Charlie Hebdo - merged

[Hastings gull]

You are probably right. This is a very important distinction from being at War with Islam.

If we fight a War with Islam we'll likely lose. If we fight a war against Islamic Extremists, we'll likely win or at least not lose.

By tarring all Muslims with the same brush we do the extremists job for them. We push people into their arms. It is important for all of us to make this distinction.

I could not agree more with you in that there is a distinction, I think, though my previous posts have mentioned that I am not sure to what extent the distinction is valid. Sadly, I don't think that it will be that simple. As emotions heat up, and we witness more and more attacks etc, opinions will become more polarised, and the extremists' numbers grow on all sides. Indiscriminate bombings etc will kill innocent folk and attitudes will harden, inevitably. A well-armed, ruthless, determined and organised minority usually holds sway over a larger number who only want to live in peace and never have that level of fanaticism, but who will nonetheless get sucked into any conflict. I genuinely fear for the future.

 

[spring hall convert]

There's nothing like using a tragedy to gain political capital.

It is being reported that Le Pen wants to bring back the death penalty if elected in 2017.

http://english.alarabiya.net/en/New...eath-penalty-in-Paris-shooting-aftermath.html

 

[Psychobilly freakout]

There's nothing like using a tragedy to gain political capital.

It is being reported that Le Pen wants to bring back the death penalty if elected in 2017.

http://english.alarabiya.net/en/New...eath-penalty-in-Paris-shooting-aftermath.html

For an attack like that I agree and Lee Rigby's killers, and I don't give a flying feck if they end up martyer's why waste money on keeping them in jail until they die. Makes perfect sense to me & the guillotine would be a just and fitting payback.

 

[Hastings gull]

No I didn't. I wondered how many people have contact with muslims.



It's you missing the point. The premise is that if you had contact in your everyday life with people who are muslim, then you wouldn't need some sort of defining statement from them.

My friend, I see exactly what you are saying, I think. I would not expect a work colleague who happened to be a muslim, to come up and apologise, which I think is what you are saying. They would be as innocent as you and I. Have I understood you correctly? Of course it may well be that the muslim community en masse is outraged etc -I would not suggest anything else. it is just that I feel that collectively they have not shown that. Another post talked about the large numbers that will come out and demonstrate about Israeli actions, but I doubt whether there will be such vociferous action now, though this might be rather simplistic. If you or anyone can demonstrably show me that this impression is incorrect, then I will happily say - Ok, my faith is restored.

 

[spring hall convert]

For an attack like that I agree and Lee Rigby's killers, and I don't give a flying feck if they end up martyer's why waste money on keeping them in jail until they die. Makes perfect sense to me & the guillotine would be a just and fitting payback.

I'm not arguing her point, that's for another day - her timing is a little opportunistic isn't it?

 

[Hastings gull]

There's nothing like using a tragedy to gain political capital.

It is being reported that Le Pen wants to bring back the death penalty if elected in 2017.

http://english.alarabiya.net/en/New...eath-penalty-in-Paris-shooting-aftermath.html

This is what I was saying in an earlier post. Attitudes will harden as one party goes for a more extreme solution, then the other retaliates and so hitherto peaceful folk get sucked into a conflict that they never thought that would witness.

 

[Psychobilly freakout]

I'm not arguing her point, that's for another day - her timing is a little opportunistic isn't it?

Hardly surprising to be honest, after all they are a right wing party and in all fairness you would expect such a response.

 

[Green Cross Code Man]

I'm not arguing her point, that's for another day - her timing is a little opportunistic isn't it?

But she is a politician and a ruthless one at that. I would not imagine that she will have any scruples about 'using' this situation for the purposes of her party and presidential campaign. This kind of event is the raison d'etre for her party after all. Behold the next president of the republic!

 

[spring hall convert]

No. I would argue that her timing demonstrates a callous lack of empathy with those that have suffered as a result of the tragedy and a desire to use their deaths as political capital.

Given the left wing stance of the magazine I'd be suprised if many of the deceased even agreed with her.

 

[Green Cross Code Man]

No. I would argue that her timing demonstrates a callous lack of empathy with those that have suffered as a result of the tragedy and a desire to use their deaths as political capital.

Given the left wing stance of the magazine I'd be suprised if many of the deceased even agreed with her.

Agreed!

 

[Green Cross Code Man]

It has been profoundly depressing on so many levels. Obviously the mass killing first and foremost, your heart goes out to family and friends of the victims. They went to work, they drew some cartoons, they got murdered where they sat. It is beyond belief.

What I think the coverage has also shown is that we are not quite the 'home of satire' that we like to think. I don't think many of those cartoons of the prophet would have got published in the UK (we haven't had that kind of thing much at all), and the French tradition remains stronger and more hard-hitting. Tragically, they have paid the highest possible price for that freedom of expression.

There are probably editors sitting in the UK today thinking 'I'm really glad I didn't publish this cartoon or that cartoon about Mohammed', and it may even have saved loss of life, but on this issue Charlie Hebdo were braver, arguably the bravest, and it is tragic what has happened. This is not a war we can afford to lose to the terrorists.

I think that is a correct analysis of our current situation. We are in my opinion a little too scared of offending people in this country. There is a fine line between what may be deemed unacceptable and what is simply an expression of free speech which in a pluralist society must be seen as a given necessity. It appears the French are, after all, at the cutting edge of this privilege.

 

[Soulman]

So, we know that most Muslim's are moderates, but are they moderates whilst in a minority. Let's face it in countries where they are 90%+ in population they are slaughtering each other, countries such as Chad,Yemen, Somalia, Nigeria etc. So if the minorities in the European cities get bigger then will these recent events escalate and the moderates turn.

 

[GingerBeerMan]

For an attack like that I agree and Lee Rigby's killers, and I don't give a flying feck if they end up martyer's why waste money on keeping them in jail until they die. Makes perfect sense to me & the guillotine would be a just and fitting payback.

If your only argument is cost, you'll be happy to know it's cheaper to keep someone in prison for life than to have them executed. Still like the cheaper option?

 

[Nibble]

It's not that we are scared to offend people in this country, it's that we generally don't find terrorism that funny, especially as it was so very present on our soil for so long.

 

[Green Cross Code Man]

If your only argument is cost, you'll be happy to know it's cheaper to keep someone in prison for life than to have them executed. Still like the cheaper option?

How on earth can that be true? And in any case, it would depend upon the age of the prisoner, their relative health and life expectancy.

 

[Buckley's Mad Eye]

Hug A Muslim

The nutters are trying to get a holy war started, so lets piss them right off by having a series of HUG A MUSLIM or HAM days as I like to call them.

Love to you all.

 

[Hastings gull]

It's not that we are scared to offend people I this country, it's that we generally don't find terrorism that funny, especially as it was so very present on our solid for so long.[/QUOTE]

Isn't this what political correctness is all about? We all think to ourselves - am I allowed to say this any more? I don't understand the last section - sorry.

 

[Nibble]

It's not that we are scared to offend people I this country, it's that we generally don't find terrorism that funny, especially as it was so very present on our solid for so long.[/QUOTE]

Isn't this what political correctness is all about? We all think to ourselves - am I allowed to say this any more? I don't understand the last section - sorry.

We just don't find it a particularly funny subject so we tend not to joke about it much. From what I've seen the French cartoons aren't funny on any level. Not offensive. Not satire. Just very unfunny.

Muslims don't need an excuse to attack anyway, bunch of bloodthirsty ****ers the lot of them. It's not a religion for peace. But then none are.

 

[Dick Knights Mumm]

Muslims don't need an excuse to attack anyway, bunch of bloodthirsty ****ers the lot of them. It's not a religion for peace. But then none are.

That should stir the pot nicely.

 

[Mellotron]

Muslims don't need an excuse to attack anyway, bunch of bloodthirsty ****ers the lot of them. It's not a religion for peace. But then none are.

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