Should we be a bit more worried about the risks associated with Bloom bankrolling us?

[Commander]

A billionaire? , then why were we nearly relegated from League 1 a few years back?.

Surely a financial backer worth that much wouldnt let that happen?. I think some people might be jumping the gun. I dont know who these "sources" are, but if TB was worth "billions" and cared so much for the club, he'd have stepped in before the banks refused to lend out any money for the stadium build.

Maybe he didn't want to throw money at a struggling league 1 club that was years away from getting a new stadium. Why would he? He was still keeping the club afloat and wasn't going to take over as Chairman anyway, he only did it because the recession hit and we weren't going to get the new staidum othewise.

 

[k2bluesky]

Greedy players (who are often shite when transfered to new clubs) and agents are entirely to blame for the plight of football clubs. I'm sure Tony is astute enough to know that for most supporters just having a fantastic ground and club to support (after years of worry) is enough. I like the championship, it's more 'real' that the prem and I hope we never pay silly money to ANY player, either to buy or pay them in trying to get there. Avoiding the wage bill going above about 50-60% of turnover would be sensible.

 

[Tooting Gull]

And all the time this is happening they will have their Europen license suspended. I personally think a club will be stupid to try and run rough-shod over this new law as UEFA do wield lot of power and are rarely challenged successfully and clubs trying to circumvent the rule will get little support from other clubs, associations or supporters. This rule was the main plank of Platini's campaign so a lot of associations voted it in.

I agree with both you, and the ideals behind FFP and long-term (if they enforce it properly, and that is a big 'if') it will be a very good thing for all but the mega-rich clubs.

But if you think a club like Man City is going to lie down and have their licence suspended for years while they are appealing some aspect of the judgment, you're mad. They will take it to every court there is to keep their £50m a year from the Champions League, and it is hard to see how you can suspend them pending judgment, however outrageous their claim. They don't need support from anyone else, just some good lawyers.

 

[Hotchilidog]

Whilst I think it is good to maintain a healthy level of scepticism I am not worried about our debt to Bloom.

As far as I understand it, Bloom has paid for the stadium, and at this point he has not given the impression of someone desperate to get his money back. What he will not do is give Gus a blank cheque to go and buy whoever he wants no matter what the price. Bloom has stated that the football club should fund itself, and given the income from ticket sales, catering and events the football club should be able to do so, especially if we can make a few quid in player sales.

The time to be concerned is when the revenue stops coming in and the signings get bigger and bigger and we find ourselves with £50,000 a week players unexpectedly.

These are definitely good times for the Albion and I have every confidence in Bloom, he is no JCL, both he and his family have proven over the decades that they fully support this club and our trust has been earned.

 

[Deleted member 22389]

Whilst I think it is good to maintain a healthy level of scepticism I am not worried about our debt to Bloom.

As far as I understand it, Bloom has paid for the stadium, and at this point he has not given the impression of someone desperate to get his money back. What he will not do is give Gus a blank cheque to go and buy whoever he wants no matter what the price. Bloom has stated that the football club should fund itself, and given the income from ticket sales, catering and events the football club should be able to do so, especially if we can make a few quid in player sales.

The time to be concerned is when the revenue stops coming in and the signings get bigger and bigger and we find ourselves with £50,000 a week players unexpectedly.

These are definitely good times for the Albion and I have every confidence in Bloom, he is no JCL, both he and his family have proven over the decades that they fully support this club and our trust has been earned.

If we continue with 20k+ attendances, pies, beer, merchandise, corporate events then we can sustain our life in the Championship and keep building a squad capable of reaching the Premiership. And your right, if we suddenly go down to 14k attendances and players start turning up on 50k a week wages that's when we need to ask questions.

Wages in football are crazy, even with 20k attendances the players wages could end up being more than the turnover. That's bad business.

 

[seagullsovergrimsby]

Maybe he didn't want to throw money at a struggling league 1 club that was years away from getting a new stadium. Why would he? He was still keeping the club afloat and wasn't going to take over as Chairman anyway, he only did it because the recession hit and we weren't going to get the new staidum othewise.

Withdean was a money pit , TB and FBS to a lesser extent along with other investors kept the club from going under. TB knows his investment is low risk over the long term with the bonus being Premier League revenue streams.

 

[seagullsovergrimsby]

Wages in football are crazy, even with 20k attendances the players wages could end up being more than the turnover. That's bad business.

FFP rules will apply so players wages have to fall in line , gone are the days when a club can exit administration and a day later sign up two players on £20k a week each.

 

[El Presidente]

I'm not an accountant, but I can say with absolute certainty that even if you do not comply, all you have to do is make up a sponsorship figure for the stadium/training ground/shirts, and it would take years in court establishing whether this was (or more likely wasn't) fair market value, and sanctions being taken. This is what will happen at clubs where turnover nowhere near covers costs (Man City, Chelsea etc).

Correct, I have in fact stated this in interviews with the FT, Sunday Times, Bloomberg and BBC. (not that I am namedropping of course)

City's £350million stadium naming rights/shirt sponsorship deal, and Real Madrid's £400million 'sale' of their training ground are prime examples.

 

[El Presidente]

And all the time this is happening they will have their Europen license suspended. I personally think a club will be stupid to try and run rough-shod over this new law as UEFA do wield lot of power and are rarely challenged successfully and clubs trying to circumvent the rule will get little support from other clubs, associations or supporters. This rule was the main plank of Platini's campaign so a lot of associations voted it in.

I am aware that City's lawyers are going through the small print of FFP very carefully, and are considering their options in relation to whether FFP is inconsistent with European Competition Rules.

FFP is NOTHING to do with fair play, and all to do with a self serving, self perpetuating cartel maintaining their annual carve up of the Champions League TV monies and gate receipts. The aim is prevent another Manchester City from upsetting the near perennial appearance of United, Chelsea, Liverpool and Arsenal in the CL.

 

[Uter]

The term "bankrolling" to me implies propping up a business whose expenditure exceeds its income. This was clearly true whilst we were at Withdean where we posted significant losses pretty much every year and to quote the auditors report, the club's ability to stay afloat was dependent on the "continued support of the directors in providing adequate loan facilities". In fact by 2009 we owed Tony Bloom £16.9 million.

The loan for the stadium and training ground is an investment to kick start the club and I'd argue doesn't fall within the definition of bankrolling. This is the reason that investment in such facilities is exempted from FFP rules.

Now our income has risen massively we have the chance to be financially self supporting. The club accounts over the next few years will show whether this has been achieved.

 

[PILTDOWN MAN]

A billionaire? , then why were we nearly relegated from League 1 a few years back?.

Surely a financial backer worth that much wouldnt let that happen?. I think some people might be jumping the gun. I dont know who these "sources" are, but if TB was worth "billions" and cared so much for the club, he'd have stepped in before the banks refused to lend out any money for the stadium build.

I would surmise from the way he took over from Dick Knight as a fait accompli, the club would have basically folded if his money hadn't become available to build the stadium. There was no doubt that a power struggle between the two had taken place and there's always appeared to be a certain amount of uneasiness. TB had to overcome one big obstacle, Dick's ego. I do say that with the greatest of respect to Dick.

 

[PILTDOWN MAN]

As the rules say we can only put £3 million into the club every season and it has to be in equity, does that affect this loan if in 2023 he wants to turn say, the remaining £30 million (for example) into equity. Or does the fact that this was part of a loan agreement that was set up 3 years before the ffp mean it is expempt from that rule?

He lent the stadium company the money not the club. The stadium company is wholly owned by.................the club

 

[The Large One]

A billionaire? , then why were we nearly relegated from League 1 a few years back?.

Surely a financial backer worth that much wouldnt let that happen?. I think some people might be jumping the gun. I dont know who these "sources" are, but if TB was worth "billions" and cared so much for the club, he'd have stepped in before the banks refused to lend out any money for the stadium build.

You might want to look towards a certain educational institution for that one.

 

[El Presidente]

You might want to look towards a certain educational institution for that one.

The school of life?

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

I agree with both you, and the ideals behind FFP and long-term (if they enforce it properly, and that is a big 'if') it will be a very good thing for all but the mega-rich clubs.

But if you think a club like Man City is going to lie down and have their licence suspended for years while they are appealing some aspect of the judgment, you're mad. They will take it to every court there is to keep their £50m a year from the Champions League, and it is hard to see how you can suspend them pending judgment, however outrageous their claim. They don't need support from anyone else, just some good lawyers.

I'm sure there was a Swiss club who were suspended a year of so back and they threatened allsorts. Both Pompey and Rangers have had their licenses suspended from the UK. Why did not one of these clubs challenge this? Especially Pompey and Rangers. All they needed, as you say, is a good lawyer which whilst not cheap would certainly provide a high level of cost/benefit and at the bare minimum would provide much needed income whilst they were playing on whilst appealing the suspension.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

I'm sure there was a Swiss club who were suspended a year of so back and they threatened allsorts. Both Pompey and Rangers have had their licenses suspended from the UK. Why did not one of these clubs challenge this? Especially Pompey and Rangers. All they needed, as you say, is a good lawyer which whilst not cheap would certainly provide a high level of cost/benefit and at the bare minimum would provide much needed income whilst they were playing on whilst appealing the suspension.

Actually it was Basel and they got back in as their FA complied with whatever it was UEFA wanted them to do. The other two stand though.

 

[empire]

there are some on here that think we have players on 20plus grand a week,you are dreaming if you think we have that wage structure at present,
the club is running along very nicely at the moment and will continue to do so,
only critisim are the way some of the fans have been treated this year.,tony carry on.......

 

[Spiros]

To quote a previous thread, it's HILARIOUS that some people still don't believe Bloom is a billionaire. (He is.)

Why is it so hilarious? Bloom doesn't parade his wealth and although some 'in the know' say he does have billions the only rich lists I've seen (yes I know they're often wrong but they're all there is) don't say that. I do accept that he could be worth billions and keeping it as low-profile as possible, but that all adds to the mystery.

He does seem to be approaching things the right way - financing key projects like the stadium and training ground but not chucking blank cheques at the playing side. Another chairman who's done this successfully (even though I can't stand the bloke) is Madjeski at Reading. If he really does things right the best legacy Tony Bloom could leave our club is not having to be dependent upon a sugar daddy but able to thrive while balancing the books.

I was initially a bit worried about the vagueness around his income and wealth but his actions since taking over have flattened that completely. As others have said it still doesn't hurt to at least ask a few questions to avoid history repeating itself somewhere down the line.

 

[MJsGhost]

greedy players (who are often shite when transfered to new clubs) and agents are entirely to blame for the plight of football clubs. I'm sure tony is astute enough to know that for most supporters just having a fantastic ground and club to support (after years of worry) is enough. I like the championship, it's more 'real' that the prem and i hope we never pay silly money to any player, either to buy or pay them in trying to get there. Avoiding the wage bill going above about 50-60% of turnover would be sensible.

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[MJsGhost]

there are some on here that think we have players on 20plus grand a week,you are dreaming if you think we have that wage structure at present,
the club is running along very nicely at the moment and will continue to do so,
only critisim are the way some of the fans have been treated this year.,tony carry on.......

I heard from someone (a former youth player, who is good mates with some of the current squad as they played together) that CMS is on roughly £30k per week once all of his extras are taken into account. This wasn't pub talk (well, it wasn't in a pub!) and he had no obvious reason to lie to me. I still don't believe it though and would actually be a bit disappointed if it was true.