[News] Nigel Farage and Reform

[jcdenton08]

I do hope you're not trying to get someone to say "See, it's not only thick stupid racists that vote Reform, Grumpy old losers do as well".

Because I'm sure nobody would be naive enough to fall for that

Too late, this thread and the Labour thread are full of the same posters saying exactly this. In the Labour thread one poster just referred to them as “Retard”.

A lot of us agree with the overall message. Huge net migration to the UK is unsustainable for the size of the nation, the housing crisis and the infrastructure (specifically the NHS).

As I said, the net equivalent of the entire population of Dorset or Northumberland emigrating to the UK is unsustainable year-on-year.

People make the easy mistake of rubbishing people’s (in my view correct) concerns when it comes to enormous net migration. It’s very, very easy to tie together “Mass immigration is unsustainable” with “Racist gammon”. And poo-poo people, call them idiots (“ignorant woman”)…

Then *shocked Pikachu face* they go and vote for the outsider party (Reform, AfD (Germany), RN (France), FDL (Italy), and the Nexit movement (Netherlands).

Labour are reacting now because they’ve seen that people are putting their feelings into votes.

Within a liberal echo chamber (one I experienced at drama school), closing your eyes and wishing something just because the echo chamber - full of people with similar values and life experiences - says so doesn’t equate to real world outcomes. Practically everybody there was convinced Corbyn would win the election, because that’s what they wanted. And they couldn’t possibly see why anyone else - impoverished people not at a middle class drama school for instance - would feel differently.

Oh wait, they did feel differently? Well they must ALL be racists, skinheads and morons.

 

[WATFORD zero]

Too late, this thread and the Labour thread are full of the same posters saying exactly this. In the Labour thread one poster just referred to them as “Retard”.

A lot of us agree with the overall message. Huge net migration to the UK is unsustainable for the size of the nation, the housing crisis and the infrastructure (specifically the NHS).

View attachment 201748

As I said, the net equivalent of the entire population of Dorset or Northumberland emigrating to the UK is unsustainable year-on-year.

People make the easy mistake of rubbishing people’s (in my view correct) concerns when it comes to enormous net migration. It’s very, very easy to tie together “Mass immigration is unsustainable” with “Racist gammon”. And poo-poo people, call them idiots (“ignorant woman”)…

Then *shocked Pikachu face* they go and vote for the outsider party (Reform, AfD (Germany), RN (France), FDL (Italy), and the Nexit movement (Netherlands).

Labour are reacting now because they’ve seen that people are putting their feelings into votes.

Within a liberal echo chamber (one I experienced at drama school), closing your eyes and wishing something just because the echo chamber - full of people with similar values and life experiences - says so doesn’t equate to real world outcomes. Practically everybody there was convinced Corbyn would win the election, because that’s what they wanted. And they couldn’t possibly see why anyone else - impoverished people not at a middle class drama school for instance - would feel differently.

Oh wait, they did feel differently? Well they must ALL be racists, skinheads and morons.

Put your pearls down snowflake. My post was a joke

 

[jcdenton08]

Put your pearls down snowflake. It was a joke

Be good though if you addressed my points and left out the emojis, and had an adult discussion.

 

[Chicken Run]

Too late, this thread and the Labour thread are full of the same posters saying exactly this. In the Labour thread one poster just referred to them as “Retard”.

A lot of us agree with the overall message. Huge net migration to the UK is unsustainable for the size of the nation, the housing crisis and the infrastructure (specifically the NHS).

View attachment 201748

As I said, the net equivalent of the entire population of Dorset or Northumberland emigrating to the UK is unsustainable year-on-year.

People make the easy mistake of rubbishing people’s (in my view correct) concerns when it comes to enormous net migration. It’s very, very easy to tie together “Mass immigration is unsustainable” with “Racist gammon”. And poo-poo people, call them idiots (“ignorant woman”)…

Then *shocked Pikachu face* they go and vote for the outsider party (Reform, AfD (Germany), RN (France), FDL (Italy), and the Nexit movement (Netherlands).

Labour are reacting now because they’ve seen that people are putting their feelings into votes.

Within a liberal echo chamber (one I experienced at drama school), closing your eyes and wishing something just because the echo chamber - full of people with similar values and life experiences - says so doesn’t equate to real world outcomes. Practically everybody there was convinced Corbyn would win the election, because that’s what they wanted. And they couldn’t possibly see why anyone else - impoverished people not at a middle class drama school for instance - would feel differently.

Oh wait, they did feel differently? Well they must ALL be racists, skinheads and morons.

That net figure of 728,000 doesn’t include, 36,816 people that were detected arriving in the UK by small boats crossing the English Channel in 2024 or indeed the thousands already beached this year

 

[jcdenton08]

That net figure of 728,000 doesn’t include, 36,816 people that were detected arriving in the UK by small boats crossing the English Channel or indeed the thousands already beached this year

Or other undocumented migrants - that figure is “new blood”, doesn’t take into account those who have overstayed visas or entered the country undocumented by any other means.

 

[Bodian]

Farage has bought a house in Clacton and does meet his constituents

https://www.clactonandfrintongazett...eets-residents-regularly-buying-clacton-home/

I think that article more accurately says "Farage says he meets his constituents in Clacton". No real proof that he does; no evidence he hold surgeries, no evidence that he attends meetings there. As to buying a house - he's required to have a 'residence' in his constituency I think? He doesn't actually live there, and has quite a few other houses / property in the UK - plus of course Belgium. And of course he'll be claiming expenses for it.

 

[TomandJerry]

I think that article more accurately says "Farage says he meets his constituents in Clacton". No real proof that he does; no evidence he hold surgeries, no evidence that he attends meetings there. As to buying a house - he's required to have a 'residence' in his constituency I think? He doesn't actually live there, and has quite a few other houses / property in the UK - plus of course Belgium. And of course he'll be claiming expenses for it.

He spends some of his time there

 

[WATFORD zero]

Be good though if you addressed my points and left out the emojis, and had an adult discussion.

I'm just cooking dinner, but why do you think Farage's solution to immigration this time is so much better than his last solution, which drove immigration skywards ?

Too late, this thread and the Labour thread are full of the same posters saying exactly this. In the Labour thread one poster just referred to them as “Retard”.

A lot of us agree with the overall message. Huge net migration to the UK is unsustainable for the size of the nation, the housing crisis and the infrastructure (specifically the NHS).

Of your two most important issues, addressing the housing crisis, 10% of people building houses are immigrants, whilst nearly 20% of the NHS are immigrants (and that's completely ignoring support services). I think it may not be as simple as the solution you've been sold. No emoji

And we'll need people to pay your and my pensions.

 

[Bodian]

He spends some of his time there

Is that a 'whoosh'? What other politician would feel the need to post a photo-op image of them in an amusement arcade to try and prove that they are actually in their constituency? How long did he stay on that visit - or was it just a flying trip for the photo? How many constituents did he meet on that visit?

 

[TomandJerry]

Is that a 'whoosh'? What other politician would feel the need to post a photo-op image of them in an amusement arcade to try and prove that they are actually in their constituency? How long did he stay on that visit - or was it just a flying trip for the photo? How many constituents did he meet on that visit?

No woosh, but he does a fair bit, like holding a small business forum.

"But speaking to LBC, Mr Farage said he was planning a “massive event” for small businesses in Clacton later in January and was “out meeting constituents I bet far more than any MP has done for many, many years in Clacton”.

"More than 100 local businessmen and women from across the constituency attended from sectors as wide as catering, manufacturing and hospitality last Friday evening.

It was great to see a room so full of passionate, driven and proud Clacton people come together to debate and discuss both national and local issue"s."

https://www.clactonandfrintongazett...gel-farage---i-will-stand-businesses-clacton/

 

[jcdenton08]

I'm just cooking dinner, but why do you think Farage's solution to immigration this time is so much better than his last solution ?



Of your two most important issues, addressing the housing crisis, 10% of people building houses are immigrants, whilst nearly 20% of the NHS are immigrants. I think it may not be as simple as the solution you've been sold. No emoji

And we'll need people to pay your and my pensions.

Farage is a prat, and I personally don’t think Reform are the answer, so you won’t see me going to bat for them specifically. My point is that I can see why people do, and it’s not because they’re closeted British Nazis or uneducated northerners. It’s because they live in areas which have changed beyond recognition, for the worse, with a big part in many towns due to out of control immigration.

The Tories had no idea what to do, Labour have only had a year but are now speaking publicly about this only because of the shoeing they got in elections.

As I said in the other thread, the issue isn’t these 10% of people building houses, or the 20% of people working in the NHS, nor is it the carers that Labour are going after.

The issue is the sheer number of immigrants is unsustainable. All parties (except maybe the Greens) are in agreement on this.

Not every immigrant is useful. It’s very easy to fairytale this up and make it the “hooker with a heart of gold” scenario, every immigrant comes here, assimilates and contributes to society. They don’t. Millions of migrants are undocumented or otherwise not contributing tax income. Hundreds of thousands are being supported by the state with no offset to their cost.

The NHS, the care system are dependent on immigrant labour. Yet these are the people Labour have specifically targeted in the last few days. Rather than, say, the illegal manoeuvres of unscrupulous “employment agencies” trafficking people into a lifetime of indentured servitude.

And that care worker? They have a family. Sometimes an extended family, parents, grandparents, partners. Maybe children. Children who go to school, use NHS services like them, need somewhere affordable to live.

It all works only if each single person is contributing more than their cost, to cover the additional housing and services they use.

Nearly a million (known) people per year net migration can’t continue.

 

[WATFORD zero]

Not every immigrant is useful. It’s very easy to fairytale this up and make it the “hooker with a heart of gold” scenario, every immigrant comes here, assimilates and contributes to society. They don’t. Millions of migrants are undocumented or otherwise not contributing tax income. Hundreds of thousands are being supported by the state with no offset to their cost.

I agree with a lot of what you say, but just sometimes you repeat complete crap from the usual suspects (Farage etc).

Forcing people to cross the channel in small boats and actually turn up in Britain before you can claim Asylum is exactly what British Governments of the last 14 years have done. By closing down applications from abroad and closing down all legal schemes, they've done exactly what Albanian people smuggling gangs have wanted in order to smuggle criminals across the channel in amongst the deperate

But you don't seem to understand this, according to you it's 'millions of undocumented migrants' getting supported by the state ?" which in itself, is a complete Oxymoron. I'm sorry but this is exactly the type of complete bollox that Farage pumps out, you repeat and morons vote for. It completely undermines a lot of the reasonable points you make

 

[jcdenton08]

But, according to you, it's 'millions of undocumented migrants' getting supported by the state ?"

Not according to me? I never said this?

 

[Bodian]

No woosh, but he does a fair bit, like holding a small business forum.

"But speaking to LBC, Mr Farage said he was planning a “massive event” for small businesses in Clacton later in January and was “out meeting constituents I bet far more than any MP has done for many, many years in Clacton”.

"More than 100 local businessmen and women from across the constituency attended from sectors as wide as catering, manufacturing and hospitality last Friday evening.

It was great to see a room so full of passionate, driven and proud Clacton people come together to debate and discuss both national and local issue"s."

https://www.clactonandfrintongazett...gel-farage---i-will-stand-businesses-clacton/

So that's two PR visits. He's racking them up.

 

[Pavilionaire]

If we want to stop Reform then I truly believe we need to understand why people are attracted to them and think about how we can either address their concerns or engage constructively in debate with them. The lanyard article was a constructive attempt to understand rather than condemn.

Understanding the rise of Reform is not rocket science:

1. They have a "Charismatic leader".
2. Tories are at rock bottom and out of ideas. Arguably, they've run their course as a serious, coherent political party. If they are Europhile they go to the Lib Dems, if they are Europhobe they go to Reform. Europe has done for the party like so many predicted.
3. Labour are having to make hard choices about taxes and cuts. No surprise really given the mess they inherited, but a significant minority see the choices they are making as a complete class betrayal.
4. In the confines of their homes or in the corner of the pub a lot of people in Britain ARE still racist. The same goes for the USA, France, Germany.
5. Given the proliferation of famine and conflict the flow of refugees and asylum seekers has been relentless, so there is a ready-made scapegoat for societies ills.
6. The traditional approach to policy like health, NHS, tax defence - in many ways bipartisan - has failed to deliver delivered growth or prosperity since the demise of Blair and the banking crisis. This has been underpinned by a distinct lack of creative thinking, of political will, of understanding of real world problems from Tories and Labour.

Now, Farage pretends he has the answers but he is a dinosaur. His Brexit has proved catastrophic for this country, as would this other policies, which seem to have evolved from 'back of a fag packet' notes taken from many a boozy discussion down the pub.

There is no doubt that Reform are riding high in the polls right now, but I think this will be their high water mark. Just wait until the councils they are now running start to disintegrate as their councillors don't know what they're doing. Only today have we seen a Reform councillor elected to Durham County Council on 1st May 2025 forced to resign because he failed to disclose that he was employed by the council, so should never have been allowed to stand in the first place.

Was he a paper candidate, like Jacqueline Teasdale and Craig Marshall - the mother and brother of genuine candidate Darren Grimes who were named on the ballot but never campaigned or had any social media political visibility yet still ended up winning seats on Durham Council.

Reform are tin pot masquerading as a serious political party. The media are at fault for giving them too much airtime, column inches and credibility, and allowing them to spout their rubbish largely unchallenged. By doing so they give Reform political standing that they have not earned, indeed our media appears to have learned nothing over the way in which Brexit and Farage lies were presented as plausible and credible.

In many ways I admire Farage's ability to persuade and inspire a large chunk of society. How I wish there was someone with his talent on the left of politics with the ability to cut through on issues like wealth inequality, social mobility, lies and corruption.

 

[Giraffe]

Too late, this thread and the Labour thread are full of the same posters saying exactly this. In the Labour thread one poster just referred to them as “Retard”.

A lot of us agree with the overall message. Huge net migration to the UK is unsustainable for the size of the nation, the housing crisis and the infrastructure (specifically the NHS).

View attachment 201748

As I said, the net equivalent of the entire population of Dorset or Northumberland emigrating to the UK is unsustainable year-on-year.

People make the easy mistake of rubbishing people’s (in my view correct) concerns when it comes to enormous net migration. It’s very, very easy to tie together “Mass immigration is unsustainable” with “Racist gammon”. And poo-poo people, call them idiots (“ignorant woman”)…

Then *shocked Pikachu face* they go and vote for the outsider party (Reform, AfD (Germany), RN (France), FDL (Italy), and the Nexit movement (Netherlands).

Labour are reacting now because they’ve seen that people are putting their feelings into votes.

Within a liberal echo chamber (one I experienced at drama school), closing your eyes and wishing something just because the echo chamber - full of people with similar values and life experiences - says so doesn’t equate to real world outcomes. Practically everybody there was convinced Corbyn would win the election, because that’s what they wanted. And they couldn’t possibly see why anyone else - impoverished people not at a middle class drama school for instance - would feel differently.

Oh wait, they did feel differently? Well they must ALL be racists, skinheads and morons.

Nicely put.

 

[Guinness Boy]

So that's two PR visits. He's racking them up.

And the rest of the time he’s, well, he’s not in Clacton. A dreadful local MP who takes his constituents for granted.

 

[clapham_gull]

And that care worker? They have a family. Sometimes an extended family, parents, grandparents, partners. Maybe children. Children who go to school, use NHS services like them, need somewhere affordable to live.

Care workers haven't been able to bring their family over for over a year.

Like it not the last Government forced themselves into this position by needing to get care workers in and fast.

They were forced to bring cheap labour in from countries that far away, that as part of the agreement the family could come to.

So desperate are the homes, I've spoken to carers from India in Sussex getting the train back home to London after a long shift.

If you are a visiting carer, the money is appalling and if you work for a care company in somewhere like rural Sussex, you need to run a car and travel miles.

So the answer is to pay the carers more and attract local candidates ? Well that's paid for your council and the councils are skint.

There is no quick fix, but fix needs to be more of a mix than simply saying we are putting restrictions on foreign carers.

1) Culturally we are not that great at looking after our elderly. We need to change that and encourage / make it easier for families to look after elderly relatives where appropriate with help from carers. Effectively that could mean someone moving in with a family to help.

2) We need to pay the carers much more. The job needs to be full time, I met many who do it part time to make ends meet.

3) It requires much more respect, not be talked down to by employees of the NHS. Many of the overseas carers I've met are actually very high trained.

4) Investment in community nurses to support.

It's all about cash and we need to pay for it. Nationalising the care industry probably wouldn't be a bad idea either by creating a National Care Service.

 

[n1 gull]

And the rest of the time he’s, well, he’s not in Clacton. A dreadful local MP who takes his constituents for granted.

If that’s the case he will be voted out

I bet he wins and increases his majority

 

[Weststander]

Huge increases in the UK population (now 10m since 1997), simply wasn’t met with increased new housing, schools, doctors surgeries and doctors, hospital capacity, roads to match. Very British incompetence over the last 45 years under blue, red and coalition, next to no strategic top down planning. Whilst nimbies prevented or very deliberately ground to an expensive halt any development. There was literally no plan. Just a de facto open the borders, to fill unskilled jobs and trades. Jobs Brits didn’t want to do anymore, no one is quite sure why.

The obvious result … huge rises in house prices, homelessness, rent increases, sofa surfing or multi-gen families packed into a dwelling. Giving rise to huge inequality and unhappiness.

To underline, under governments of all colours.

I’d love Labour to crack this. The obvious need is for the existing UK working age population to get skilled up in meaningful professions and trades, Germany always the shining example. Proper apprenticeships. To reduce the lazy approach by governments and employers of bringing in workers. Tied to that, building decent, affordable homes in huge numbers.