Someone else using your ST when you can't make it ... [Uh oh. Post 43]

Bozza · Nov 2, 2016

Plooks said:
It seem utterly mad that a ticket exchange is not open at least when above a certain % of capacity. I am sure that would result in a higher ticket income for the club.

Could you please explain to me too then please, and I mean that sincerely.

I'm not sure why the club would want to re-sell season tickets seats, only taking a small cut, when they can sell from their own pool of tickets from which they receive the full ticket price themselves.

(The slight exception is when there are only single tickets remaining and the ticket exchange could help facilitate sales to those who want pairs, but you're going to be in the very high 90% range for this, and it feels like you're alluding to a lower threshold)

drew · Nov 2, 2016

Bozza said:
Could you please explain to me too then please, and I mean that sincerely.

I'm not sure why the club would want to re-sell season tickets seats, only taking a small cut, when they can sell from their own pool of tickets from which they receive the full ticket price themselves.

(The slight exception is when there are only single tickets remaining and the ticket exchange could help facilitate sales to those who want pairs, but you're going to be in the very high 90% range for this, and it feels like you're alluding to a lower threshold)

Agree, thought that was obvious.

As for the thread, perhaps people should think before they post. The club are possibly seeking to close a loophole that has been abused by a small minority. Had they kept quiet about it they could have continued.

portlock seagull · Nov 3, 2016

drew said:
Agree, thought that was obvious.

As for the thread, perhaps people should think before they post. The club are possibly seeking to close a loophole that has been abused by a small minority. Had they kept quiet about it they could have continued.

But that would not be in keeping with today's narcasstic need to be the first to tell everyone about everything from celebrity deaths to amusing own goals such as this. Personally I love it when speeding motorists post their boosts online and then get nicked. You can't help the really stupid can you and the internet is the gift that keeps giving in this respect!

drew · Nov 3, 2016

clapham_gull said:
You'd think.

Taking the Norwich game as an example, what did the club do wrong? Assuming there were say 3000 empty season ticket holder seats and that there wasn't excessive demand above the actual capacity. That would be 3000 tickets they sold at full price, say average of £25. An extra £75k of revenue. Had they had an exchange in operation from the start, those 3000 seats would have been sold at full price but an amount would have gone back to the sth, say £17 on average. The club therefore would only make £24k on those tickets. The figures are guestimates but it highlights the situation in basic terms.

As for the argument about using your ST to introduce people to the Albion, it's is all well and good but let's be honest, the club already do things to encourage this, ie bring a friend for £15 etc (or whatever the amount was).

drew · Nov 3, 2016

portlock seagull said:
But that would not be in keeping with today's narcasstic need to be the first to tell everyone about everything from celebrity deaths to amusing own goals such as this. Personally I love it when speeding motorists post their boosts online and then get nicked. You can't help the really stupid can you and the internet is the gift that keeps giving in this respect!

Moshe Gariani · Nov 3, 2016

drew said:
Agree, thought that was obvious.

As for the thread, perhaps people should think before they post. The club are possibly seeking to close a loophole that has been abused by a small minority. Had they kept quiet about it they could have continued.

You keep saying this as though it is the most important point. It isn't. Almost no-one knew about the Print At Home option in any case.

The club's heavyhandedness and clear aim of squeezing fans for every penny they can, harming both the fans' relationship with the club and the atmosphere in the stadium, is far more significant.

Some accept this approach as inevitable ("while Tony Bloom is losing £1.5m a month") but others don't.

The stuff about season ticket exchanges when not sold out is a red herring.

drew · Nov 3, 2016

Plooks said:
I am suggesting that there will always be people who will buy re-sale tickets instead of full price tickets. They will not be able to buy directly from the club, so the argument that the club is losing out is invalid here.
What is unknown is at what percentage of stadium fill does it become optimal to allow this re-sale to occur? I realise you need to minimise the number of people buying re-sale who would by directly. But there should be a sweet spot. I am amazed the club have not had trial scheme to find this optimum. It would also render ticket touting useless as official re-sales would be available.

Surely they could only have a trial scheme if they had a series of gates that were sell outs?

Bozza · Nov 3, 2016

Plooks said:
I am suggesting that there will always be people who will buy re-sale tickets instead of full price tickets. They will not be able to buy directly from the club, so the argument that the club is losing out is invalid here.
What is unknown is at what percentage of stadium fill does it become optimal to allow this re-sale to occur? I realise you need to minimise the number of people buying re-sale who would by directly. But there should be a sweet spot. I am amazed the club have not had trial scheme to find this optimum. It would also render ticket touting useless as official re-sales would be available.

I'm still lost. Why would someone only want a re-sale ticket?

A ticket that goes back to the club by way of a ticket exchange is sold at full price. Always. They are not sold at a discount. The sale proceeds are split between the club and the season ticket holder, but the sale price is still the same as any other ticket (of the same stand etc) sold by the club.

drew · Nov 3, 2016

Moshe Gariani said:
You keep saying this as though it is the most important point. It isn't. Almost no-one knew about the Print At Home option in any case.

The club's heavyhandedness and clear aim of squeezing fans for every penny they can, harming both the fans' relationship with the club and the atmosphere in the stadium, is far more significant.

Some accept this approach as inevitable ("while Tony Bloom is losing £1.5m a month") but others don't.

The stuff about season ticket exchanges when not sold out is a red herring.

I think the point is that, legally, the tickets are not transferable but some were using a facility to share their season which wasn't the point of the system. As it's been broadcast the club have to be seen to be doing something about it. It's hardly heavy handedness, just some people wanting something for nothing.

clapham_gull · Nov 3, 2016

drew said:
Taking the Norwich game as an example, what did the club do wrong? Assuming there were say 3000 empty season ticket holder seats and that there wasn't excessive demand above the actual capacity. That would be 3000 tickets they sold at full price, say average of £25. An extra £75k of revenue. Had they had an exchange in operation from the start, those 3000 seats would have been sold at full price but an amount would have gone back to the sth, say £17 on average. The club therefore would only make £24k on those tickets. The figures are guestimates but it highlights the situation in basic terms.

As for the argument about using your ST to introduce people to the Albion, it's is all well and good but let's be honest, the club already do things to encourage this, ie bring a friend for £15 etc (or whatever the amount was).

Oh I understand that - and also understand the club don't want people buying tickets off someone else.

But the reality is that they aren't 3,000 season holders selling their ticket on.

The minority are quite easy to catch - but the economics that would drive someone to do so ? Sell on a ticket at a lower price but with an add on to make it worth while.

There are better ways of making a few quid than buying some season tickets for the Amex and hoping you can make a profit

We ain't Man United.

My struggle with the club is that TFL (for instance) deal with this all the time without sending out headmaster type communications.

.. and you don't get charged £15 quid if you lose it

Child tickets (and subsidised staff tickets) make a different noise at the barriers for instance. Job done on that front.

Upgrades. Upgrade it to full price. Job done. Is anyone really buying a child season ticket then working out they are quids in by upgrading it every now and then ?

The reality is that in this league and others someone can't go and they lend their ticket. It's breaks the rules but it gets ignored. The person taking the ticket generally doesn't go and wouldn't go at full price. They spend a bit on Harveys and Beer.

Why ? because season tickets holders generally go to all games.

If people are taking the p### find out who. It isn't that difficult.

I'd have to have in greater detail exactly what the problem is because it appears to be a bit circumstantial.

drew · Nov 3, 2016

clapham_gull said:
Oh I understand that - and also understand the club don't want people buying tickets off someone else.

But the reality is that they aren't 3,000 season holders selling their ticket on.

The minority are quite easy to catch - but the economics that would drive someone to do so ? Sell on a ticket at a lower price but with an add on to make it worth while.

My struggle with the club is that TFL (for instance) deal with this all the time without sending out headmaster type communications.

Child tickets (and subsidised staff tickets) make a different noise at the barriers for instance.

.. and you don't get charged £15 quid if you lose it

The reality is that in this league and others someone can't go and they lend their ticket. It's breaks the rules but it gets ignored. The person taking the ticket generally doesn't go and wouldn't go at full price. They spend a bit on Harveys and Beer.

Why ? because season tickets holders generally go to all games.

If people are taking the p### find out who. It isn't that difficult.

I confess to not knowing how the oyster card system works as I don't use it so perhaps you could explain how you get on a train when you arrive at the station to find that you've forgotten your card?

As for TFL, I suspect that if there was a forum for their customers and someone was posting how to use a loophole they would decide whether it is economically viable to close it and if so, just do it!!!!

clapham_gull · Nov 3, 2016

drew said:
I confess to not knowing how the oyster card system works as I don't use it so perhaps you could explain how you get on a train when you arrive at the station to find that you've forgotten your card?

As for TFL, I suspect that if there was a forum for their customers and someone was posting how to use a loophole they would decide whether it is economically viable to close it and if so, just do it!!!!

You can do it online as long as you have registered, Cancel your card - buy a new one and transfer your account to the new one.

I've done it at a station once.

Each card is numbered like a season ticket - it's exactly the same. You can even transfer pay as you go credit.

They charge in certain circumstances I think. But not £15.

Blue Valkyrie · Nov 3, 2016

Bozza said:
Share your ticket with people you know and trust when you can't go. Give them your physical ticket and get it back at some point after. No one, including the club, will be unhappy about this.

....

And don't make a big thing about it on NSC or elsewhere publically and I suspect everyone is happy.

Guinness Boy · Nov 3, 2016

portlock seagull said:
But that would not be in keeping with today's narcasstic need to be the first to tell everyone about everything from celebrity deaths to amusing own goals such as this. Personally I love it when speeding motorists post their boosts online and then get nicked. You can't help the really stupid can you and the internet is the gift that keeps giving in this respect!

Blue Valkyrie said:
And don't make a big thing about it on NSC or elsewhere publically and I suspect everyone is happy.

Quite. There are some things that simply shouldn't be posted in the public domain. Harmless use of loopholes is one. Policy on the fly is another. And I'm quite sure we can all think of other examples. Yet people seem compelled. It's baffling.

Green Cross Code Man · Nov 3, 2016

Guinness Boy said:
Quite. There are some things that simply shouldn't be posted in the public domain. Harmless use of loopholes is one. Policy on the fly is another. And I'm quite sure we can all think of other examples. Yet people seem compelled. It's baffling.

Yet the op may have been naive, but it doesn't seem to me that he was trying to abuse any system or take advantage of the Albion. He was just trying to give out some helpful information.

drew · Nov 3, 2016

Green Cross Code Man said:
Yet the op may have been naive, but it doesn't seem to me that he was trying to abuse any system or take advantage of the Albion. He was just trying to give out some helpful information.

He might not have thought so but that's exactly what he was doing.

kingcole · Nov 3, 2016

I totally get and understand that the club should not be selling already sold tickets when there are plenty left. That would be daft.

But, they need to have the facility available for us to put out ST on the exchange before it's a sell out, so that when the sellout happens there are tickets that are available for resale.

As is the nature of the beast, a sell out is only going to happen close to the match, so there is little time for ST to be made available by their owners.

Some people will know months ahead what games they can't attend due to holidays, weddings etc.

The next game thats a possible sellout is Villa. 100's will already know they can't make it, so let them tell the club NOW that they cant go.

The season ticket exchange needs to be communicated well. For the Norwich game, unless you read NSC or were a geek like me, counting up the seats left for sale, you would not have known the ticketing site was even active.

And I've said before. But if you have a ST and you can't go, the very last part of the website you are going to visit is the bit of the website to BUY a ticket for the game you can't attend! Why on earth did the club choose this part of the site to make the facility known?
[MENTION=561]Insider[/MENTION]

Steve in Japan · Nov 3, 2016

A truism - seats held by season ticket holders are always better than those seats not picked by season ticket holders. Therefore more desirable and much more likely to be sold.

So if the Club is not monetising the opportunity of reselling seats when STHs can't make a game - then that's a lost opportunity to shore up some of TB's losses. And as we have been told many times, every penny counts.

Hard to argue with really, isn't it? So another vote from me for a slick ticket exchange for games where we expect to sell a lot - the Cat A's I suppose. I'm not looking to make money, I'm looking to help the Club fill the seat if I can't.

Blue Valkyrie · Nov 3, 2016

kingcole said:
I totally get and understand that the club should not be selling already sold tickets when there are plenty left. That would be daft.

But, they need to have the facility available for us to put out ST on the exchange before it's a sell out, so that when the sellout happens there are tickets that are available for resale.

As is the nature of the beast, a sell out is only going to happen close to the match, so there is little time for ST to be made available by their owners.

Some people will know months ahead what games they can't attend due to holidays, weddings etc.

The next game thats a possible sellout is Villa. 100's will already know they can't make it, so let them tell the club NOW that they cant go.

The season ticket exchange needs to be communicated well. For the Norwich game, unless you read NSC or were a geek like me, counting up the seats left for sale, you would not have known the ticketing site was even active.

And I've said before. But if you have a ST and you can't go, the very last part of the website you are going to visit is the bit of the website to BUY a ticket for the game you can't attend! Why on earth did the club choose this part of the site to make the facility known?
[MENTION=561]Insider[/MENTION]

So the club advertised the ticket exchange facility only on a part of the website which people go to if they are buying tickets ?

Comedy.

Simster · Nov 3, 2016

Bozza said:
Share your ticket with people you know and trust when you can't go. Give them your physical ticket and get it back at some point after. No one, including the club, will be unhappy about this.

Those who've bought tickets but rarely go (maybe 'reserving' seats in case we reach the Premier League) and punt them out on the cheap to anyone they can find are not really doing anyone any favours. If it's more difficult for them to do this, then it's all good as far as I'm concerned.

This is the post [MENTION=561]Insider[/MENTION] should have made in the first place.

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Someone else using your ST when you can't make it ... [Uh oh. Post 43]

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