[Football] "It's not VAR, it's the people running it"

[Guinness Boy]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/62783142

Huge number of controversial / incorrect decisions again yesterday. Offside inconsistencies too over the last two game sets. Everton's goal not flagged but (correctly) given offside by VAR, Coutinho flagged when onside, rather than allowed to continue and play whistled dead so VAR could not correct it and, in our game, Undav not flagged when 10 yards off.

We still have controversy. We still have incorrect decisions. We still have managers blaming refs and sent to the stands. Nothing has been fixed yet fans can't celebrate a goal properly and are getting home from games later and later. Five minutes to award and take a penalty at Forest.

Keep goal line tech but as for VAR, get rid.

 

[blockhseagull]

Problem is everywhere else it seems to be working reasonably well.

It’s the shockingly poor level of refereeing that’s the issue not the use of technology as such.

 

[usernamed]

Am in agreement, either get rid completely, or set a hard time limit for VAR officials, if it’s not obvious within 30 seconds of scrutiny and a panel of 3 aren’t unanimous then the original decision stands.

 

[big nuts]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/62783142

Huge number of controversial / incorrect decisions again yesterday. Offside inconsistencies too over the last two game sets. Everton's goal not flagged but (correctly) given offside by VAR, Coutinho flagged when onside, rather than allowed to continue and play whistled dead so VAR could not correct it and, in our game, Undav not flagged when 10 yards off.

We still have controversy. We still have incorrect decisions. We still have managers blaming refs and sent to the stands. Nothing has been fixed yet fans can't celebrate a goal properly and are getting home from games later and later. Five minutes to award and take a penalty at Forest.

Keep goal line tech but as for VAR, get rid.

VAR takes far more away than it gives, we still get incorrect decisions, and the standard of officiating is worse as a result. I’d bin it immediately.

 

[Icy Gull]

I too would be happy to see it binned. The minuses outweigh the plusses imo

Happy to go back to feeling cheated by a bad decision not happy to be cheated after a VAR review

The wait to celebrate properly is a massive minus too

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

VAR would improve massively if the refs could be heard when they are looking at something and the thought process.

 

[dazzer6666]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/62783142

Huge number of controversial / incorrect decisions again yesterday. Offside inconsistencies too over the last two game sets. Everton's goal not flagged but (correctly) given offside by VAR, Coutinho flagged when onside, rather than allowed to continue and play whistled dead so VAR could not correct it and, in our game, Undav not flagged when 10 yards off.

We still have controversy. We still have incorrect decisions. We still have managers blaming refs and sent to the stands. Nothing has been fixed yet fans can't celebrate a goal properly and are getting home from games later and later. Five minutes to award and take a penalty at Forest.

Keep goal line tech but as for VAR, get rid.

Big credit to Michael Oliver yesterday too, who basically told VAR to do one for the Bournemouth penalty and stuck to his original decision.

 

[SeagullsoverLondon]

VAR would improve massively if the refs could be heard when they are looking at something and the thought process.

Yes it is very interesting hearing the dialogue in rugby matches between ref and TMO. It helps people watching understand the thought process in making decisions. And crucially, other than pointing out things that the ref might had missed (foul play off the ball etc) the TMO receives the steer from the ref, i.e. the ref gives an onfield decision and asks the TMO to check.

In football, I think there should be referrals only if there is genuine doubt in the refs mind.

é.g. the lino didn't flag for offside but he looked off to me, can you check.

Or the lino did flag, but I'm not sure if he was off, please can you check.

Therefore only check for offside if ref and lino are not sure.

Similarly with fouls and penalties:

Ref gives onfield decision but might say to VAR, my view wasn't great, please can you confirm there was contact/inside the area etc.

Then I think VAR plays a much less invasive role, but a more supportive one.

 

[amexer]

Big credit to Michael Oliver yesterday too, who basically told VAR to do one for the Bournemouth penalty and stuck to his original decision.

The ref in Chelsea west Ham game should have had balls to do the same. Keeper just pushed ball to the scorer. The forward could not avoid keeper and it made no difference to the goal

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

Problem is everywhere else it seems to be working reasonably well.

It’s the shockingly poor level of refereeing that’s the issue not the use of technology as such.

Maybe the problem is that VAR has accelerated the disrespect of officials. The line now seems to be the technology is correct so the refs must be even worse than we thought. Refs are on a hiding to nothing. What they do is often subjective, which is the reason they exist. Now they are being told that decisions are definitively right or wrong . I don’t know why they bother.

Ps OP, yes get rid of VAR. It ruins my football watching experience.

 

[dazzer6666]

The ref in Chelsea west Ham game should have had balls to do the same. Keeper just pushed ball to the scorer. The forward could not avoid keeper and it made no difference to the goal

Absolutely shocking decision……never a foul.

 

[dazzer6666]

Maybe the problem is that VAR has accelerated the disrespect of officials. The line now seems to be the technology is correct so the refs must be even worse than we thought. Refs are on a hiding to nothing. What they do is often subjective, which is the reason they exist. Now they are being told that decisions are definitively right or wrong . I don’t know why they bother.

Ps OP, yes get rid of VAR. It ruins my football watching experience.

It’s not ‘the technology’ though, it’s just another ref watching replays giving a different (also subjective) opinion.

It’s not working, it’s not improving the accuracy/quality of decisions overall and it’s ruining the ‘experience’ for anyone watching.

 

[Swansman]

Don't like VAR and would love to see it gone, but if they took it away people would be angry over that as well.

 

[rogersix]

Am in agreement, either get rid completely, or set a hard time limit for VAR officials, if it’s not obvious within 30 seconds of scrutiny and a panel of 3 aren’t unanimous then the original decision stands.

The "3" should be two expro's, ooh er, chaired by a ref, he knows the rules, but can't play football, or understand balance etc.

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

It’s not ‘the technology’ though, it’s just another ref watching replays giving a different (also subjective) opinion.

It’s not working, it’s not improving the accuracy/quality of decisions overall and it’s ruining the ‘experience’ for anyone watching.

Yep, that’s kind of what I was saying. Defenders of VAR seem to think football decisions can be settled by technology when you and I agree it is subjective. Just seen that disallowed West Ham goal. Why on earth was VAR involved. For once I agree with Shearer. Mistakes happen so at least let the on field refs make them without interference.

 

[drew]

It’s not ‘the technology’ though, it’s just another ref watching replays giving a different (also subjective) opinion.

It’s not working, it’s not improving the accuracy/quality of decisions overall and it’s ruining the ‘experience’ for anyone watching.

Exactly, let's call it for what it is, poor quality referees, on and off the pitch. People refer to VAR as if it's some kind of artificial intelligence. It's not, it's the likes of Lee Mason and Mike Dean watching a replay and still coming to wrong decisions. The ref to 'clear and obvious' doesn't help so bin that.

Personally think the Forest pen shouldn't have been given, far to close and his arms were not outstretched.

 

[rogersix]

Yes it is very interesting hearing the dialogue in rugby matches between ref and TMO. It helps people watching understand the thought process in making decisions. And crucially, other than pointing out things that the ref might had missed (foul play off the ball etc) the TMO receives the steer from the ref, i.e. the ref gives an onfield decision and asks the TMO to check.

In football, I think there should be referrals only if there is genuine doubt in the refs mind.

é.g. the lino didn't flag for offside but he looked off to me, can you check.

Or the lino did flag, but I'm not sure if he was off, please can you check.

Therefore only check for offside if ref and lino are not sure.

Similarly with fouls and penalties:

Ref gives onfield decision but might say to VAR, my view wasn't great, please can you confirm there was contact/inside the area etc.

Then I think VAR plays a much less invasive role, but a more supportive one.

Genius! Before 8 o'clock on a Sunday morning

 

[Bold Seagull]

I’d love to see a list a VAR decisions involving matches against the big 6 and which side benefitted…

 

[JJ McClure]

Now its here, its not going away. If it did every week would just be 'that mistake wouldn't have happened if we still had VAR'

It just needs to be used correctly and ideally transparently. PGMOL just hide and try to protect their officials, but it would actually help players, managers, fans and ultimately referees too if there was a little more openness in the process.

 

[drew]

Yep, that’s kind of what I was saying. Defenders of VAR seem to think football decisions can be settled by technology when you and I agree it is subjective. Just seen that disallowed West Ham goal. Why on earth was VAR involved. For once I agree with Shearer. Mistakes happen so at least let the on field refs make them without interference.

But it's got nothing to do with technology. I think VAR should stay because our refs are so crap but it's the crap refs that are making bad decisions even when watching a reply. Offside is offside, they just need to agree which part of the body is relevant. The subjective part is about fouls however Welbz at Old Trafford should, in every officials mind, be a pen when looking at a replay or Cucurella's hair being pulled a foul and a red.