[Politics] Brexit

Baldseagull · Feb 8, 2019

Gwylan said:
Some Brexiteers have this fantasy that if the UK holds firm, then the Irish government, thinking that it has a lot to lose, will give way on the backstop.

A Sky News poll has put the kybosh on that idea once and for all. In fact, nearly half the electorate wants the Irish government to take a harder line.

I know some people are sceptical about polls but the results of this one are so extreme, there can be little argument about the findings.

I think the Irish are very pleased they are in a Union, which can help them stand up to the UK, and has given them a bigger status in the world, EU is coming out of this looking pretty solid so far. I am thinking back to Farage proudly announcing the removal of the first brick and that the EU would soon collapse with UK departure, instead we have Scottish independence and Norther Irish unification coming to the fore.

A1X · Feb 8, 2019

I find the way to embed tweets is to put [TWEET] then the number at the end of the tweet, then the same with the / as the end tag at the end

For example;

[TWEET]1093826049450958848[/TWEET]

A1X · Feb 8, 2019

Baldseagull said:
I think the Irish are very pleased they are in a Union, which can help them stand up to the UK, and has given them a bigger status in the world, EU is coming out of this looking pretty solid so far. I am thinking back to Farage proudly announcing the removal of the first brick and that the EU would soon collapse with UK departure, instead we have Scottish independence and Norther Irish unification coming to the fore.

I've long said if the Brexiters want an end point for the Irish backstop then they should end date it to the moment the EU ceases to exist. They kept telling us it would happen very soon, so let's see them put their money where their mouth is.

Baker lite · Feb 8, 2019

Plooks said:
Trouble is Britain currently has only 49 days left before it ceases to exist. If people back Britain they will be trying to stop brexit and save Britain.

Oooohh the drama.

On our way.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

nicko31 · Feb 8, 2019

Baldseagull said:
I think the Irish are very pleased they are in a Union, which can help them stand up to the UK, and has given them a bigger status in the world, EU is coming out of this looking pretty solid so far. I am thinking back to Farage proudly announcing the removal of the first brick and that the EU would soon collapse with UK departure, instead we have Scottish independence and Norther Irish unification coming to the fore.

The one thing that its hard to argue about with Brexit is no other country in Europe seems keen to replicate our errors. We're threatening our living standards and the very existence of the Union.

Perhaps the Tories need to remember they are supposed to be the conservative and unionist party

cunning fergus · Feb 8, 2019

ManOfSussex said:
Just pointing out we're going to have the post Brexit Singaporean dream you voted for and loads more immigrants, but from developing countries, most of which are Muslim. I'm not surprised it doesn't bother you Fergie - it's what you and Rees-Mogg, Paterson and Redwood all voted for.

If there is one thing remainers like you love its a prediction, and especially a really wild absurd one.

If, in a post Brexit world, when parliamentary accountability for policies are distilled in the UK rather than under the authority of an unelected supra national institution, then if the people want unfettered borders then they can have them.

My preference is that there should be restrictions/conditions placed on anyone who is entering to the uk labour market in the same wauy that labour markets operates in the other 170 odd countries around the world.

Nothing fancy, just common sense arrangements.

I predict such restrictions would be far more popular that the current unregulated free labour market that exists now to serve the interests of big business.

You know it too, tory boy.

A1X · Feb 8, 2019

cunning fergus said:
If there is one thing remainers like you love its a prediction, and especially a really wild absurd one.

If, in a post Brexit world, when parliamentary accountability for policies are distilled in the UK rather than under the authority of an unelected supra national institution, then if the people want unfettered borders then they can have them.

My preference is that there should be restrictions/conditions placed on anyone who is entering to the uk labour market in the same wauy that labour markets operates in the other 170 odd countries around the world.

Nothing fancy, just common sense arrangements.

I predict such restrictions would be far more popular that the current unregulated free labour market that exists now to serve the interests of big business.

You know it too, tory boy.

So why leave if that's all you want? You can already do that through FoM and use the same restrictions basically every other EU member already uses.

cunning fergus · Feb 8, 2019

Baldseagull said:
I think you might have missed when Labour won power and signed up to the Social chapter that the Tories had opted out of, that was the moment most leftwingers softened their views on the EU, because it was no longer just for business, it upheld workers rights citizens rights, environmental standards as well, it has evolved, you have not.

The Lord giveth and taketh away, i think the social chapter is positive and was more so in 1997 BUT things have moved on and it has not prevented the challenges of 2019. Workers rights have always been dicey here, especially compared to places line France.

Just 20 years on and we have zero contracts and minimal change. In France the president is unwinding decades of labour market and worker protections.

So, sure you could make the point stronger in 1997, now the SC is evidently not fit for purpose. Dont ask me, ask the herbets in the yellow vests.

ManOfSussex · Feb 8, 2019

cunning fergus said:
If there is one thing remainers like you love its a prediction, and especially a really wild absurd one.

If, in a post Brexit world, when parliamentary accountability for policies are distilled in the UK rather than under the authority of an unelected supra national institution, then if the people want unfettered borders then they can have them.

My preference is that there should be restrictions/conditions placed on anyone who is entering to the uk labour market in the same wauy that labour markets operates in the other 170 odd countries around the world.

Nothing fancy, just common sense arrangements.

I predict such restrictions would be far more popular that the current unregulated free labour market that exists now to serve the interests of big business.

You know it too, tory boy.

They would be far more popular, but as you can see with EU immigration, which has fallen since 2016 and been replaced effectively with like-for-like from the rest of the world, the writing is on the wall on that one. As the rest of the world is made up of primarily developing countries and people prepared to work for less, why not eh Fergie? The post Brexit Singapore model you voted for alongside your fellow, wealthy, home county Brexiteer advocates like Paterson, Rees-Mogg etc can't wait to reset British industry to tap into all those poor people from developing countries like Singapore does.

You know it as well as your way round Waitrose in Burgess Hill too, Fergie

Dorset Seagull · Feb 8, 2019

pb21 said:
On the contrary this is very much on topic.

People didn't vote for Brexit thinking on the basis of mundane things like wishing to run low on vital pharmaceuticals, losing jobs or the GFA being put at significant risk, like keeps getting banged on about. They voted to get their country back so that incandescent light bulbs can be legalised once again so that people can see.

Remainers see the light

lawros left foot · Feb 8, 2019

https://apple.news/AwnwLQI5QQVWVE6jdIwz1NA

cunning fergus · Feb 8, 2019

ManOfSussex said:
They would be far more popular, but as you can see with EU immigration, which has fallen since 2016 and been replaced effectively with like-for-like from the rest of the world, the writing is on the wall on that one. As the rest of the world is made up of primarily developing countries and people prepared to work for less, why not eh Fergie? The post Brexit Singapore model you voted for alongside your fellow, wealthy, home county Brexiteer advocates like Paterson, Rees-Mogg etc can't wait to reset British industry to tap into all those poor people from developing countries like Singapore does.

You know it as well as your way round Waitrose in Burgess Hill too, Fergie

I understand the point you make, immigration will happen because that is what the politicians want, in cahoots with the capitalists in the UK Tory parties. On that score i accept your assessment because that is what happens now.

Outside the EU the Govt will be more accountable to the electorate for the Governance of the country. This control extends to how we control our borders, and if a political party like the Tories want to say we will maintain FOM etc then they will be either supported or punished by the electorate.

I suspect political parties will coalesce around a balanced approach which like other countries protects the most vulnerable workers in the UK.

Sounds radical doesnt it......no wonder you dont like it.

Lever · Feb 8, 2019

pastafarian said:
Pointing out the truth is not gloating.

Which account do you normally post under then?.....joined feb 2019....1st post....and called yourself "lever"....
0/10 must try harder
Remoaners getting a bit desperate now

...if not gloating then a bit aggressive then.
Do you have a problem with new arrivals by any chance? Oh yes, of course you would have..........

ManOfSussex · Feb 8, 2019

cunning fergus said:
I understand the point you make, immigration will happen because that is what the politicians want, in cahoots with the capitalists in the UK Tory parties. On that score i accept your assessment because that is what happens now.

Outside the EU the Govt will be more accountable to the electorate for the Governance of the country. This control extends to how we control our borders, and if a political party like the Tories want to say we will maintain FOM etc then they will be either supported or punished by the electorate.

I suspect political parties will coalesce around a balanced approach which like other countries protects the most vulnerable workers in the UK.

Sounds radical doesnt it......no wonder you dont like it.

It's not going to happen though. With the fires we'll be fighting in this country after Brexit, before your Singaporean dream takes off, we'll need every cheap migrant worker we can get and plenty afterwards. I'm sure you and your wealthy Tory Brexiteer chums won't disappoint in that regard.

Thunder Bolt · Feb 8, 2019

Interesting tweet from Lord Adonis. I'm not quite sure how accurate it is, but it would be hilarious if Yes Minister actually came true.

[tweet]1093771273702948864[/tweet]

cunning fergus · Feb 8, 2019

Thunder Bolt said:
Interesting tweet from Lord Adonis. I'm not quite sure how accurate it is, but it would be hilarious if Yes Minister actually came true.

[tweet]1093771273702948864[/tweet]

Last week he said on Today Radio 4 (I think) that Yvette Cooper’s amendment was in the bag. He was compelling and utterly convincing. I guess this week’s snake oil still needs to be shifted?

cunning fergus · Feb 8, 2019

ManOfSussex said:
It's not going to happen though. With the fires we'll be fighting in this country after Brexit, before your Singaporean dream takes off, we'll need every cheap migrant worker we can get and plenty afterwards. I'm sure you and your wealthy Tory Brexiteer chums won't disappoint in that regard.

More predictions, I bet you never predicted Brexit?

That’s how much value your words have.

ManOfSussex · Feb 8, 2019

cunning fergus said:
More predictions, I bet you never predicted Brexit?

That’s how much value your words have.

My only surprise with the Brexit result in 2016 was that leave didn't win by as bigger margin as I thought it would.

Not all of us live in privileged, home counties, wealthy, middle class bubbles like you do Fergie.

nicko31 · Feb 8, 2019

Thunder Bolt said:
Interesting tweet from Lord Adonis. I'm not quite sure how accurate it is, but it would be hilarious if Yes Minister actually came true.

[tweet]1093771273702948864[/tweet]

Probably Sir Gus O'donnell, always said it was very difficult to deliver a controlled Brexit in the 2 years.

larus · Feb 8, 2019

Simster said:
Do you think those 5 stories collectively are as good news as the Nissan news was bad?

I would expect a non-linear decline in overall investment once we leave the EU. There will be good news, there will be bad - but the overall trend will be bad. That's why you won't find me posting good news investment or bad news lack of investment - we'll soon see how it affects our bottom line as our GDP falls further and further behind France and Germany. Give it 10 years and even a basket case country like Italy will be doing better than us unfortunately.

I get fed up with these cheap jibes about the UK growth based on BS. Let's deal with facts.

Here is the data from the 20 years from 1997 - 2017. We have exceeded France and Germany.

Note to remainers - this is factual data from (https://data.worldbank.org/indicato...2017&locations=DE-GB-FR&start=1997&view=chart), not scaremongering.

I've downloaded and totaled the last 20 years.

I will leave you to consider the facts (I can imagine a certain poster with German connections spluttering a little over this information).

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