[Albion] The first goal

[Cowfold Seagull]

This.

If you swapped keepers last night then IMO we don't lose that match. In goalkeeping terms he's still an apprentice.

You think then do you, that Emi Martinez, had he been in the Albion goal, would have stopped all three goals from going in? . . . l don't.

I will readily admit though, that the Villa stopper is a better keeper than Verbruggen will probably ever be.

 

[Milano]

You think then do you, that Emi Martinez, had he been in the Albion goal, would have stopped all three goals from going in? . . . l don't.

I will readily admit though, that the Villa stopper is a better keeper than Verbruggen will probably ever be.

Yes I do. Because Goals 2 and 3 don't happen if the 1st doesn't because we wouldn't be chasing the game in the same way. Martinez sweeps that 1st up all day long. Bart's starting position was good, why he didn't commit I just don't know, as soon as he hesitated we were done.

 

[Flounce]

It's a whole combination of errors isn't it. Can't fully blame any one player in my opinion.

Set pieces were pretty shite all evening as well...

As was our final ball, not convinced there was one good final ball all evening from the Albion.

 

[Dave the hatosaurus]

There's absolutely no way that goal is in any way on Bart. None.

He has issues with his keeping for sure, but that goal came from rank bad defending. There's no way it should have come to a one on one with Verbruggen in the first place.

Not in build up, no. However he stuttered in decision making about whether to advance or retreat, very clearly changing his mind and ended up stood in no man's land.

Terrible goal overall and he was last line of defence, sadly he made it easy for the goalscorer by not giving him a decision to make.

100% agree with Soton Seagull on this one. From my vantage point at front of upper west almost in line with the penalty area i saw the through ball hit over the top and quickly clocked that Rashford was in his own half but had a free run being ahead of the last defender. I then turned my head to follow the flight of the ball hoping to see our keeper coming out to meet it as he is by definition the last line of defence. Instead he stuttered forward a little before hesitating and then retreating. There has been speculation about whether he could have collided with the onrushing forward but i believe had he made the decision quickly it would have been no contest. If you look at Bozza's pictures you will see that Bart's starting position was a very short distance from where Rashford took his first touch and remember the ball was coming towards Bart and away from Rashford. In fact it would appear he went backwards for almost the same distance that he needed to go forwards.
In no way am i blaming him entirely for the goal but my first thought after the ball went in was the old saying "he who hesitates is lost".

 

[Uh_huh_him]

100% agree with Soton Seagull on this one. From my vantage point at front of upper west almost in line with the penalty area i saw the through ball hit over the top and quickly clocked that Rashford was in his own half but had a free run being ahead of the last defender. I then turned my head to follow the flight of the ball hoping to see our keeper coming out to meet it as he is by definition the last line of defence. Instead he stuttered forward a little before hesitating and then retreating. There has been speculation about whether he could have collided with the onrushing forward but i believe had he made the decision quickly it would have been no contest. If you look at Bozza's pictures you will see that Bart's starting position was a very short distance from where Rashford took his first touch and remember the ball was coming towards Bart and away from Rashford. In fact it would appear he went backwards for almost the same distance that he needed to go forwards.
In no way am i blaming him entirely for the goal but my first thought after the ball went in was the old saying "he who hesitates is lost".

Pretty sure Jason Steele would have cleared it.

 

[Jeremiah]

I like Bart but I felt he had a part to play in conceding goals 1 & 3 last night. However, Martinez spilled the ball allowing Adingra to "score". A keepers lot is not an easy one.

 

[Brian Munich]

It's easy enough for us to analyse it with the benefit of stills taken from a side-on persepective, but it's a hell of a judgement call for a keeper to come that far out to a bouncing long ball being chased by a striker with genuine pace. Sanchez used to get crucified for that sort of thing.

I thought Gomez had a poor game throughout.

 

[trueblue]

Have a look at @Bozza 's really useful screen grabs above.

Bart's (good) starting position was only a few yards away from where Rashford took his first touch, no "charging out" needed at all! He would have easily got that way before Rashford.

He hesitated and retreated instead.

I’d suggest you watch it, as I have, with the pictures moving. Repeatedly and from the same angle. More informative than a still image. We’ll have to agree to disagree. Looking head on, he won’t be able to judge it while the ball is in the air and, at real speed, if he can really get there first we ought to rename him Usain Bart.

 

[Milano]

It's easy enough for us to analyse it with the benefit of stills taken from a side-on persepective, but it's a hell of a judgement call for a keeper to come that far out to a bouncing long ball being chased by a striker with genuine pace. Sanchez used to get crucified for that sort of thing.

I thought Gomez had a poor game throughout.

My immediate reaction in the ground as the pass was played was "keepers ball", then a split second later "why hasn't he come out FFS" all before Rashford scored.

IMO Gomez is an 8 not a 6, given his physical presence he should have been up for the corner anyway, Ayari should have been the one holding IMO. As a team we defended it really badly, our set piece coach has some explaining to do today, but that doesn't change the fact that had Bart committed straight away to a ball that he would have been 70/30 to win then we would likely have got away with it.

 

[amexer]

I dont know if keeper could have got there but fact is at our corner Gomez was left on half way line for sole reason to get on rightside of any attacker looking for quick breakaway. Failed to do this

 

[Simster]

I dont know if keeper could have got there but fact is at our corner Gomez was left on half way line for sole reason to get on rightside of any attacker looking for quick breakaway. Failed to do this

This. I can accept that perhaps Bart hesitated and thus didn't leave Rashford with a decision to make, but frankly he should never have been left with a one on one from that position.

 

[keaton]

What the pictures can’t show is that Dunk was already flat out sprinting by that point too - busting a gut to get back from attacking the corner. Glad he’s not getting the stick. Inexperience from Gomez, caught ball-watching. He’ll learn and be a superb player I think.

Not really,. Dunk bends his run presumably because he thinks he'll play him onside if he gets goal side of him.


And if it's the sole role of Gomez to look after Rashford with a half a pitch to use his pace then I'm not sure the goal is Gomez's fault

 

[trueblue]

Not really,. Dunk bends his run presumably because he thinks he'll play him onside if he gets goal side of him.


And if it's the sole role of Gomez to look after Rashford with a half a pitch to use his pace then I'm not sure the goal is Gomez's fault

No idea where you get the Dunk part from. He was pegging it straight back from inside the penalty area and absolutely busting a nut. He couldn’t possibly have played Rashford onside because a) he was miles behind him to start with and b) Rashford was in his own half. Unless he’s another Olympic standard sprinter like Bart!

 

[albionalex]

You can tell Bart is low on confidence at the moment.

 

[Brian Munich]

My immediate reaction in the ground as the pass was played was "keepers ball", then a split second later "why hasn't he come out FFS" all before Rashford scored.

IMO Gomez is an 8 not a 6, given his physical presence he should have been up for the corner anyway, Ayari should have been the one holding IMO. As a team we defended it really badly, our set piece coach has some explaining to do today, but that doesn't change the fact that had Bart committed straight away to a ball that he would have been 70/30 to win then we would likely have got away with it.

Where abouts do you sit? From the north end of WSL it wasn't an obvious call (to me anyway). I imagine it#d be easier to make a split-second from a side on view, particular from an upper tier.

 

[Dave the hatosaurus]

It's easy enough for us to analyse it with the benefit of stills taken from a side-on persepective, but it's a hell of a judgement call for a keeper to come that far out to a bouncing long ball being chased by a striker with genuine pace. Sanchez used to get crucified for that sort of thing.

I thought Gomez had a poor game throughout.

Just to say it was not "that far out" if you look at the pictures. My instinct at the time, and i have seen nothing to counteract this opinion, is that if he had started advancing quickly he would have cleared it with some distance to spare however he stuttered forward before changing his mind and retreating, it was the hesitation that did for him. He actually ended up going backwards for the same distance as he needed to go forward.
Again i will state clearly that i am in no way blaming him entirely for the goal but as the last line of defence he could have bailed his teammates out.

 

[Brian Munich]

You can tell Bart is low on confidence at the moment.

Really? He's only conceded 6 goals in the previous 780 minutes of football, so he bloody shouldn't be!

 

[albionalex]

Really? He's only conceded 6 goals in the previous 780 minutes of football, so he bloody shouldn't be!

He also lost a shootout where he didn't save a single pen...

 

[keaton]

No idea where you get the Dunk part from. He was pegging it straight back from inside the penalty area. He couldn’t possibly have played Rashford onside because a) he was miles behind him to start with and b) Rashford was in his own half. Unless he’s another Olympic standard sprinter like Bart!

I know he couldn't have played him onside.

He doesn't run straight, he starts to then gets close and veers to the left towards Gomez.

 

[Han Solo]

I’ve just watched the same angle as Bozza. Have to disagree this time. I think we’d be talking today about Bart’s silly charge out of the area and how stupid he was to get himself sent off. It’s a fantastic pass perfectly-weighted into the path of a quick striker running at full tilt. Rashford keeps the ball close and puts it away with his second touch. Can’t see anything other than a costly collision if Bart had tried to get there first. At best, they’d have reached the ball about the same time. Bear in mind it’s travelling diagonally, not straight towards goal. It’s not really winnable until the second bounce by which time it’s right under Rashford’s feet. It would need to be an incredible tackle to take it cleanly at that point.

I've said repeatedly in the Verbruggen thread and other threads that I don't think he is the right keeper for us. He is a very passive goalkeeper - great in distribution and shot stopping, but very uncomfortable leaving the box and acting as a sweeper keeper. If we play with a high line we can't give the opponents all of our half of the pitch to work with. Bart should be closer to the mid circle than his penalty box.

I prefer a goalkeeper who goes out on sweeping journeys that makes him look like a complete fool 1/10 times rather than being a spectator glued to the line 10/10 times. A Robert Sanchez but with quicker feet and natural confidence.

Strange one.

When Carlos Baleba is on the pitch, and he usually is, he's the cover when we have set pieces and throw the defenders up.

With Baleba not playing, that role fell to Diego Gomez, who I noticed was on the receiving end of some short shrift from JPvH in the immediate aftermath of the goal.

First of all his positioning was all wrong - he just didn't have the run of Rashford covered, which left Lewis Dunk in a foot race he was never going to win.

He also appealed for offside, both as Rashford made his run and immediately after he scored, with Verbruggen joining in too, despite the Villa man being well inside his own half when the ball was played.

Terrible goal to concede.

Diego Gomez got a fair bit of MLS stuff going on and has throughout his honeymoon done a fair bit of overlooked mistakes. High risk high reward in his passing game and not yet learned how hard PL punishes mistakes and sloppyness. No doubt will he become really good though, he has a very high ceiling and works hard.