[Politics] Brexit

[DavidinSouthampton]

I'd vote remain, as I did last time. But

1. I am convinced that, if we had not had austerity, we would not have had a Leave Vote. If people and communities are treated like rubbish, they will rebel.

2. I don't think we should ever have referendums ever, about anything. It does not fit with our system of government.

3. MPs are elected to deal with it on our behalf..... and if we don't like what they do, we get the chance to vote them out 5 years later. Like it or not, that is how it ought to work.

 

[Brian Parsons]

Kent Seagull you ask the question. I'm a leaver, I'm also thick inbred Northener as labelled by the remoaners. I'm also 73. Were do I start, I'm not actually a true Northener I was born in Sussex, I moved here sometime ago. I can remember a Britain that wasn't in the EU and it was a lot happier, not sure if we were wealthier. When we joined the Common Market tats exactly what it was, market were we could buy and sell. As it started to evolve into the behemoth it is now we, the public were asked to vote on our continued membership. I remember that well as it was the first time the armed forces got the vote ( I was in the RAF at the time). It made sense then to remain because spares for cars, tellies, domestic appliances would have been extortionate. Sadly it all went Pete Tong from there on in. Suddenly a bunch of UNELECTED BUREAUCRATS were telling us how to grow cucumbers, how many pints of milk we could produce. All to protect the inefficient French farmers. We lost our fishing rights to the Spanish and French fleets who stuck two fingers up to the EU over quotas. Are we better off financially, don't know. Will we be worse of if we leave, again don't know because nobody knows, they think they do. Getting control of our borders, limiting the number of immigrants that enter is not racist it's common sense. Up here in Northumberland there's plenty of room to build more homes but there's no work per sey, but down South it's getting overcrowded, something has to give.
Now here's the crux, do you think for one minute that the German/ French car industry are happy about the EU hampering our departure. No we are Germany's biggest market within the EU. Will the Spanish hotels have to close because we leave NO. Europe despite their bloody mindedness need us just as much while we in as much as when we're gone.
Project Fear never went away after the result it became the Remainers.
I personally believe we may struggle for a couple of years, it'll be no different to Austerity but then I really do think we will prosper and all the young people who have accused me of destroying their future might even say sorry but I'm not going to hold my breath.
Be brave, embrace the future.

Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk

 

[WATFORD zero]

Portslade seagull and GT49er have certainly convinced me.

Neither of you have any idea what would happen with 'no deal' but 'hope' it will be OK. Well that has certainly convinced me and put all those businesses who say otherwise in their place.

It’s certainly a compelling argument you put forward

 

[LlcoolJ]

I'd vote remain, as I did last time. But

1. I am convinced that, if we had not had austerity, we would not have had a Leave Vote. If people and communities are treated like rubbish, they will rebel.

2. I don't think we should ever have referendums ever, about anything. It does not fit with our system of government.

3. MPs are elected to deal with it on our behalf..... and if we don't like what they do, we get the chance to vote them out 5 years later. Like it or not, that is how it ought to work.

What a sensible post. Amongst so much conjecture and teeth gnashing. Well played.

 

[DavidinSouthampton]

Kent Seagull you ask the question. I'm a leaver, I'm also thick inbred Northener as labelled by the remoaners. I'm also 73. Were do I start, I'm not actually a true Northener I was born in Sussex, I moved here sometime ago. I can remember a Britain that wasn't in the EU and it was a lot happier, not sure if we were wealthier. When we joined the Common Market tats exactly what it was, market were we could buy and sell. As it started to evolve into the behemoth it is now we, the public were asked to vote on our continued membership. I remember that well as it was the first time the armed forces got the vote ( I was in the RAF at the time). It made sense then to remain because spares for cars, tellies, domestic appliances would have been extortionate. Sadly it all went Pete Tong from there on in. Suddenly a bunch of UNELECTED BUREAUCRATS were telling us how to grow cucumbers, how many pints of milk we could produce. All to protect the inefficient French farmers. We lost our fishing rights to the Spanish and French fleets who stuck two fingers up to the EU over quotas. Are we better off financially, don't know. Will we be worse of if we leave, again don't know because nobody knows, they think they do. Getting control of our borders, limiting the number of immigrants that enter is not racist it's common sense. Up here in Northumberland there's plenty of room to build more homes but there's no work per sey, but down South it's getting overcrowded, something has to give.
Now here's the crux, do you think for one minute that the German/ French car industry are happy about the EU hampering our departure. No we are Germany's biggest market within the EU. Will the Spanish hotels have to close because we leave NO. Europe despite their bloody mindedness need us just as much while we in as much as when we're gone.
Project Fear never went away after the result it became the Remainers.
I personally believe we may struggle for a couple of years, it'll be no different to Austerity but then I really do think we will prosper and all the young people who have accused me of destroying their future might even say sorry but I'm not going to hold my breath.
Be brave, embrace the future.

Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk

Is the EU hampering our departure? or are we just constantly messing it up.
People might talk about the "bully boys" of Europe, but the EU has the other remaining members to worry about and look after.
We are choosing to leave. Your own attitude expressed here seems to suggest you can't wait. Why should they do us any favours?
I think we will find that the German car-makers et al will cope with a reduction in sales to the UK if that happens, because they perceive it makes more sense to keep the rest of the European Union together. They will take the hit for the sake of the greater good...…… which the UK seems incapable of doing.

And it is not unelected bureaucrats who impose the rules in Europe. They are VOTED ON in the European Parliament, where we have always had DULY ELECTED MEPs. You've been listening to Farage too much.

 

[clapham_gull]

Because the government didn't promise to enact the result of the first vote? A decision endorsed by parliament and the electorate in another vote in 2017 ... how many votes do you need before you accept democracy?

That will be the Labour government who proposed a very soft Brexit.

You can bang on about democracy all you like, but the fact is that after you made your vote you have had absolutely no control over any of this.

The leavers are currently leaving us in. You couldn't make it up.

 

[Pevenseagull]

I'd vote remain, as I did last time. But

1. I am convinced that, if we had not had austerity, we would not have had a Leave Vote. If people and communities are treated like rubbish, they will rebel.

2. I don't think we should ever have referendums ever, about anything. It does not fit with our system of government.

3. MPs are elected to deal with it on our behalf..... and if we don't like what they do, we get the chance to vote them out 5 years later. Like it or not, that is how it ought to work.

Saves me the effort of putting my opinion.

 

[drew]

Kent Seagull you ask the question. I'm a leaver, I'm also thick inbred Northener as labelled by the remoaners. I'm also 73. Were do I start, I'm not actually a true Northener I was born in Sussex, I moved here sometime ago. I can remember a Britain that wasn't in the EU and it was a lot happier, not sure if we were wealthier. When we joined the Common Market tats exactly what it was, market were we could buy and sell. As it started to evolve into the behemoth it is now we, the public were asked to vote on our continued membership. I remember that well as it was the first time the armed forces got the vote ( I was in the RAF at the time). It made sense then to remain because spares for cars, tellies, domestic appliances would have been extortionate. Sadly it all went Pete Tong from there on in. Suddenly a bunch of UNELECTED BUREAUCRATS were telling us how to grow cucumbers, how many pints of milk we could produce. All to protect the inefficient French farmers. We lost our fishing rights to the Spanish and French fleets who stuck two fingers up to the EU over quotas. Are we better off financially, don't know. Will we be worse of if we leave, again don't know because nobody knows, they think they do. Getting control of our borders, limiting the number of immigrants that enter is not racist it's common sense. Up here in Northumberland there's plenty of room to build more homes but there's no work per sey, but down South it's getting overcrowded, something has to give.
Now here's the crux, do you think for one minute that the German/ French car industry are happy about the EU hampering our departure. No we are Germany's biggest market within the EU. Will the Spanish hotels have to close because we leave NO. Europe despite their bloody mindedness need us just as much while we in as much as when we're gone.
Project Fear never went away after the result it became the Remainers.
I personally believe we may struggle for a couple of years, it'll be no different to Austerity but then I really do think we will prosper and all the young people who have accused me of destroying their future might even say sorry but I'm not going to hold my breath.
Be brave, embrace the future.

Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk

The whole world was different back then. There was no WTO, an organization which now boasts 164 members. China was not an economic global threat and pretty much anything cheap made in the far east was made in Hong Kong. The world has changed considerably since we weren't in the EU/Common Market. Commissioners don't pass laws, the MEPs do and one particular MEP responsible for fisheries has abjectly failed to support our fishermen. As for quotas, weren't a lot of them sold by british fisherman to overseas companies for a quick buck? You have your reasons and I'm not sure anyone will convince you otherwise but others should be aware of facts, not rose tinted historical memoirs.

 

[birthofanorange]

Kent Seagull you ask the question. I'm a leaver, I'm also thick inbred Northener as labelled by the remoaners. I'm also 73. Were do I start, I'm not actually a true Northener I was born in Sussex, I moved here sometime ago. I can remember a Britain that wasn't in the EU and it was a lot happier, not sure if we were wealthier. When we joined the Common Market tats exactly what it was, market were we could buy and sell. As it started to evolve into the behemoth it is now we, the public were asked to vote on our continued membership. I remember that well as it was the first time the armed forces got the vote ( I was in the RAF at the time). It made sense then to remain because spares for cars, tellies, domestic appliances would have been extortionate. Sadly it all went Pete Tong from there on in. Suddenly a bunch of UNELECTED BUREAUCRATS were telling us how to grow cucumbers, how many pints of milk we could produce. All to protect the inefficient French farmers. We lost our fishing rights to the Spanish and French fleets who stuck two fingers up to the EU over quotas. Are we better off financially, don't know. Will we be worse of if we leave, again don't know because nobody knows, they think they do. Getting control of our borders, limiting the number of immigrants that enter is not racist it's common sense. Up here in Northumberland there's plenty of room to build more homes but there's no work per sey, but down South it's getting overcrowded, something has to give.
Now here's the crux, do you think for one minute that the German/ French car industry are happy about the EU hampering our departure. No we are Germany's biggest market within the EU. Will the Spanish hotels have to close because we leave NO. Europe despite their bloody mindedness need us just as much while we in as much as when we're gone.
Project Fear never went away after the result it became the Remainers.
I personally believe we may struggle for a couple of years, it'll be no different to Austerity but then I really do think we will prosper and all the young people who have accused me of destroying their future might even say sorry but I'm not going to hold my breath.
Be brave, embrace the future.

Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk

Good grief. I have no words, other than I'm sorry you feel so strongly about it. Please consider, though, that (with all due respect) the things you are unhappy with are not necessarily things that younger folk share, and they are the ones that will be grasping the baton that you hand over. I am no spring chicken, either - 57 this year - but I would like to think that the next generation have more say in the future.....their future, than folk that have lived most of their lives already.
Let me ask you; Would it really affect you if we remained? Truthfully? In real terms, I mean, not just because it's something you personally want to happen?
I respect your opinion and defend your right to feel any way you choose to do, but can you not consider that the legacy you are leaving is not one that those with most of their lives ahead would want?

 

[clapham_gull]

Kent Seagull you ask the question. I'm a leaver, I'm also thick inbred Northener as labelled by the remoaners. I'm also 73. Were do I start, I'm not actually a true Northener I was born in Sussex, I moved here sometime ago. I can remember a Britain that wasn't in the EU and it was a lot happier, not sure if we were wealthier. When we joined the Common Market tats exactly what it was, market were we could buy and sell. As it started to evolve into the behemoth it is now we, the public were asked to vote on our continued membership. I remember that well as it was the first time the armed forces got the vote ( I was in the RAF at the time). It made sense then to remain because spares for cars, tellies, domestic appliances would have been extortionate. Sadly it all went Pete Tong from there on in. Suddenly a bunch of UNELECTED BUREAUCRATS were telling us how to grow cucumbers, how many pints of milk we could produce. All to protect the inefficient French farmers. We lost our fishing rights to the Spanish and French fleets who stuck two fingers up to the EU over quotas. Are we better off financially, don't know. Will we be worse of if we leave, again don't know because nobody knows, they think they do. Getting control of our borders, limiting the number of immigrants that enter is not racist it's common sense. Up here in Northumberland there's plenty of room to build more homes but there's no work per sey, but down South it's getting overcrowded, something has to give.
Now here's the crux, do you think for one minute that the German/ French car industry are happy about the EU hampering our departure. No we are Germany's biggest market within the EU. Will the Spanish hotels have to close because we leave NO. Europe despite their bloody mindedness need us just as much while we in as much as when we're gone.
Project Fear never went away after the result it became the Remainers.
I personally believe we may struggle for a couple of years, it'll be no different to Austerity but then I really do think we will prosper and all the young people who have accused me of destroying their future might even say sorry but I'm not going to hold my breath.
Be brave, embrace the future.

Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk

If you think that the EU ever told anyone how to grow cucumbers, I'm not sure you should be allowed to vote.

It was simply a grading system (lobbied for by companies) so buyers in other countries knew what they were buying. The grading was identical to the existing UK one anyway.

#EuroMyth

 

[theboybilly]

100% leave. Nothing has changed my mind, In fact the whinging actions and vitreol of the Remainers over the last few months has made me dig my heels in further. I realise that is irrational but a vote was a vote, to overturn it now would open all manner of problems in the future. If it does get overturned I will never vote again

 

[Mental Lental]

I'd vote remain, as I did last time. But

1. I am convinced that, if we had not had austerity, we would not have had a Leave Vote. If people and communities are treated like rubbish, they will rebel.

2. I don't think we should ever have referendums ever, about anything. It does not fit with our system of government.

3. MPs are elected to deal with it on our behalf..... and if we don't like what they do, we get the chance to vote them out 5 years later. Like it or not, that is how it ought to work.

We'll have none of your sensibleness here thank you very much.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Kent Seagull you ask the question. I'm a leaver, I'm also thick inbred Northener as labelled by the remoaners. I'm also 73. Were do I start, I'm not actually a true Northener I was born in Sussex, I moved here sometime ago. I can remember a Britain that wasn't in the EU and it was a lot happier, not sure if we were wealthier. When we joined the Common Market tats exactly what it was, market were we could buy and sell. As it started to evolve into the behemoth it is now we, the public were asked to vote on our continued membership. I remember that well as it was the first time the armed forces got the vote ( I was in the RAF at the time). It made sense then to remain because spares for cars, tellies, domestic appliances would have been extortionate. Sadly it all went Pete Tong from there on in. Suddenly a bunch of UNELECTED BUREAUCRATS were telling us how to grow cucumbers, how many pints of milk we could produce. All to protect the inefficient French farmers. We lost our fishing rights to the Spanish and French fleets who stuck two fingers up to the EU over quotas. Are we better off financially, don't know. Will we be worse of if we leave, again don't know because nobody knows, they think they do. Getting control of our borders, limiting the number of immigrants that enter is not racist it's common sense. Up here in Northumberland there's plenty of room to build more homes but there's no work per sey, but down South it's getting overcrowded, something has to give.
Now here's the crux, do you think for one minute that the German/ French car industry are happy about the EU hampering our departure. No we are Germany's biggest market within the EU. Will the Spanish hotels have to close because we leave NO. Europe despite their bloody mindedness need us just as much while we in as much as when we're gone.
Project Fear never went away after the result it became the Remainers.
I personally believe we may struggle for a couple of years, it'll be no different to Austerity but then I really do think we will prosper and all the young people who have accused me of destroying their future might even say sorry but I'm not going to hold my breath.
Be brave, embrace the future.

Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk

False memory. The 1970s before joining the Common Market were not happier. We had loads of strikes, three day week, fuel rationing with the price of oil going through the roof, inflation, and were called the sick man of Europe.
We had to go to the IMF for loans to try & pay our way.

 

[crookie]

Was a reluctant leaver but would vote remain if there was another vote. The total omnishambles over the last couple of years has made me ashamed. Our politicians are an embarrassment and seem totally out of their depth. We have become a laughing stock with a lunatic hard right cabal dictating our future and an utterly useless opposition flailing in their wake.

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

 

[Baldseagull]

Remain isn't specific. It doesn't cover future changes the EU might inflict upon us.

The options would have to be:
a).Remain (with a promise that we'll never join the Euro).
b).Remain (but with guaranteed no greater unification).
c).Remain (without a European army).
d),Remain (but without a & b)
e).Remain (but without a & c)
f).Remain (but without b & c)
g).Remain (but without a,b or c)

That would level the playing field somewhat - but I don't think our shyster parliamentarians would want a level playing field a second time around, would they.

Would remain but with a legally binding referendum on any and all of those propositions suffice? Because that is what was on offer last time.

 

[Barham's tash]

Quite simple really. I've realised that we'd be better off "doing our own thing" as regards trade etc and without all the bureacracy (another layer) that goes with it. I honestly do believe that other countries will start a leaving process as well after seeing how our Brexit is handled although it does appear to be a very painful process.

Hang on. You’re blaming EU bureaucracy for the inept/inert performance of OUR politicians? What did you expect the EU to do? Acquiesce to every demand, give us an easy path to BREXIT and then watch us swan off into the sunset?

Blimey. What a warped opinion as to where the blame lies in this cluster**** of a process.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Baldseagull]

I would be loathed to vote again as it would mean the forces intent on ignoring the biggest democratic event in our nation's history had prevailed. We enact democratic results of elections in our country (as promised before the referendum by the government) ... keep asking the question until you get the 'right' result is all very EU

Is that not just free and fair elections that we enact?

 

[whitelion]

Hang on. You’re blaming EU bureaucracy for the inept/inert performance of OUR politicians? What did you expect the EU to do? Acquiesce to every demand, give us an easy path to BREXIT and then watch us swan off into the sunset?

Blimey. What a warped opinion as to where the blame lies in this cluster**** of a process.


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I don't where you managed to conjure up your reply in response to my post re bureaucracy. I'm talking about the structure of the organisation rather than the inept politicians that you're referring to. I honestly do believe we'll prosper ok in the big wide world without the constraints put on trade by the EU.

 

[Baldseagull]

See my last reply to [MENTION=1320]Notters[/MENTION]. Bureacracy etc etc

There will be more bureaucracy for anyone exporting to the EU, and in many other aspects of business and life.

 

[LlcoolJ]

I don't where you managed to conjure up your reply in response to my post re bureaucracy. I'm talking about the structure of the organisation rather than the inept politicians that you're referring to. I honestly do believe we'll prosper ok in the big wide world without the constraints put on trade by the EU.

But voting Leave was always a vote for MORE bureaucracy and MORE red tape. It's impossible for it to be anything else, and the past two years have proved that. It's not "project fear", it's "oh look, here's some facts". Amazed that this is even still a thing.