[Finance] Paying energy bills by direct debit - scam?

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

The point is as long as you provide closing meter readings when you swap suppliers you won'y be "ripped off" you will pay for what you use and if you have a surplus it will be refunded and if the opposite you will need to pay more to close the contract at £0.00 balance.

How hard is it to understand?

I think your interpretation of "ripped off" is wrong tbh.

View attachment 154689

Let's agree to disagree. You were getting ripped off, now you got a refund you weren't.

Sorry to have locked horns. I started out with a considerable amount of sand in my vagina, today, over this. In a pub we would have untangled this mysterious web in 30 seconds. All the best

 

[dazzer6666]

The I shall pay what I owe

That’s exactly it……you can choose the annual smoothing option (which helps people budget), or pay when it’s due. You chose one way, now you’re choosing the other

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

That’s exactly it……you can choose the annual smoothing option (which helps people budget), or pay when it’s due. You chose one way, now you’re choosing the other

Climbing off my high horse....yes, the annual smoothing mechanism may work well for some. Not me, apparently.

 

[dazzer6666]

Climbing off my high horse....yes, the annual smoothing mechanism may work well for some. Not me, apparently.

Shame it took you 15 years to realise

 

[zefarelly]

We're with OVo . . . Whether you think it's a scam or not, by signing up to DD it was a good way for salaried people to spread bills evenly over the year,

Whats happened in recent years, is pressure on these crooks, sorry, 'businesses' to deliver for their shareholders and low interest rates . . . So lets help ourselves, legally, to a bit more . . . Give us a bit more to 'play' with

we cancelled our DD in July, accused them, quite correctly, of being thieving bastards . . . . . We're still over £3000 in credit.

they'd been creeping our DD help themselves payments up month by month . . . . lining their own pockets.

privatising the utilities was one of the worst things this country ever did, and there's a massive list of very strong contenders for that title.

I'm looking forward to our personal tax hikes to cover the cost of rebuilding our infrastructure when they all jump ship due to a negative profit.

 

[Green Cross Code Man]

I looked at my energy use at the weekend. I am with Octopus. I was using economy 7 withe the sual day/night rate difference. I looked at my dad's single tariff for electricity and realised I could save about £15 a month if I switched. I emailed asking for a quote and I was right except it was about an £18 a month saving. So imagine my surprise and shock when this evening I looked and saw that they had upped my direct debit from £160 a month (before the govt payout of £67) to £263 a month. I wanted to save money, not increase my DD. I am using way less energy than previous years and have about £400 in reserves in my account. It was simple to change the DD to a more realistic level, but at the same time I think their prediction algorithm is useless. For instance, for the month of November they predicted I would use £240 energy whilst actual use was £135. It was a similar saving the month before. The program does not seem able to adapt to changes in habit. These are changes that I know many others have also followed. What a mess.

 

[Bozza]

That’s exactly it……you can choose the annual smoothing option (which helps people budget), or pay when it’s due. You chose one way, now you’re choosing the other

Exactly.

I manage my mum's energy account - which is with Ovo. In their online account they are suggesting she drops her DD by about 40% currently, but we're keeping it at the current level to see how this winter plays out.

They allow you to model different DD amounts, and show you how your balance will change based on your patterns of usage...

...and as you'd expect the current credit balance is eroded through the winter and then starts to build again to allow a reserve to be accumulated over summer to get through the next winter.

It's exactly how I want my own account to operate.

 

[dazzer6666]

We're with OVo . . . Whether you think it's a scam or not, by signing up to DD it was a good way for salaried people to spread bills evenly over the year,

Whats happened in recent years, is pressure on these crooks, sorry, 'businesses' to deliver for their shareholders and low interest rates . . . So lets help ourselves, legally, to a bit more . . . Give us a bit more to 'play' with

we cancelled our DD in July, accused them, quite correctly, of being thieving bastards . . . . . We're still over £3000 in credit.

they'd been creeping our DD help themselves payments up month by month . . . . lining their own pockets.

privatising the utilities was one of the worst things this country ever did, and there's a massive list of very strong contenders for that title.

I'm looking forward to our personal tax hikes to cover the cost of rebuilding our infrastructure when they all jump ship due to a negative profit.

How on earth did you let the credit get that high ? Must have ignored your statement for about 2 years ?

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

Shame it took you 15 years to realise

You have mixed up my two gripes, there, old fellah. The energy bill, and the car insurance. The latter was sorted 15 years ago. The former issue only began in the last 12 months.

 

[Bozza]

I looked at my energy use at the weekend. I am with Octopus. I was using economy 7 withe the sual day/night rate difference. I looked at my dad's single tariff for electricity and realised I could save about £15 a month if I switched. I emailed asking for a quote and I was right except it was about an £18 a month saving. So imagine my surprise and shock when this evening I looked and saw that they had upped my direct debit from £160 a month (before the govt payout of £67) to £263 a month. I wanted to save money, not increase my DD. I am using way less energy than previous years and have about £400 in reserves in my account. It was simple to change the DD to a more realistic level, but at the same time I think their prediction algorithm is useless. For instance, for the month of November they predicted I would use £240 energy whilst actual use was £135. It was a similar saving the month before. The program does not seem able to adapt to changes in habit. These are changes that I know many others have also followed. What a mess.

I'm prepared to cut the energy companies some extra slack right now, given how much change there is with prices and how many of us are reacting to those prices by trying to reduce consumption. Throw in a very mild November and this current cold snap and predictions based on prior usage - a perfectly reasonable approach in normal circumstances - can throw things out.

I'd still rather have a decent surplus with them to allow us some slack over the winter than the other way round.

 

[LamieRobertson]

How on earth did you let the credit get that high ? Must have ignored your statement for about 2 years ?

They do pay 5% interest on credit balances which until the last few months of base rate rises, was a million times (ok I exaggerate a tad) better than your bank savings account ..on the flip side it gives them nice cash flow!

 

[zefarelly]

Sorry to have locked horns. I started out with a considerable amount of sand in my vagina, today, over this. In a pub we would have untangled this mysterious web in 30 seconds. All the best

Don't apologise. First post that got my piss steaming was his . . .it read like he was a staunch shareholding employee ;-)

 

[Green Cross Code Man]

I'm prepared to cut the energy companies some extra slack right now, given how much change there is with prices and how many of us are reacting to those prices by trying to reduce consumption. Throw in a very mild November and this current cold snap and predictions based on prior usage - a perfectly reasonable approach in normal circumstances - can throw things out.

I'd still rather have a decent surplus with them to allow us some slack over the winter than the other way round.

I largely agree with that. However, on their prediction I am now saving almost 20 quid a month. Therefore as I've been severely curtailing my energy use, which preceded November, I wouldn't expect the DD to increase a hundred pounds.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

Don't apologise. First post that got my piss steaming was his . . .it read like he was a staunch shareholding employee ;-)

He's a lovely fellah, really

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

They do pay 5% interest on credit balances which until the last few months of base rate rises, was a million times (ok I exaggerate a tad) better than your bank savings account ..on the flip side it gives them nice cash flow!

Really? That's the best value around at the moment. I'm tempted to pay them the whole of my pension lump sum. That'll show them!

Every day is a school day on NSC

 

[zefarelly]

How on earth did you let the credit get that high ? Must have ignored your statement for about 2 years ?

We have a joint account and both pay in . . . I Rarely look at it TBH, its designed to have some excess each month, just in case, been happily ticking for nearly 20 years . . . it was only when I got a text to say we were OD . . . . Its a nice problem to have some credit for a change!

If you double and double again DD's twice inside 6 months the credit soon builds up. They actually emailed Mrs Zef eventually, their suggestion was to up It to over a grand a month!!!

This is when I launched into my favourite Angle Saxon phrases, cancelled everything paying out thats not justified or authorised.

PArt of the reason we were over paying is for 10 years I worked from home, a workshop full of tools, compressor, heaters etc, so our electric use was almost double 'normal' a 3hp compressor and a 6hp flow bench eat it up alright . . . . But the slack arsed meter readers, and even now, non operational 'smart' meter still render them incompetent profiteering scum . . .IMO.

THey're all ****s out there.

 

[dazzer6666]

You have mixed up my two gripes, there, old fellah. The energy bill, and the car insurance. The latter was sorted 15 years ago. The former issue only began in the last 12 months.

Well, as long as you’re on top of it all

 

[Bodian]

I looked at my energy use at the weekend. I am with Octopus. I was using economy 7 withe the sual day/night rate difference. I looked at my dad's single tariff for electricity and realised I could save about £15 a month if I switched. I emailed asking for a quote and I was right except it was about an £18 a month saving. So imagine my surprise and shock when this evening I looked and saw that they had upped my direct debit from £160 a month (before the govt payout of £67) to £263 a month. I wanted to save money, not increase my DD. I am using way less energy than previous years and have about £400 in reserves in my account. It was simple to change the DD to a more realistic level, but at the same time I think their prediction algorithm is useless. For instance, for the month of November they predicted I would use £240 energy whilst actual use was £135. It was a similar saving the month before. The program does not seem able to adapt to changes in habit. These are changes that I know many others have also followed. What a mess.

I find Octopus pretty good. We were with the Co-op before them - and so we've had a smart meter for something like 5-6 years now. And that means (generally) no estimates - so their predictions have been based on 5 years' past usage, which has been pretty even and regular. I'm prepared to accept that they are now over-predicting, because we have, like many, cut down on our gas usage (hard to cut down on our tiny electric usage). So, for a year or two, I think that their predictions are going to be a bit out, until we all settle into a 'new normal'. And when I have pointed this out to them and reduced my direct debit from what they were 'suggesting', they were very amenable.

The one thing I do struggle a bit with is this 'build up a credit for the winter'. Their aim is to never let you go below £0 - whereas if it was really spreading it out over the year, we would be in debit during the winter, in credit during the summer - and at a nil balance around the equinoxes. Just like the sun. Which would be fitting, as that is where all our energy has ultimately come from!

 

[dazzer6666]

We have a joint account and both pay in . . . I Rarely look at it TBH, its designed to have some excess each month, just in case, been happily ticking for nearly 20 years . . . it was only when I got a text to say we were OD . . . . Its a nice problem to have some credit for a change!

If you double and double again DD's twice inside 6 months the credit soon builds up. They actually emailed Mrs Zef eventually, their suggestion was to up It to over a grand a month!!!

This is when I launched into my favourite Angle Saxon phrases, cancelled everything paying out thats not justified or authorised.

PArt of the reason we were over paying is for 10 years I worked from home, a workshop full of tools, compressor, heaters etc, so our electric use was almost double 'normal' a 3hp compressor and a 6hp flow bench eat it up alright . . . . But the slack arsed meter readers, and even now, non operational 'smart' meter still render them incompetent profiteering scum . . .IMO.

THey're all ****s out there.

We have a joint account and both pay in . . . I Rarely look at it TBH, its designed to have some excess each month, just in case, been happily ticking for nearly 20 years . . . it was only when I got a text to say we were OD . . . . Its a nice problem to have some credit for a change!

If you double and double again DD's twice inside 6 months the credit soon builds up. They actually emailed Mrs Zef eventually, their suggestion was to up It to over a grand a month!!!

This is when I launched into my favourite Angle Saxon phrases, cancelled everything paying out thats not justified or authorised.

PArt of the reason we were over paying is for 10 years I worked from home, a workshop full of tools, compressor, heaters etc, so our electric use was almost double 'normal' a 3hp compressor and a 6hp flow bench eat it up alright . . . . But the slack arsed meter readers, and even now, non operational 'smart' meter still render them incompetent profiteering scum . . .IMO.

THey're all ****s out there.

I meant your energy statements (I’m the same with bank account, rarely look at them but should)……..

 

[zefarelly]

I meant your energy statements (I’m the same with bank account, rarely look at them but should)……..

I look at the bank every now and then . . . But we don't really get bills in the post any more.

Ever since the mid 90's, I had 2 bank accocunts, one for salary and bills, and one called 'beer account'. It was my spending money every month.