Godspeed to our aircrew.

[Tony Towner's Fridge]

What a load of news about a few extra planes having a few free shots at anything they can make a target.
Even though they probably will get the wrong guys, who ever they are.

UK are targetting oil instrallations. Minimal civilian involvement with precision bombing.

TNBA

TTF

 

[alfredmizen]

this! all the innocent lives about to be taken away

the U.K. has always been a target for ISIS/ISIL/Daesh and will continue to be one. The decision to vote to bomb Raqqah will have absolutely no effect on that at all. Through selective targeting using sigint, humint and surveillance there should me minimum impact on anyone in Syria not a member of this organisation. Most Syrians have fled from the Daesh held areas years ago especially from Raqqah so I'm not buying into this whole loads of innocent people are going to die routine.

 

[Paul Reids Sock]

Two days until a terrorist attack on British soil

I was thinking this - I had the radio on last night when the vote came through and was expecting a story within the hour of some form of attack.

Had the vote been planned for longer I would suspect there would have been.

Or you could go completely the other way as some of my friends have (think university sent them a bit loopy) who say that the attacks will stop for a while as the government got what they wanted and can attack Syria for the oil, the control IS anyway and probably orchestrated the Paris attacks .... some of my friends are a tad odd

 

[Cowfold Seagull]

Can't agree with something that frankly seems ill conceived in terms of probable effectiveness and to be largely a face saving exercise.
That said "what other choice"? Doing nothing isn't an acceptable option and the nature of our own freedoms precludes us effectively eradicating the very real threat at home and those responsible for radicalising our youth. That is where, for me, the money and the resources should be spent.
There are no winners in tonight's decision. Some bad people will die but many more innocents too. So yes, let's hope at least that our forces come home unharmed.

Comopletely, and utterly, this.

Normally I would not enter into a debate on this sort of subject, because I am in the main, anti-war.

However, just striking from the air, on Syria and Iraq, WILL NOT DEFEAT ISIS., we need troops on the ground to have any chance of doing that, and no government, at the moment anyway, will be brave enough to sanction that.

All bombing from the air will do, is a) make us feel as if we are 'doing our bit', and more worryingly, b) possibly increase the terror attacks on our own soil.

There, I've said it, it's out in the open, and I won't be posting on the subject again.

 

[Captain Sensible]

Yep, they won't even scratch the surface.

Nice pic! But honestly, I'm not saying we should send more or less, just suprised how few jets we have. I knew the Armed forces could no longer defend us without other nations help, but I didn't realise quite how far our Government have over the years depleted the armed forces. I at least thought we might be talking about 20 or 30 jets, not 6 or 7

 

[Diego Napier]

the U.K. has always been a target for ISIS/ISIL/Daesh and will continue to be one. The decision to vote to bomb Raqqah will have absolutely no effect on that at all. Through selective targeting using sigint, humint and surveillance there should me minimum impact on anyone in Syria not a member of this organisation. Most Syrians have fled from the Daesh held areas years ago especially from Raqqah so I'm not buying into this whole loads of innocent people are going to die routine.

Of course you wouldn't however, someone held captive by Isis states that 500,000 civilians are still trapped in Raqqa.

http://www.theguardian.com/commenti...mbs-hostage-syria-islamic-state-paris-attacks

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

Looks like they'll be starting offensive missions over Syria anytime now.

Godspeed to you all lads and get back safe.

Sorry mate, but, with all due respect, and I DO seriously respect you, that's laying it on a bit thick. Not much risk or call for our prayers in a state-of-the-art turkey shoot. I understand and totally respect that the aircrew lads (and lasses) are almost to a man (and woman) very decent, very honest, professional and well adjusted people without a bad bone in their body and loving families back home who have next to no say on what their orders from the politicians of the day demand that they do. The politicians dictate who are the bad guys at any given point. But at the same time, it's the people on the ground who will be slaughtered indiscriminately, even in a pinpoint bombing raid, whether they're Daesh or where they're a dinner lady trapped in the turkey shoot compound. Those innocent people caught up in the crossfire - and there will be many more of them than there are bad guys - are the people more deserving of our thoughts at this time. IMHO, like. Apologies for any implied disrespect. None was intended.

 

[The Spanish]

Sorry mate, but, with all due respect, and I DO seriously respect you, that's laying it on a bit thick. Not much risk or call for our prayers in a state-of-the-art turkey shoot. I understand and totally respect that the aircrew lads (and lasses) are almost to a man (and woman) very decent, very honest, professional and well adjusted people without a bad bone in their body and loving families back home who have next to no say on what their orders from the politicians of the day demand that they do. The politicians dictate who are the bad guys at any given point. But at the same time, it's the people on the ground who will be slaughtered indiscriminately, even in a pinpoint bombing raid, whether they're Daesh or where they're a dinner lady trapped in the turkey shoot compound. Those innocent people caught up in the crossfire - and there will be many more of them than there are bad guys - are the people more deserving of our thoughts at this time. IMHO, like. Apologies for any implied disrespect. None was intended.

wouldnt fancying bailing out over ISIS held territory myself. or even being in a position where its a possibility. its lacking in imagination somewhat to think this is risk free for our forces or that its a one sided turkey shoot.

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

wouldnt fancying bailing out over ISIS held territory myself. or even being in a position where its a possibility. its lacking in imagination somewhat to think this is risk free for our forces or that its a one sided turkey shoot.

Not got the stats to hand but I'd imagine there's considerably more risk to our aircrews driving round the M25 - or Cyprus equivalent - on their way to work. Again, no disrespect intended. And I mean that.

 

[Deportivo Seagull]

Sorry to be Mr Pendant. I personally know 2 female Tornado crew one driver the other a navigator #feeltheneedtheneedforspeed

The correct terminology for the pilot is 'stick monkey' and the correct term for the navigator is 'walking luggage'

 

[Deportivo Seagull]

this! all the innocent lives about to be taken away

The number of civilians killed by UK air strikes in Iraq is ...... Zero.
Source was a chap on R5 this morning who runs an organisation that monitors such things .........

 

[Bry Nylon]

Sorry mate, but, with all due respect, and I DO seriously respect you, that's laying it on a bit thick. Not much risk or call for our prayers in a state-of-the-art turkey shoot. I understand and totally respect that the aircrew lads (and lasses) are almost to a man (and woman) very decent, very honest, professional and well adjusted people without a bad bone in their body and loving families back home who have next to no say on what their orders from the politicians of the day demand that they do. The politicians dictate who are the bad guys at any given point. But at the same time, it's the people on the ground who will be slaughtered indiscriminately, even in a pinpoint bombing raid, whether they're Daesh or where they're a dinner lady trapped in the turkey shoot compound. Those innocent people caught up in the crossfire - and there will be many more of them than there are bad guys - are the people more deserving of our thoughts at this time. IMHO, like. Apologies for any implied disrespect. None was intended.

None taken Tom. I fully respect your views.
I come from a family with a long history in the armed services - both my mother and father served our country in the RN - and the decision has been taken by our elected representatives to extend the bombing campaign over Syria. My sentiments were directed to the aircrew who will now enact this decision as I know how conflicted they and their families will feel. It will not be a turkey-shoot; any technical fault or hostile fire could see crews ejecting and God help them if they fall into the hand of IS - their fate will be horrific beyond belief.

Now that the decision has been taken all I wish for is for our pilots and navigators to get back safely.

 

[Blue Valkyrie]

So the Tornadoes are there to do the majority of the bombing, and the more advanced Typhoons are mainly there in case things get 'complicated' with Russia ?

 

[Surrey_Albion]

The number of civilians killed by UK air strikes in Iraq is ...... Zero.
Source was a chap on R5 this morning who runs an organisation that monitors such things .........

the same news reports that more civilians have been killed by US drones than ISIS have killed and this was before the the latest air strikes

 

[wellquickwoody]

the same news reports that more civilians have been killed by US drones than ISIS have killed and this was before the the latest air strikes

Please clarify the exact meanings here. Killed by US drones where and in what timescale? And the same for ISIS killings, which if relate to the whole conflict must run into thousands or tens of thousands? And could you please name the source?

 

[mikeyjh]

The number of civilians killed by UK air strikes in Iraq is ...... Zero.
Source was a chap on R5 this morning who runs an organisation that monitors such things .........

Please clarify the exact meanings here. Killed by US drones where and in what timescale? And the same for ISIS killings, which if relate to the whole conflict must run into thousands or tens of thousands? And could you please name the source?

There are interesting statistics here:- http://airwars.org/

It's clear that hundreds, if not 000's, of civilians have already been killed - I'm not sure how we reach a conclusion over which air force was responsible for the deaths, RAF carried out 7% of the raids.

 

[mikeyjh]

So the Tornadoes are there to do the majority of the bombing, and the more advanced Typhoons are mainly there in case things get 'complicated' with Russia ?

Typhoons are also used for 'Air to Surface' (bombing we would called it) missions.....

 

[Thunder Bolt]

There are interesting statistics here:- http://airwars.org/

It's clear that hundreds, if not 000's, of civilians have already been killed - I'm not sure how we reach a conclusion over which air force was responsible for the deaths, RAF carried out 7% of the raids.

The RAF are aiming for targets, not towns or cities. Cutting off supply routes is more effective than indiscriminate bombing.

 

[Blue Valkyrie]

Typhoons are also used for 'Air to Surface' (bombing we would called it) missions.....

Pretty good in dogfight somulations, though...

 

[Diego Napier]

The RAF are aiming for targets, not towns or cities. Cutting off supply routes is more effective than indiscriminate bombing.

And there are no innocents forced to drive in those convoys of munitions/supplies?

"Collateral" damage, like the 30 doctors, nurses and patients killed in the hospital in Kunduz by Western forces, are inevitable.