[Football] HMRC

[BensGrandad]

This.

ALL players are employees, suffering the full whack of PAYE and employees national insurance on their earnings. Any other arrangement would be criminal tax evasion by the clubs as employers.

A few players also earn from image rights and seemingly some, possibly in collusion with clubs, might have sought to run these through limited companies even though the club was paying. Tax authorities in the UK and Spain for example, have been investigating these cases.

That may be so now but as I said it wasnt in the 80s

 

[Weststander]

That may be so now but as I said it wasnt in the 80s

Sticking to football for a second, all players were on payrolls then too, suffering PAYE/NI.

The occasional tax battles of builders, and later on 'contractors' in many sectors, as to their tax status, is a separate story.

 

[BensGrandad]

Sticking to football for a second, all players were on payrolls then too, suffering PAYE/NI.

The occasional tax battles of builders, and later on 'contractors' in many sectors, as to their tax status, is a separate story.

You may think that but you are wrong or was at that time as I know the amount that Tottenham paid Stevens and how it was done.

 

[LamieRobertson]

You may think that but you are wrong or was at that time as I know the amount that Tottenham paid Stevens and how it was done.

How do you know this

 

[dazzer6666]

The laws on self employment etc have changed and you cannot now be self employed and only work for one contractor whether it be a footballer plumber or driver. Hence HMRC are chasing the likes of courier companies. I foughtr this ruling at an idfutrial tribunal against HMRC and my employers and won but the pay out was agreed to be kept confidential on all parties, little me with the aid of the internet against HMRC and a well known firm of solicitors.

You’ve contradicted yourself quite beautifully there @BG ref you earlier post suggesting players are sole traders etc. They are PAYE for their basic salaries.

 

[Stat Brother]

How do you know this

Don't ask, I'll have an almighty hangover.

 

[Weststander]

You may think that but you are wrong or was at that time as I know the amount that Tottenham paid Stevens and how it was done.

Are you categorically stating that Irvine Scholar deprived HMRC of PAYE/NI on part of Gary Stevens earnings from Spuds?

 

[BensGrandad]

Lets just say I was very close to the negotiations and leave it at that.

 

[LamieRobertson]

Lets just say I was very close to the negotiations and leave it at that.

Erm....no...explain further

 

[dazzer6666]

Lets just say I was very close to the negotiations and leave it at that.

Bit like this ? Bloke on the left is even wearing a Surrey County FA Blazer [emoji106][emoji106]

https://youtu.be/AGrvQ1c5khU

 

[BensGrandad]

Are you categorically stating that Irvine Scholar deprived HMRC of PAYE/NI on part of Gary Stevens earnings from Spuds?

No I am not saying that at all that is your spin on it. Tottenham employed Garys company to provide a player for them, his company provided Gary in the same way that you would employ AB Builders to maintain your property and Anthony Brown did the work

 

[LamieRobertson]

No I am not saying that at all that is your spin on it. Tottenham employed Garys company to provide a player for them, his company provided Gary in the same way that you would employ AB Builders to maintain your property and Anthony Brown did the work

And you know this how.....(again)

 

[BensGrandad]

Erm....no...explain further

I am not prepared to as I do not think that it is ethical and as such you can either believe me or not I do not care either way.

 

[dazzer6666]

I am not prepared to as I do not think that it is ethical and as such you can either believe me or not I do not care either way.

......so it’s bollocks then [emoji23][emoji23][emoji23][emoji23][emoji23]

 

[LamieRobertson]

I am not prepared to as I do not think that it is ethical and as such you can either believe me or not I do not care either way.

Pffft


I was closely involved with the negotiations and no such thing took place and my family know this too

 

[BensGrandad]

......so it’s bollocks then [emoji23][emoji23][emoji23][emoji23][emoji23]

I and my family know the truth so what people on here thinks is of no concern to me.on this point. So I shall not continue with it, If you think that it is b.....ks so be it.

 

[dazzer6666]

I and my family know the truth so what people on here thinks is of no concern to me.on this point. So I shall not continue with it, If you think that it is b.....ks so be it.

[emoji106][emoji106][emoji106][emoji106]

 

[Buzzer]

This.

ALL players are employees, suffering the full whack of PAYE and employees national insurance on their earnings. Any other arrangement would be criminal tax evasion by the clubs as employers.

There are other ways of paying people that are completely legal and do bypass some of the standard PAYE/NI rules. Benefits in kind for instance, where an employer provides a service or item that the employee uses outside of work (even partly) can be tax-free (in-house gym for instance) or do get taxed but only the employer pays NI on it (e.g. accommodation, company car). I know that in the past certain player's contract negotiations have included things like a full tank of petrol every other week. All perfectly above board if declared and there is a cash benefit to the employee because they don't pay NI on it.

You're spot on with most of what you say but I suspect that the practice of using image rights, third-party contracts (Tevez at West Ham), payments to trusts set up for players is far more widespread than you'd think. The head of HMRC even commented on this:

https://www.acq5.com/post/hmrc-to-v...39-image-rights-039-and-other-tax-compliance/

He said that 43 footballers, 8 agents and 12 football clubs were, at that time, under inquiry around the issue of image rights.

‘There have been cases where we have queried player payments – when you get some reserve player no one’s ever heard of getting enormous amounts for image rights,’ Jon Thompson said. Last month legal arguments were heard by the Supreme Court in a case concerning whether payments made by Rangers Football Club plc (RFC 2012) to players and executives at the club were subject to income tax deduction. The case concerns payments made by RFC 2012 into employee benefit trusts.


I think it's fair to say that a lot of clubs in a lot of countries have been avoiding paying a lot of tax after taking advice from tax consultants who have had a very creative, controversial and risky interpretation of the laws, and the tax authorities in these countries (UK, Spain, France, Germany...) believe that it's gone beyond tax avoidance to deliberate fraud.

 

[crookie]

If the figure dropped below 56% you needed paper proof of promotions etc to explain the drop. I retired 17 years ago but wouldnt want a pub or any other business now, as you say there is too much red tape as well as trying to make the business profitable.

You'd be surprised BG. Decent money still to be made in pubs. Just need to buy yourself out of the tie

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

 

[severnside gull]

Not only footballers but other sportspeople too have got themselves caught up in tax dodges. Generally a case of unscrupulous advisers and naive and greedy clients.

They need to engage Amazon as tax avoidance advisors.