[Albion] Bart Verbruggen SINGS a 5-year deal

[Flounce]

I can’t find it in me to even think about blaming Bart for us going out of the Cup. It would never have got to penalties if we’d shown composure and actually played some decent final balls into the box.

Baleba’s second thunderbolt was 100% going in if he’d just hit it inches to the left though. Can I blame him?

 

[Brian Munich]

The belief that losing penalty shootouts is a bigger problem than not winning the games in 120 minutes, one of the reasons England doesn't win anything.

If people throughout the 90s had asked "why are we not winning games?" instead of "why does this individual not save or score a penalty?" would have beneficial.

But why look at the whole thing when you can always find a scapegoat?

In a sport where the win condition is to score goals, our 16 outfield players yesterday scored a total of 0 goals over 120 minutes. The reaction? "The goalie should be saving penalties!"

I'm far from a big Verbruggen fan but its just silly.

That’s a load of bollocks. More often than not the winners of a major international tournament will have to have negotiated at least one penalty shoutout at some point along the way.

Not being able to consistently win on pens is a real issue that any team serious about winning stuff needs to address.

 

[Han Solo]

Whilst I agree, in part, and I'm absolutely not looking to scapegoat Verbruggen who I think is a fine keeper who has the potential to become one of the best in the world, getting able to get through penalty shootouts is an essential part of cup competitions.

Nottingham Forest have now got through three in a row, and are looking forward to a Wembley semi as a result.

Would be interesting to see the percentage of FA Cup (and perhaps other big cups) winning teams that has to win one or more penalty shootouts to win. I don't think its very common.

 

[One Teddy Maybank]

Whilst I agree, in part, and I'm absolutely not looking to scapegoat Verbruggen who I think is a fine keeper who has the potential to become one of the best in the world, being able to get through penalty shootouts is an essential part of cup competitions.

Nottingham Forest have now got through three in a row, and are looking forward to a Wembley semi as a result.

This, absolutely not down to Bart.

 

[One Teddy Maybank]

I can’t find it in me to even think about blaming Bart for us going out of the Cup. It would never have got to penalties if we’d shown composure and actually played some decent final balls into the box.

Baleba’s second thunderbolt was 100% going in if he’d just hit it inches to the left though. Can I blame him?

Yes. A professional footballer should be able to hit the target from 20 yards….

 

[Jovis]

Agree, it is simply pointless committing yourself one way or another, on every penalty. Their goalie stood up and followed the ball waiting for a poor one, he got two that were close enough for him to save.

And all the research bears this out. Around 30% of all penalties go down the middle, and you’d think this probably increases in shoot outs where takers are less confident, so less likely to go for the corners. Standing up gives you a good chance of saving 2 from 5, as happened last night.

 

[tigertim68]

Everyone around me last night agreed with me if it went to penalties we would lose ,
firstly we were short of decent penalty takers and their keeper was better at saving penalties than ours
and that’s what happened

 

[PascalGroß Tips]

No you don’t get an extra sub, but as Bozza says, you get an extra substitution window

Ah yes, that’s it

 

[PascalGroß Tips]

We'd used the three sub slots, hadn't we, which is why we had to have Webster limping his way through the closing minutes as we couldn't make the sub until extra-time, which we did.

Yep I got my subs and sub slots mixed up

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

That’s a load of bollocks. More often than not the winners of a major international tournament will have to have negotiated at least one penalty shoutout at some point along the way.

Not being able to consistently win on pens is a real issue that any team serious about winning stuff needs to address.

Yeah, sides like Liverpool have nailed it.

Oh, hang on...Liverpool 0-1 PSG (1-4 after pens).

@Han Solo is right. If you focus on winning penalties you'll think you have 'practiced' for a shoot out, and you'll end up having to face penalties,
and the more often that happens the more likely it is you suddenly get knocked out.

And of course we would have practiced penalties.

But as others have said how often have we been in a penalty shoot out?
Five times in the club's entire history?

We lost a penalty shoot out.
That's the beginning and the end of it.
If we have as many as one shoot out to face next season I'll be surprised.

 

[Weststander]

Get rid for £50m. Bring in Ramsdale.

Better than that, Kelleher.

 

[GT49er]

Get rid for £50m. Bring in Ramsdale.

Ramsdale? Huh! If only we could afford that feller Rushworth........

 

[Jeremiah]

Would be interesting to see the percentage of FA Cup (and perhaps other big cups) winning teams that has to win one or more penalty shootouts to win. I don't think its very common.

It would be interesting to see the percentage of penalty shoot outs that are won by the home side. The guy next to me was celebrating like we had won the tie when it was announced the penalties would be down the North Stand. Perhaps the extra pressure of taking them in front of the home end is not so good ? I am ashamed to say I was resigned to us losing the shoot out even when we were 2-1 up as Sels is excellent at saving them and Bart is not - something for him to work on ?

 

[Brian Munich]

Yeah, sides like Liverpool have nailed it.

Oh, hang on...Liverpool 0-1 PSG (1-4 after pens).

@Han Solo is right. If you focus on winning penalties you'll think you have 'practiced' for a shoot out, and you'll end up having to face penalties,
and the more often that happens the more likely it is you suddenly get knocked out.

And of course we would have practiced penalties.

But as others have said how often have we been in a penalty shoot out?
Five times in the club's entire history?

We lost a penalty shoot out.
That's the beginning and the end of it.
If we have as many as one shoot out to face next season I'll be surprised.

I'm not quite sure of your point here and whether your agreeing with me or not. Liverpool getting eliminated from a KO competion that they were amongst the favourites for on penalties sort of proves my point. Also, their FA Cup win 3 years ago was on penalties as was their CL win 20 years ago.

We've had way more than 5 shoot outs. I can remember 6 off the top of my end (including last night) since we got to the Premier League alone. And there were some memorable ones before that as well - Swindon in the play offs, Man City etc.

 

[Joey Jo Jo Jr. Shabadoo]

Would be interesting to see the percentage of FA Cup (and perhaps other big cups) winning teams that has to win one or more penalty shootouts to win. I don't think its very common.

Since the FA Cup introduced penalty shoot outs in the 91-92 season, 8 winners have been involved in them on their way to winning the cup. That is just under 25% of seasons.

Arsenal and Liverpool are tied with 3 Cup wins each, Man United and Chelsea are the other two teams to win penalty shoot outs on the way to FA Cup glory. Arsenal have twice won two penalty shootouts on the way to winning the cup.

91-92 Liverpool won semi final against Portsmouth
97-98 Arsenal won 3rd round tie against Port Vale and quarter final against West Ham
04-05 Arsenal won 5th round against Sheff United and final against Man United (first final ever decided by pens)
05-06 Liverpool won final vs West Ham
13-14 Arsenal won semi final against Wigan
17-18 Chelsea beat Norwich in third round
21-22 Liverpool won final beating Chelsea
23-24 Man United won semi final against Coventry

We've had way more than 5 shoot outs. I can remember 6 off the top of my end (including last night) since we got to the Premier League alone. And there were some memorable ones before that as well - Swindon in the play offs, Man City etc.

We've been involved in 14 penalty shoot outs, won 8, lost 6. (The link below dosen't include the play offs against Swindon)

Brighton & Hove Albion - Penalty shoot-out

This statistic shows all penalty shootouts of Brighton.

www.transfermarkt.co.uk

 

[Justice]

It would be interesting to see the percentage of penalty shoot outs that are won by the home side. The guy next to me was celebrating like we had won the tie when it was announced the penalties would be down the North Stand. Perhaps the extra pressure of taking them in front of the home end is not so good ? I am ashamed to say I was resigned to us losing the shoot out even when we were 2-1 up as Sels is excellent at saving them and Bart is not - something for him to work on ?

I could of saved Hinshelwoods he scuffed it unfortunately.

 

[Brian Munich]

Since the FA Cup introduced penalty shoot outs in the 91-92 season, 8 winners have been involved in them on their way to winning the cup. That is just under 25% of seasons.

Arsenal and Liverpool are tied with 3 Cup wins each, Man United and Chelsea are the other two teams to win penalty shoot outs on the way to FA Cup glory. Arsenal have twice won two penalty shootouts on the way to winning the cup.

91-92 Liverpool won semi final against Portsmouth
97-98 Arsenal won 3rd round tie against Port Vale and quarter final against West Ham
04-05 Arsenal won 5th round against Sheff United and final against Man United (first final ever decided by pens)
05-06 Liverpool won final vs West Ham
13-14 Arsenal won semi final against Wigan
17-18 Chelsea beat Norwich in third round
21-22 Liverpool won final beating Chelsea
23-24 Man United won semi final against Coventry




We've been involved in 14 penalty shoot outs, won 8, lost 6. (The link below dosen't include the play offs against Swindon)

Brighton & Hove Albion - Penalty shoot-out

This statistic shows all penalty shootouts of Brighton.

www.transfermarkt.co.uk

25% is a lower percentage than I'd have thought, but then again those stats go back to when replays were still being played and it only went to pens after a replay and ET. Replays were removed after round 5 in the 18/19 season (and totally this year), so I'm going to guess that this will increase as the sample size increases.

Be interesting to see the proportion of WC or Euro winners that have needed a shootout since they were introduced in 1982.

 

[tigertim68]

Since the FA Cup introduced penalty shoot outs in the 91-92 season, 8 winners have been involved in them on their way to winning the cup. That is just under 25% of seasons.

Arsenal and Liverpool are tied with 3 Cup wins each, Man United and Chelsea are the other two teams to win penalty shoot outs on the way to FA Cup glory. Arsenal have twice won two penalty shootouts on the way to winning the cup.

91-92 Liverpool won semi final against Portsmouth
97-98 Arsenal won 3rd round tie against Port Vale and quarter final against West Ham
04-05 Arsenal won 5th round against Sheff United and final against Man United (first final ever decided by pens)
05-06 Liverpool won final vs West Ham
13-14 Arsenal won semi final against Wigan
17-18 Chelsea beat Norwich in third round
21-22 Liverpool won final beating Chelsea
23-24 Man United won semi final against Coventry




We've been involved in 14 penalty shoot outs, won 8, lost 6. (The link below dosen't include the play offs against Swindon)

Brighton & Hove Albion - Penalty shoot-out

This statistic shows all penalty shootouts of Brighton.

www.transfermarkt.co.uk

Apart from City all the teams we beat in penalty shootouts were below us in the league , so mainly against teams who are on par or better than us we tend to lose the shootout

 

[Ali_rrr]

That’s a load of bollocks. More often than not the winners of a major international tournament will have to have negotiated at least one penalty shoutout at some point along the way.

Not being able to consistently win on pens is a real issue that any team serious about winning stuff needs to address.

One of the big reasons why Argentina won the world cup was because of Martinez being so good at saving penalties, hence why Argentina were so confident. Both Sanchez and Bart are absolutely useless at saving penalties and anyone that has played football to a decent standard knows being able to trust your keeper is a huge psychological advantage.

Knowing that you have to score because if the opponent gets it on target, it'll go in puts an immense extra weight on your shoulders. It's exactly the same with defenders if you know your keeper has your back and will come and claim crosses or will come out if the ball goes over your head.


Penalties are becoming a big part of the game and a modern keeper being so poor at them with all the data available is really poor.

 

[Joey Jo Jo Jr. Shabadoo]

25% is a lower percentage than I'd have thought, but then again those stats go back to when replays were still being played and it only went to pens after a replay and ET. Replays were removed after round 5 in the 18/19 season (and totally this year), so I'm going to guess that this will increase as the sample size increases.

Be interesting to see the proportion of WC or Euro winners that have needed a shootout since they were introduced in 1982.

Way higher percentages in the Euros and World Cup since they introduced penalties

World Cup 5 of 11 tournaments have been won by teams involved in a penalty shootout at some stage. That is 43%

Germany 1990 vs England Semi Final
Brazil 1994 vs Italy in Final
France 1998 vs Italy in QF
Italy 2006 vs France in Final
Argentina 2022 vs Netherlands in QF and France in Final



For the Euros 7 winners have won shoot-outs on their way to winning the tournament. That is 53% (as an aside in 1968 Italy beat USSR in semi finalby coin toss)

1976 Czechoslovakia beat Germany in Final
1992 Denmark beat Netherlands in semi final
1996 Germany beat England in semi final
2008 Spain beat Italy in QF
2012 Spain beat Portugal in SF
2016 Portugal beat Poland in QF
2020 Italy beat Spain in SF and England in Final