[Politics] Sir Keir Starmer’s route to Number 10

[Rdodge30]

But as with everything you post, you have your own agenda, so I take your whole “these are the reasons full stop” with a pinch of salt!

Your logic is always “after the event therefore because of it.”

I remember Macron’s sound bite when he proposed the 2018 treaty… the current situation is very beneficial to the UK and they must pay. He didn’t get it agreed and here we are. No doubt the reasons you quote are part of the problem but those boats are all launching from France …

 

[WATFORD zero]

But as with everything you post, you have your own agenda, so I take your whole “these are the reasons full stop” with a pinch of salt!

Your logic is always “after the event therefore because of it.”

I remember Macron’s sound bite when he proposed the 2018 treaty… the current situation is very beneficial to the UK and they must pay. He didn’t get it agreed and here we are. No doubt the reasons you quote are part of the problem but those boats are all launching from France …

If you actually read the post you are quoting, I said the four main reasons and certainly not "these are the reasons full stop". If we hadn't have taken those steps 'boats wouldn't be launching' risking lives. They weren't launching at all before we took those steps

So which of those main reasons do you think isn't a major driver and maybe you can tell us one that is more of a driver of the numbers ?

And my logic being 'after the event' ? Here's a post of mine from before you even joined NSC

Here is a really radical suggestion,

Why don't we open up methods for Asylum seekers to apply for asylum whilst still abroad, process those applications within reasonable timescales and return the results to them quickly allowing them to either come to Britain or not as per the result of their claim

Stops the boats, the people traffickers, the costs of hotels to keep people in, keeping people in inhumane conditions, people going 'missing' when waiting months and months to be processed etc, etc, etc, which have apparently all become significant issues in the last 12 years.

Except it isn't radical in any way, shape or form, is it ? It's exactly what we have done for decades until this Government decided to weaponise it, stop any ways of applying for asylum, forced people into boats and people trafficking gangs and create a complete shitshow in order to get stupid people to vote for them and, all the while it works, it will continue.

So judging from some of the posts on this thread it isn't going to stop any time soon

As many on NSC will tell you, I've been going on and on and on and on about these simple facts for years and years and f***ing years

 

[Is it PotG?]

As many on NSC will tell you, I've been going on and on and on and on........ for years and years and f***ing years

Time to give the Brexit thread a bounce mate.

 

[Rdodge30]

I didn’t mean you were after timing WZ that’s me not explaining myself

I meant Post Hoc Ergo Propter Hoc - after the event, therefore because of it meaning that you assume because something happened first it’s responsible for what came after …and nothing else affected the result at all

Usually: it’s the tories ra ra ra !!

My view : it’s a bit about the bloody French as well mate

And I maintain Starmer will get no change from a tenner out of anyone the other side of the channel - certainly not Macron!!

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

I didn’t mean you were after timing WZ that’s me not explaining myself

I meant Post Hoc Ergo Propter Hoc - after the event, therefore because of it meaning that you assume because something happened first it’s responsible for what came after …and nothing else affected the result at all

Usually: it’s the tories ra ra ra !!

My view : it’s a bit about the bloody French as well mate

And I maintain Starmer will get no change from a tenner out of anyone the other side of the channel - certainly not Macron!!

I remember the days when they needed us more than we needed them.

 

[WATFORD zero]

I didn’t mean you were after timing WZ that’s me not explaining myself

I meant Post Hoc Ergo Propter Hoc - after the event, therefore because of it meaning that you assume because something happened first it’s responsible for what came after …and nothing else affected the result at all

Usually: it’s the tories ra ra ra !!

My view : it’s a bit about the bloody French as well mate

And I maintain Starmer will get no change from a tenner out of anyone the other side of the channel - certainly not Macron!!

Yes you've made it quite clear that you don't like the French, and all that's associated with that.

Of course the French aren't being helpful, but without the four steps taken by our Government (the tory government ra ra ra ) that I've highlighted above, why would what 'The French' do have any bearing on our immigration policy whatsoever

And you still haven't explained what you think has more of an effect on boat crossing than the four points I put forward, other than told us (again) that you don't like the french

 

[WATFORD zero]

Time to give the Brexit thread a bounce mate.

Bit pointless as I really can't believe there is anyone left who still thinks that Brexit was a good idea, can you

 

[Rdodge30]

Yes you've made it quite clear that you don't like the French, and all that's associated with that.

Of course the French aren't being helpful, but without the four steps taken by our Government (the tory government ra ra ra ) that I've highlighted above, why would what 'The French' do have any bearing on our immigration policy whatsoever

And you still haven't explained what you think has more of an effect on boat crossing than the four points I put forward, other than told us (again) that you don't like the french

What you said was:

The 4 main reasons ARE as follows- as if it’s definitive, your word is law?

The 4 reasons you gave, I had already given myself as one of the things I considered to be a cause .. lumped together as :
The Government’s change of policy etc… (so yet again we agree on something but you choose to argue about it)

Yes I think that the whole Hoo ha with Macron in 2018 is as big a driver of the increased numbers as the government policy. He made it clear at the time that if the UK did not pay up this would happen. My comment about ‘the bloody French’ would better represent my opinions if I had put the bloody french Government. My mistake- should’ve known from past experience you would jump on that

As I already said I think the huge increase in the graphs in the last couple of years are simply because the criminal gangs are not being targeted by the authorities EITHER side of the channel. I’m addressing the criminal gangs and people smugglers and traffickers here - not asylum seekers… as with all crime that goes unchallenged the rate increases drastically

 

[Rdodge30]

Trouble at mill…?

According to today’s Guardian Union leaders not happy with new Labour document which waters down aspects of Raynor’s worker’s rights proposals. Weak language on fire and rehire…. Loophole provided for zero hours contracts….. right to switch off now to be ‘best practice’

….and less than a week later!!!!

Labour have defused a row with unions over workers’ rights by agreeing to reword campaign pledges to counter accusations of caving in to business pressure.

At a meeting with union bosses on Tuesday, Sir Keir Starmer insisted he was not watering down employment reforms beyond concessions made last summer as the party promised to consult them on the wording of a campaign document designed to sell the changes to voters.

Source : The Times

*Previously the British Chamber of Commerce had said - referring to the ‘watered down language’ - “The Labour Party have clearly heard us”