[Politics] Brexit

[Dr. No]

Ok, off the top of my head I think Sir Phillip Green is a bigger tax dodger and shyster than Prince Charles.

If you are going to moan about tax dodging and how the powerful fvck the powerless let's get to it.

He and his wife are worse............anyone doing anything about it?

No.

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/746830/Brexit-news-fishing-quotas-Scotland-England-Sturgeon-May

Sturgeon is loving all of this

 

[GT49er]

But hey they have never done anything for the working classes, so history must be wrong

OK - they've done nothing for the working classes for over 100 years then.

 

[studio150]

OK - they've done nothing for the working classes for over 100 years then.

Do read the whole post before commenting, it will stop you posting inaccuracies

 

[GT49er]

Do read the whole post before commenting, it will stop you posting inaccuracies

I did. And 1911 is more than a hundred years ago. I discounted Nick Clegg's 'contribution' as he shamelessly made a grab for power by getting into bed with the tories; in my opinion, their influence was less than the UK's influence in the Council of Europe. In other words, not worth considering.
So please don't be so patronising.

 

[Soulman]

The pen pushers, the faceless paper pushers, that hold up decisions, take money on false pretences, live off the work of the actual WORKING man. These are the ones scared of Brexit.

 

[GoldWithFalmer]

I don't think TTIP will be any more transparent following Brexit! You would have to be naive to think otherwise.

I thought Trump was putting and end to TTIP?

 

[Baldseagull]

I thought Trump was putting and end to TTIP?

I suspect it will just get sat on for four years.

 

[Lincoln Imp]

I like this article from the BBC. It's not partisan but highlights the strange voting patterns in the referendum and tries to understand the cause of the political dissatisfaction that brought Brexit about.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-38301495

I share your liking for the report - it supports the view of many on here (and everywhere else) that the referendum result wasn't just about the EU. Clearly the NSC hardline Brexiters won't like it one little bit. In their view the vast majority of people who voted Leave did so for specific anti-EU reasons centering on our membership of the single market, on immigration and on constitutional matters.

Whilst we sleep peacefully they will be sharpening their pencils for furious retorts, probably involving, if they can't think of anything else, attacks on the BBC for another warped display of institutional liberalism.

Meanwhile, the truth just sits there, the elephant in the Hard Brexiters' room.

 

[GT49er]

I share your liking for the report - it supports the view of many on here (and everywhere else) that the referendum result wasn't just about the EU. Clearly the NSC hardline Brexiters won't like it one little bit. In their view the vast majority of people who voted Leave did so for specific anti-EU reasons centering on our membership of the single market, on immigration and on constitutional matters.

Whilst we sleep peacefully they will be sharpening their pencils for furious retorts, probably involving, if they can't think of anything else, attacks on the BBC for another warped display of institutional liberalism.

Meanwhile, the truth just sits there, the elephant in the Hard Brexiters' room.

The elephant has shat rather more in your room, methinks. There is a lot of sense (you know, that thing that remoaners can't understand) in the report.

"This was an act of extraordinary defiance against a system that does not and will not listen to people's concerns and anxieties.
We need to be honest. Our governance, our democracy, does not function properly. It is failing the people of this country. That is the message of Brexit.
The reason the referendum result caught pundits and pollsters so totally by surprise is that they were applying the outdated rules of our 20th century politics to a 21st century question."

Swallowed that one, have we? Or maybe you'd rather choke on it. Fair enough - your choice.........

"What the British people want, I believe, is a democracy honest enough to reveal the trade-offs and the complexities of contemporary politics, responsive enough to reflect nuanced opinions, and convincing enough that people believe they are genuinely connected to the decisions that affect their lives. When we cut our ties with EU power, we must also reform Britain's archaic power structures. That is surely what Brexit must mean.

Yes, too right it is, and very eloquently put. That's what we voted for.

PS. Us leavers like it quite a lot.

 

[Baldseagull]

The elephant has shat rather more in your room, methinks. There is a lot of sense (you know, that thing that remoaners can't understand) in the report.

"This was an act of extraordinary defiance against a system that does not and will not listen to people's concerns and anxieties.
We need to be honest. Our governance, our democracy, does not function properly. It is failing the people of this country. That is the message of Brexit.
The reason the referendum result caught pundits and pollsters so totally by surprise is that they were applying the outdated rules of our 20th century politics to a 21st century question."

Swallowed that one, have we? Or maybe you'd rather choke on it. Fair enough - your choice.........

"What the British people want, I believe, is a democracy honest enough to reveal the trade-offs and the complexities of contemporary politics, responsive enough to reflect nuanced opinions, and convincing enough that people believe they are genuinely connected to the decisions that affect their lives. When we cut our ties with EU power, we must also reform Britain's archaic power structures. That is surely what Brexit must mean.

Yes, too right it is, and very eloquently put. That's what we voted for.

PS. Us leavers like it quite a lot.

There are a lot of these wise after the fact type pieces about at the moment, the truth is, the vast majority of leave voters quite liked the idea of telling the EU to do one, without thinking too much about the consequences. I don't buy in to the idea that what the people want is a democracy honest enough to reveal the trade offs and complexities of contemporary politics, they really don't want to have to think about it that much, they want someone to beat with a stick, and the EU got it this time.
When the negotiations are not going to the "have cake and eat it" plan, the EU will probably get it again, and it won't be the fault of leave voters if we end up with no deal, and it will be a sell out by parliament if we end up with free movement of people.
There was an AV referendum during the coalition Parliament, and the majority of the low turnout voted to stick with the status quo, if they really were that interested in having their voices heard, they should have turned up and opted for a system that would mean everyone had a vote that counted.

 

[Green Cross Code Man]

I share your liking for the report - it supports the view of many on here (and everywhere else) that the referendum result wasn't just about the EU. Clearly the NSC hardline Brexiters won't like it one little bit. In their view the vast majority of people who voted Leave did so for specific anti-EU reasons centering on our membership of the single market, on immigration and on constitutional matters.

Whilst we sleep peacefully they will be sharpening their pencils for furious retorts, probably involving, if they can't think of anything else, attacks on the BBC for another warped display of institutional liberalism.

Meanwhile, the truth just sits there, the elephant in the Hard Brexiters' room.

I think there is a flip side to your argument in that not everyone who voted remain, voted specifically for the same reason. Some voted for economic reasons, some for the perception that the EU has encouraged closer integration, some for the simple reason that they were fearful of what might happen if we left. Many who voted remain voted for stability and the status quo. Given the huge problems the EU is facing both economically and with security, it is most probable that the status quo will not exist in the way people may have thought it would have anyway.

In short, both leave and remain voters, voted for a myriad of reasons, which is fine by me.

 

[Green Cross Code Man]

http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/746830/Brexit-news-fishing-quotas-Scotland-England-Sturgeon-May

Sturgeon is loving all of this

She isn't loving this:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/201...cola-sturgeon-brexit-plan-scotland-seemingly/

I think Sturgeon had been massively weakened by the Brexit vote, not empowered.

 

[pastafarian]

just over 6 month anniversary since the majority voted to take the country back.

Happy Brexmas everyone!

 

[GoldWithFalmer]

I suspect it will just get sat on for four years.

he might get a 2nd term yet though.

 

[vegster]

I share your liking for the report - it supports the view of many on here (and everywhere else) that the referendum result wasn't just about the EU. Clearly the NSC hardline Brexiters won't like it one little bit. In their view the vast majority of people who voted Leave did so for specific anti-EU reasons centering on our membership of the single market, on immigration and on constitutional matters.

Whilst we sleep peacefully they will be sharpening their pencils for furious retorts, probably involving, if they can't think of anything else, attacks on the BBC for another warped display of institutional liberalism.

Meanwhile, the truth just sits there, the elephant in the Hard Brexiters' room.

A pretty interesting report indeed, however I don't expect much to change. May herself said that " There is a perception that capitalism works for a privileged few " and within 3 months she is shown smugly luxuriating on her sofa in £995.00 leather trousers. Nice work.

 

[studio150]

A pretty interesting report indeed, however I don't expect much to change. May herself said that " There is a perception that capitalism works for a privileged few " and within 3 months she is shown smugly luxuriating on her sofa in £995.00 leather trousers. Nice work.

But far better than sitting on her sofa in a onesy from Primark.
People need to consider the wider picture 20% vat paid. Profit/wages to the designer and producer who paid the supplier of the leather who paid the farmer.....

 

[Lincoln Imp]

The elephant has shat rather more in your room, methinks. There is a lot of sense (you know, that thing that remoaners can't understand) in the report.

"This was an act of extraordinary defiance against a system that does not and will not listen to people's concerns and anxieties.
We need to be honest. Our governance, our democracy, does not function properly. It is failing the people of this country. That is the message of Brexit.
The reason the referendum result caught pundits and pollsters so totally by surprise is that they were applying the outdated rules of our 20th century politics to a 21st century question."

Swallowed that one, have we? Or maybe you'd rather choke on it. Fair enough - your choice.........

"What the British people want, I believe, is a democracy honest enough to reveal the trade-offs and the complexities of contemporary politics, responsive enough to reflect nuanced opinions, and convincing enough that people believe they are genuinely connected to the decisions that affect their lives. When we cut our ties with EU power, we must also reform Britain's archaic power structures. That is surely what Brexit must mean.

Yes, too right it is, and very eloquently put. That's what we voted for.

PS. Us leavers like it quite a lot.

The one thing that is a bit barmy about your post is that you assume I will disagree with it. Far from choking on the extracts you quote I agree with them. In no way do they counter the point that many, maybe most, Leavers voted for reasons not tied to specific EU issues. In fact they support it. I remain grateful to GCCM for rating attention to the report, and to you for promoting it.

 

[Lincoln Imp]

I think there is a flip side to your argument in that not everyone who voted remain, voted specifically for the same reason. Some voted for economic reasons, some for the perception that the EU has encouraged closer integration, some for the simple reason that they were fearful of what might happen if we left. Many who voted remain voted for stability and the status quo. Given the huge problems the EU is facing both economically and with security, it is most probable that the status quo will not exist in the way people may have thought it would have anyway.

In short, both leave and remain voters, voted for a myriad of reasons, which is fine by me.

The point surely is that while people voted Remain for various reasons, strong and weak, those reasons were usually connected to the EU. As the report indicated many Leave voters did so for reasons that were not so connected.

 

[vegster]

But far better than sitting on her sofa in a onesy from Primark.
People need to consider the wider picture 20% vat paid. Profit/wages to the designer and producer who paid the supplier of the leather who paid the farmer.....

It was discovered that they were made in Turkey by workers earning as little as £1.49 an hour. Apparently it would take 3 months wages for them to buy a pair.... As Mrs May said " there is a a perception that capitalism does not.... "