbled together and disseminated with a propaganda purpose in mind, why would you expect any responsible journalists to give it coverage?

All a bit sad really. How is a party that thinks this is the way to win things (and they aren't even any good at it) still in with a chance?

I was hoping for Bernie Sanders as the Democratic candidate but it didn't happen and I understand why, talking to friends in the US who just crave stability. Biden is part of the Democratic party establishment. A man of the past. His instincts are likely to be to placate, not confront, global capital. But looking at his policy agenda it is still a long long way ahead of Trump (insofar as Trump has any kind of policy agenda) and, more importantly, the Democratic party is changing. Having them in power give the opportunity for a number of more interesting voices to be heard and for some new, fresher, faces to emerge.

Of course no longer having to hear that whinging, spoilt, infantile, orange mass of ego speak from a position of power is a bonus.

m@goo · Oct 30, 2020

Flicked over to that Trump show thing last night despite my better judgement.

His gang were all laying hands on him like he's the f*cking second coming while saying a prayer...

Stark staring mental.

ShandyH · Oct 30, 2020

Tyrone Biggums said:
White Liberals are the most deceitful racists you'll find.

Seems to be a bit of theme with white Liberals coming out and telling black people that they aren't black if they don't back the Democrats.

Slave master mentality is still alive and well in the party of slavery.

Yeah they’re far more racist than the current Nazis in charge.

knocky1 · Oct 30, 2020

Puportedly only one President greater than the orange bungle****.
Abraham Lincoln.
“You can fool some of the people, such as Spence, all of the time, and all of the people some of the time, but you can not fool all of the people all of the time.”

Hotchilidog · Oct 30, 2020

highflyer said:
oh look

https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/securi...undwork-hunter-biden-conspiracy-deluge-n12453

I mean, it may or may not be true. Just like EVERYTHING ELSE with this story. Which is the real point. When the story is so obviously a mix of truth and fiction, and has so obviously been cobbled together and disseminated with a propaganda purpose in mind, why would you expect any responsible journalists to give it coverage?

All a bit sad really. How is a party that thinks this is the way to win things (and they aren't even any good at it) still in with a chance?

I was hoping for Bernie Sanders as the Democratic candidate but it didn't happen and I understand why, talking to friends in the US who just crave stability. Biden is part of the Democratic party establishment. A man of the past. His instincts are likely to be to placate, not confront, global capital. But looking at his policy agenda it is still a long long way ahead of Trump (insofar as Trump has any kind of policy agenda) and, more importantly, the Democratic party is changing. Having them in power give the opportunity for a number of more interesting voices to be heard and for some new, fresher, faces to emerge.

Of course no longer having to hear that whinging, spoilt, infantile, orange mass of ego speak from a position of power is a bonus.

I too share your opinion. I was disappointed Biden "won" the primary, but have warmed to him since the campaign has begun. Biden is a corporate politician and there is every chance he will be a conventional disappointment to progressives looking for change, however that is a marked improvement over the divisive, corrupt and racist sh*t show on offer at the moment. I recently saw an interview with AOC on CNN when she was asked how she felt about Biden's views on fracking (he's flipped back to pro). AOC's response was that whilst she disagrees with Biden she is looking forward to lobbying him and making her case along with other campaigners, something that is not possible with Trump. Biden represents a return to some form of normalcy and I am pretty sure that explains his appeal to many voters tired of the circus.

Hopefully the senate gets flipped and there are some more progressive Dems elected to both houses and America can move on from there.

peterward · Oct 30, 2020

highflyer said:
oh look

https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/securi...undwork-hunter-biden-conspiracy-deluge-n12453

I mean, it may or may not be true. Just like EVERYTHING ELSE with this story. Which is the real point. When the story is so obviously a mix of truth and fiction, and has so obviously been cobbled together and disseminated with a propaganda purpose in mind, why would you expect any responsible journalists to give it coverage?

All a bit sad really. How is a party that thinks this is the way to win things (and they aren't even any good at it) still in with a chance?

I was hoping for Bernie Sanders as the Democratic candidate but it didn't happen and I understand why, talking to friends in the US who just crave stability. Biden is part of the Democratic party establishment. A man of the past. His instincts are likely to be to placate, not confront, global capital. But looking at his policy agenda it is still a long long way ahead of Trump (insofar as Trump has any kind of policy agenda) and, more importantly, the Democratic party is changing. Having them in power give the opportunity for a number of more interesting voices to be heard and for some new, fresher, faces to emerge.

Of course no longer having to hear that whinging, spoilt, infantile, orange mass of ego speak from a position of power is a bonus.

Link not working

dingodan · Oct 30, 2020

highflyer said:
oh look

https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/securi...undwork-hunter-biden-conspiracy-deluge-n12453

I mean, it may or may not be true. Just like EVERYTHING ELSE with this story. Which is the real point. When the story is so obviously a mix of truth and fiction, and has so obviously been cobbled together and disseminated with a propaganda purpose in mind, why would you expect any responsible journalists to give it coverage?

All a bit sad really. How is a party that thinks this is the way to win things (and they aren't even any good at it) still in with a chance?

Wait, that is a bit of trickery by nbcnews.

What they have done there is release an article, while everyone is discussing the Hunter Biden story, which discredits a months old "dossier" - which nobody is talking about. There are two things being deliberately conflated to confuse people. Yes, it may be true that the 64 page dossier was produced under a pseudonym. I don't really know since I have never heard about the dossier, and nobody today is referencing it or quoting from it. Then there is the laptop, the emails etc, which have been verified and are not really in question.

Some people on Twitter have fallen for it. For example people replying to the tweet of this story and demonstrating that they think that this has somehow "debunked" the whole "Hunter Biden thing". All the while NBC have not reported on the contents of the laptop, the emails etc, at all. This was a play which would have been more suited to a campaign spin room than a media outlet.

Again, to clarify:

Dossier nobody has ever heard of - questionable (at least in terms of origins if not content), narrow scope related to China.
Laptop/Harddrive everyone is talking about - not questionable, the subject of an FBI investigation, with witnesses who have come forward and a trove of emails.

The original tweet story is here, they have done a damn good (and damn shady) job with this. It's to muddy the waters and sow the seeds of doubt about something which is actually unrelated.

[tweet]1321942389045497861[/tweet]

highflyer · Oct 30, 2020

dingodan said:
muddy the waters and sow the seeds of doubt

Live by muddy waters and sowing seeds of doubt, die by muddy waters and sowing seeds of doubt.

NBC have played Trump, Fox and co at ther own game and now you are wailing about it being unfair.

Tough sh*t.

highflyer · Oct 30, 2020

peterward said:
Link not working

https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/securi...dwork-hunter-biden-conspiracy-deluge-n1245387

how's that?

Dick Knights Mumm · Oct 30, 2020

dingodan said:
Wait, that is a bit of trickery by nbcnews.

Why do you put so much effort into defending the crooked old racist ?

dingodan · Oct 30, 2020

highflyer said:
Live by muddy waters and sowing seeds of doubt, die by muddy waters and sowing seeds of doubt.

NBC have played Trump, Fox and co at ther own game and now you are wailing about it being unfair.

Tough sh*t.

I'm hardly wailing about it. Assuming that you think it's sh*tty behavior for a media outlet, which you seem to, you should probably think it's wrong whoever does it?

The way I see it is that journalists have a responsibility to report the news. To inform people of things they should be aware of. To keep a check on people who have or want power.

I'm not interested in defending Trump, but whatever Trump has or hasn't done is no defense of journalists not doing their jobs. The media have flat out refused to cover this story with the attention and detail which it's due, and some of their excuses are baffling. Trust in the media was already at an all time low before this all happened. This Biden hill could be the one the media end up dying on.

"We must treat the Hunter Biden leaks as if they were a foreign intelligence operation — even if they probably aren't." - Washington Post
"We're not going to do your work for you." - CNN
“We don’t want to waste our time on stories that are really not stories, and we don’t want to waste the listeners’ and readers’ time on stories that are just pure distractions” - NPR

dingodan · Oct 30, 2020

Dick Knights Mumm said:
Why do you put so much effort into defending the crooked old racist ?

I'm defending your right to be informed without misdirection and spin, I'm defending journalism.

Trump behaves badly is not an excuse for people who we think better of to do the same. If everyone behaves badly, if nobody at all can be trusted, what then?

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