[Albion] The Fan Advisory Board Thread

[jackalbion]

What's changed since last season when a full compliment of buses got fans to the Spurs game with no trains?

Or even the (i think, one possibly two) games this season when both EDF park and ride and Pyecombe were open?

Well they did get people TO the game, coming back it took hours. I’d have to find out the games they ran the EDF park and ride, I expect there’s no engineering works locally on those days. The EDF park and ride is a good start, but I think there must be a logistical issue to do with driver/vehicle availability about why it can’t run every game. The bendy buses are probably the big one for the mill road P&R because you can’t stuff a load of double deckers up there because of the bridge.

EDIT: The Tottenham game there was a train strike so no need for engineering works anywhere, so that’s where the available buses came from.

 

[Terry Butcher Tribute Act]

Well they did get people TO the game, coming back it took hours. I’d have to find out the games they ran the EDF park and ride, I expect there’s no engineering works locally on those days. The EDF park and ride is a good start, but I think there must be a logistical issue to do with driver/vehicle availability about why it can’t run every game. The bendy buses are probably the big one for the mill road P&R because you can’t stuff a load of double deckers up there because of the bridge.

EDIT: The Tottenham game there was a train strike so no need for engineering works anywhere, so that’s where the available buses came from.

So actually the issue is that there's not enough buses if there's local engineering work on the railways?

So they should be ok to source buses on for Brentford (albeit not from EDF if workers are using it) ?

 

[dazzer6666]

Bus lanes and the police doing something about the slip road to prioritise the buses would help - let them up the left hand lane to turn right at the roundaout would be great. There's always a couple of motorcycle police sitting on their arses letting people cut in dangerously, they could do something useful instead. (Caveated by they are working really hard, we don't know the constraints they work under, teams of people doing the right thing etc etc etc)

Doesn’t work for the racecourse buses……queue on the Drove post-match is usually awful. Personally would make those who park in the farm shop (on observation I believe you have to be in the top 3% of impatient people globally to be able to park there) wait a bit longer to leave.

 

[jackalbion]

So actually the issue is that there's not enough buses if there's local engineering work on the railways?

So they should be ok to source buses on for Brentford (albeit not from EDF if workers are using it) ?

I was told they are putting plans in place, whatever that means . I’d imagine so yes.

 

[Beach Hut]

Club must know how many walk on's there are at top of Mill Road. Could they put on a couple of double deckers that go via the bypass straight to top of Mill Road and then used to support Race Course P&R. Would take a bit of pressure off Mill Road single deckers.

Which bit of the lack of bus drivers don't you get?

Post Covid loads have found better paid jobs

 

[tronnogull]

Club must know how many walk on's there are at top of Mill Road. Could they put on a couple of double deckers that go via the bypass straight to top of Mill Road and then used to support Race Course P&R. Would take a bit of pressure off Mill Road single deckers.

That is a good idea. Could also do the same thing at the Amex end.......have the P&R bus drop off at the 25 bus stop at the University and avoid all the delay getting into and out of the Amex.

 

[Horses Arse]

Doesn’t work for the racecourse buses……queue on the Drove post-match is usually awful. Personally would make those who park in the farm shop (on observation I believe you have to be in the top 3% of impatient people globally to be able to park there) wait a bit longer to leave.

I'd ban the farm shop from renting that space out for parking. Dangerous for the mass of pedestrians walking that way. Plus, they were very anti stadium so I'm sure they don't really want to benefit financially from it really....

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Which bit of the lack of bus drivers don't you get?

Post Covid loads have found better paid jobs

Quite. Same with hospitality staff. Plus Brexit has put the brakes on supply of resource.

 

[Terry Butcher Tribute Act]

Again - people saying there aren't the bus drivers,

We've proved in the last 14 months that the club have been able to pull in the buses and drivers when they've needed to. It's not as simple as "oh it must be the Government to blame"

 

[Beach Hut]

Quite. Same with hospitality staff. Plus Brexit has put the brakes on supply of resource.

Indeed, let's convert this thread to another Brexit moan

 

[jackalbion]

Again - people saying there aren't the bus drivers,

We've proved in the last 14 months that the club have been able to pull in the buses and drivers when they've needed to. It's not as simple as "oh it must be the Government to blame"

Have we? On the rare occasion we have had to run buses instead of trains there haven't been nearly enough to take us home, and the EDF park and ride only seems to run on certain occasions. If anything that shows that there aren't enough buses. A lot has changed in that industry since the spurs game. I don't know how much you use buses locally, but the timetables are never fulfilled now, the 49, 7 all those routes are no longer ever every 6 minutes, Barnham to Havant engineering work a few months ago meant there were no buses available so no replacement services ran. There's also the aspect that the club has a budget to spend, they can't just throw money at the operation and it simply wouldn't be profitable/we'd have a season ticket rise. Which the same people complaining about the buses, would complain about. The difference I agree with is the government can't be totally responsible, as the bus industry is private and has been a long time. I suggested that government intervention may be needed in the industry to boost numbers, but if the market prevails then we'll get stuck with under required supply.

 

[Terry Butcher Tribute Act]

Have we? On the rare occasion we have had to run buses instead of trains there haven't been nearly enough to take us home, and the EDF park and ride only seems to run on certain occasions. If anything that shows that there aren't enough buses. A lot has changed in that industry since the spurs game. I don't know how much you use buses locally, but the timetables are never fulfilled now, the 49, 7 all those routes are no longer ever every 6 minutes, Barnham to Havant engineering work a few months ago meant there were no buses available so no replacement services ran. There's also the aspect that the club has a budget to spend, they can't just throw money at the operation and it simply wouldn't be profitable/we'd have a season ticket rise. Which the same people complaining about the buses, would complain about.

So thousands and thousands of people were stranded after Spurs were they? And in 13 months the entire bus driver population has left the country because of Brexit? Let's not twist the truth here to make a point. Of course it took much longer to clear the ground because it's an inefficient mode of transport and the roads get clogged up when there's no trains, but this "there aren't enough buses" argument seems based on very little evidence beyond a desire to moan about Tories and Brexit .

Remember, the crux of the original point is some additional buses needed to support the park and ride on a normal matchday. Not a full service to replace trains. On some occasions, even this season, even those where a train strike has been called at short notice, there have miraculously been some additional buses. What the cost of that was none of us know, but to just lazily say there aren't enough drivers so we can't possibly do any more seems short sighted. Of course on some instances there haven’t been as many buses and I'm sure there are logistical reasons for that too, but the fact that there have proven to be additional buses on certain occasions even this season is a point worth exploring, no?

BTW EDF park and ride is not available in the week due to workers.
Pyecombe is not available every weekend due to equestrian events.

Buses have been put on from the Steine previously, could that be another option to consider?

The landowner at Pyecombe the other week was telling everyone he was trying to negotiate with the club to use their site more often. What are the 'certain occasions' that the club use it and could there be more of them? Nobody really knows except the club.

It's all reasonable debate. And - sorry, but how do you know the club can't spend budget on improving a wiltering travel operation? There is a travel survey that allegedly the FAB are supporting with. Perhaps it's an option that season ticket prices might be hiked to support the travel scheme with things like more buses and until then we have to put up with it, but it would be good to know for sure, wouldn't it? And I'm sure that would be properly debated (can you imagine !!!) rather than just brushed under the carpet with a lazy assumption that all the bus drivers have quit.

 

[Official Old Man]

Bus lanes and the police doing something about the slip road to prioritise the buses would help - let them up the left hand lane to turn right at the roundaout would be great. There's always a couple of motorcycle police sitting on their arses letting people cut in dangerously, they could do something useful instead. (Caveated by they are working really hard, we don't know the constraints they work under, teams of people doing the right thing etc etc etc)

This, this, this and this again.
All those years ago I used Lewes Road P&R and I could see the buses getting stuck on that up ramp off the A27. It was wasting so much time. Put in a bus lane on the left with a steward or police at the top giving any bus or coach priority up the ramp. This could cut 15 to 20 minutes off the journey time.
The club have got the turnaround within the ground area down to an art so it's just that ramp that needs sorting.

 

[Uter]

but this "there aren't enough buses" argument seems based on very little evidence beyond a desire to moan about Tories and Brexit .

Au contraire. There is plenty of evidence for a driver shortage, both nationally and locally. This is a real issue, not an imagined one, and it undoubtedly impacts the services that can be provided on matchdays.

 

[jackalbion]

So thousands and thousands of people were stranded after Spurs were they? And in 13 months the entire bus driver population has left the country because of Brexit? Let's not twist the truth here to make a point. Of course it took much longer to clear the ground because it's an inefficient mode of transport and the roads get clogged up when there's no trains, but this "there aren't enough buses" argument seems based on very little evidence beyond a desire to moan about Tories and Brexit .

Remember, the crux of the original point is some additional buses needed to support the park and ride on a normal matchday. Not a full service to replace trains. On some occasions, even this season, even those where a train strike has been called at short notice, there have miraculously been some additional buses. What the cost of that was none of us know, but to just lazily say there aren't enough drivers so we can't possibly do any more seems short sighted. Of course on some instances there haven’t been as many buses and I'm sure there are logistical reasons for that too, but the fact that there have proven to be additional buses on certain occasions even this season is a point worth exploring, no?

BTW EDF park and ride is not available in the week due to workers.
Pyecombe is not available every weekend due to equestrian events.

Buses have been put on from the Steine previously, could that be another option to consider?

The landowner at Pyecombe the other week was telling everyone he was trying to negotiate with the club to use their site more often. What are the 'certain occasions' that the club use it and could there be more of them? Nobody really knows except the club.

It's all reasonable debate. And - sorry, but how do you know the club can't spend budget on improving a wiltering travel operation? There is a travel survey that allegedly the FAB are supporting with. Perhaps it's an option that season ticket prices might be hiked to support the travel scheme with things like more buses and until then we have to put up with it, but it would be good to know for sure, wouldn't it? And I'm sure that would be properly debated (can you imagine !!!) rather than just brushed under the carpet with a lazy assumption that all the bus drivers have quit.

I think it is worth exploring, I'm not lazily saying there aren't enough drivers, that is what I know is the case from experience of procuring buses. Is it an answer you don't want to hear? Just to clarify I did a transport degree and a lot of people who are my friends from the course are now working in the bus industry and are bus managers, this is what they tell me, there aren't enough drivers, they've even tried to get me to get licensed so I can be a contingency driver. The mill road issue is probably linked to the bendy buses going, I imagine that the extra buses will cost a premium, that is presumption but thats how the industry works, the final part about season ticket prices is not me being accurate, but possibly a reason they don't want to pay over the odds. The price of seagulls travel has gone up for this reason, they state as much.

Yeah lots of people were stranded after the spurs game, loads had to walk, I had to walk.

 

[Terry Butcher Tribute Act]

Au contraire. There is plenty of evidence for a driver shortage, both nationally and locally. This is a real issue, not an imagined one, and it undoubtedly impacts the services that can be provided on matchdays.
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Yes sorry i dismally failed to make that clear, I am not saying there aren't challenges in the industry, there are clearly. but not to the extent that it stopped, for example, EDF and Pyecombe being opened for the Bournemouth (i think) game this season.

 

[jackalbion]

Yes sorry i dismally failed to make that clear, I am not saying there aren't challenges in the industry, there are clearly. but not to the extent that it stopped, for example, EDF and Pyecombe being opened for the Bournemouth (i think) game this season.

You'd have to ask the club on that one, but I presume its because drivers weren't available. You'd have to see the local engineering works that day as that's what the club compete with.

 

[Paulie Gualtieri]

This, this, this and this again.
All those years ago I used Lewes Road P&R and I could see the buses getting stuck on that up ramp off the A27. It was wasting so much time. Put in a bus lane on the left with a steward or police at the top giving any bus or coach priority up the ramp. This could cut 15 to 20 minutes off the journey time.
The club have got the turnaround within the ground area down to an art so it's just that ramp that needs sorting.

We had a regular coach driver that used the left hand lane every week (for safety reasons ) and took off a good ten minutes.

Haven’t seen him this season

 

[Terry Butcher Tribute Act]

You'd have to ask the club on that one, but I presume its because drivers weren't available. You'd have to see the local engineering works that day as that's what the club compete with.

Yeah, or we could ask the, er, FAB to make some enquiries

 

[Barry Izbak]

Monday December 4 meeting notes

1. A discussion was held on the feedback from the Athens game. It was felt there was a lack of BHAFC officials after the teargas incident. This is following similar feedback from the Marseille game when fans were held back with no communication.
2. Agenda items for the second FAB meeting were discussed and are to be sent to the club
3. Rainbow laces event at Crawley the FAB offered their services to support this and await feedback
4. FAB recruitment, comments were made on Nigels draft. Inclusion of the FSA was considered as a good idea
5. Inbox monitor for the week – Clive
6. The fan zone FAB involvement. Still awaiting planning feedback before we can understand our role
7. Webinar / FAB – FAN engagement. It was agreed that this should proceed. Gerry will lead on this
8. DSA update – The FAB team are meeting this Friday with the Club
9. Flag crowd funding – Appreciate that Dec and Jan not a great time for fund raising. Get peoples thought and get some better designs from Dogma NSK etc.