This 7/7 Inquest...

[tedebear]

Because public accountability is one of the factors that ensures the lessons are learnt rather than just swept under the carpet.

Maybe - but more recently I find public accountability is just being used for scaremongering and finger pointing (exactly what happened yesterday). At the end all we get is someone forced to apologise publically, after the poor families who lived through it have to live through it all again. Also these inquests are ludicrosly expensive.

 

[Westdene Seagull]

Also these inquests are ludicrosly expensive.

Given the seriousness of the incident I don't think expense should really be one of the deciding factors. Anyway, there would still need to be an inquest, public or otherwise, to ensure improvements were made so the costs would still happen regardless.

 

[Nibble]

I am prepared to accept I may have misunderstood your question but I personally think the truth, albeit from a government source is a good thing. If they did not reveal these facts there will be witnesses who will still keep looking for answers to what occured and if they do reveal the truth it is questioned. A case of damned if you do...

 

[beorhthelm]

Same statement goes for you. Is publishing the truth to the entire world a good thing? Is it not better that it is left to the emergency services and MI5/6 or whomever to deal with behind closed doors?

How helpful is it that a firefighter viewed the first arriving ambulance man as simple a means to ferry people to hospital?

often things kept behind closed doors dont get resolved or changed, as only those with a vested interest in the status quo learn about them. if there is a problem in the relationship between fire and ambulance works that needs to be out in the open so someone from outside can address it. its not great for the families but there is certainly a big public interest.

 

[grummitts gloves]

I suspect, in this case, that there has been a hell of a lot of agonising about what sort of evidence was relevant. And a lot of cross-checking of witness statements. And a lot of pre-inquest arguments between lawyers.

There seems to be evidence emerging that some of the victims died because of what happened after the bombs went off, rather than the bombings themselves. If that is the case, I guess it's important to establish the facts.

Or is it? That's one of the questions that might have been exercising the lawyers for the past few years.

The investigation afetr 7/7 focused on a number of other individuals who were suspected of being linked to the original plot. The inquest was held off until certain other lines of enquiry were persued.

 

[brunswick]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nY2NXPl625A

watch this and then reply to the thread......ZZzzzz

 

[Brovion]

Maybe they were just following agreed procedures, rather than their own feelings?

All emergency services operate according to agreed procedures. That's how teamwork is achieved. If the procedures turn out to have been catastrophically flawed, it's not the fault of the individual fire service personnel, or ambulance crews, or police officers. And it's not necessarily the fault of the people who drew up the procedures either - since it's impossible to test everything before real incidents happen.

I think you're confusing 'teamwork' with expecting people to act as drones following rigid, politically-imposed procedures. That's certainly what my wife (a nurse) feels.

 

[fire&skill]

The thing that makes you good at anything is PRACTICE.

Thank God we don't get too much practice at this sort of thing, hence things [especially in the early stages of the incident] don't go too well when they do happen.

And believe me, no amount of practice exercise can ever prepare you for the real thing.

 

[beorhthelm]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nY2NXPl625A

watch this and then reply to the thread......ZZzzzz

did you pick the right youtube, was there supposed to be some significance? so a distaster scenario expert uses a similar scenario as he does every other week (only the "detail" is chosen by the client and we dont actually know what those details are) and also did so in a TV program the previous year. how is that either coincidence or conspiracy, seems mundane routine to me. was his TV apperance on 7/7 part of an eloborate double bluff? as for the claims at the end that the bombers weren't there, where were they and where are they now?

 

[HampshireSeagulls]

The incident has to be understood so that people can learn from it. The main problem is that looking back on what has happened people are confronted with things that are less than savoury and appear to be the wrong decisions in the cold light of day. Being confronted with casualties, a bomb, and what appears to be a paramedic who is not doing what you think a paramedic should do, there are going to be raised tempers. Looking back over notebooks (especially ones that have personal opinions rather than pure facts in) is only going to raise temperatures again.

The London Emergency Services Response document is one that we use on the course with the students and it explains what the responsibilities are, the first actions for each service, etc. This sort of document can only be a living document, and can only be revised after a live incident - you simply don't get the same responses in a training scenario.

I don't think that the media help matters by focusing on what they see as a juicy story of pitting the Fire and Ambulance service against each other - that's lazy journos trying to score headline points. The main thrust of the inquest must be to assess what happened based on facts, not personalities and to decide if decisions were made poorly at the time - not in hindsight. Holding it in public may not be the best way ahead, although it does give transparency to proceedings. As the Fire Brigade said after the latest set of revelations - how would you respond seeing a paramedic not helping people but trying to tell everyone that he was in charge until someone else turned up? Same for the fireman not wanting to walk into tunnels that might be live - do you really need another couple of casualties because it was not possible to wait for confirmation that the lines are off? If the copper had fritzed himself on the line because he had got it wrong, then they would have had to deal with another delay!

 

[Barrel of Fun]

BBC News - 7/7 inquest: Survivor left trapped under Tube doors

It is very interesting and harrowing reading the accounts of various people caught up in the blasts.

 

[vegster]

It is very difficult to listen to the witness's account from their own perspective. Although it is obvious that mistakes were made amid the chaos and the carnage, it is heartwarming to hear how some people did so much to help the injured in horrifing conditions. I honestly don't know if I could do the same.

 

[ben andrews' girlfriend]

If it is a public inquest to find the truth then the truth is in the public's interest.

The truth was that a number of bombs went off in London, and many, many people died / were injured.

People are all human, it's a high stress environment, where things are constantly changing, and the scene would have been a nightmare - ie not knowing whether another bomb would have gone off when emergency staff had got to the scene as what happens in Baghdad / ETA attacks. As emergency personell we are all trained for major incidents, but in the heat of the moment I'm sure people snapped at eachother.

Everyone did their best that day, so I can't see why all of the firemen etc are being dragged through the mud. I don't see why there is such a public investigation, it should have been left as a debrief with the relevant authorities.

 

[Hatterlovesbrighton]

The truth was that a number of bombs went off in London, and many, many people died / were injured.

People are all human, it's a high stress environment, where things are constantly changing, and the scene would have been a nightmare - ie not knowing whether another bomb would have gone off when emergency staff had got to the scene as what happens in Baghdad / ETA attacks. As emergency personell we are all trained for major incidents, but in the heat of the moment I'm sure people snapped at eachother.

Everyone did their best that day, so I can't see why all of the firemen etc are being dragged through the mud. I don't see why there is such a public investigation, it should have been left as a debrief with the relevant authorities.

I think everyone will accept that it was a high-stress environment and that everyone did their best, but we have to know if there are any processes or procedures that need to be changed as a result of the attacks.

The best enquiries and those most likely to result in real change (if change is needed) are those conducted in public.

Add to that the fact that tens of thousands of people were affected by the attacks and want to know what happened.