[Politics] Brexit

[cunning fergus]

Given the Third Reich only lasted 12 years,I can live with that.Hope the criminals get prosecuted a bit better than Lafarge,though!

True, CEO resigned........no one inside yet.

Big business, politicians and the EU, they protect their own.

 

[cunning fergus]

You want to argue both sides of the coin, on the one hand the EU is too liberal and allows free labour and trade markets across the EU, something you have repeatedly argued is a bad thing, and simultaneously want to open up EU economy to poorer nations.
For me, the barrier to poorer African nations is an unfortunate side effect of the EU policy of ensuring working practices, animal welfare, environmental issues, product safety etc are up to scratch before letting any old Tom Dick or Harry sell their wares here. Aid could be directed at helping these countries to reach compliance.
It is something that needs to be addressed, if we remained as EU members you could lobby your MEP and MP to push this agenda, but as it is, we are leaving and could maybe do something as the UK alone, but I am betting we will be talking to the US and China etc for a long while and trying to maintain a standard of living here rather than making sure Uganda is getting a fair deal.

No one thinks the EU is without problems, just as the UK system of governance is not, but just ditching creates bigger problems than any it may solve.

On the contrary, the consistent point around how the EU operates is that it will place the interests of capitalist big business well above those of the working class.

Inside the EU movement of labour is great for big businesses, not for the low-skilled.
Inside the EU CAP is great for the big landowners, not for the poor who pay higher prices.
Outside the EU CAP denies poorer countries fair access to the EU, meaning food prices remain high in the EU.
EU trade deals exploit poorer countries in trade deals which provide "foreign aid" to rich politicians in poor countries and then strips those countries of their resources.

As I indicated, I accept the EU is less aggressive than (say China and Russia), however the reality is that as an institution it (with the complicity of member states governments) has inflicted tremendous damage on the powerless poor and working class whether or not they live inside and outside the EU.

It's why the rich and powerful want us to stay in.......thankfully the British working class finally saw through all their bullshit.

 

[cunning fergus]

Have you been to much of Africa or lived there out of interest?

Have you played professional football for BHA or any other Premiership side out of interest?

 

[Guinness Boy]

Good Lord, fergus is back and he's been in the shant.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[nicko31]

I have noted that typically you swerve from one singular perceived economic indicator to another depending how it might be performing, the FTSE a favoured pre referendum indicator from the doom merchants is no longer mentioned [MENTION=267]TSB[/MENTION] still having sleepless nights no doubt, current fuel prices seem to be ditched too, employment figures also shoved to the side, my favourite was the supposed unsustainable holiday cost to the coasta bravas thankfully that never happened, inflation bobbing along just fine, no runaway double digit disaster, due to back within BoE targets by next year by all accounts that dastardly weaker pound just not delivering just yet, interest rates remain historically low, house prices ease, this has confused Remainers they are not sure if this should be hailed good or bad so they stay quiet and wait, how about GDP topping G7 2016 that was just funny but obviously irrelevent for Remainers until it became the lowest, then bingo, now the pound is at 7 year low and makes us the poor man of Europe, yeah righto.

Our ex/rate is basically the UK’s share price, Brexit bonus for those with overseas shares and property. But for many its higher supermarket prices, energy costs and that overseas trip once a year will go if there's nothing left over. Denial does have its advantages, just keep spending and borrowing, it will delay the slowdown and hopefully help us avoid recession.

 

[ManOfSussex]

Have you played professional football for BHA or any other Premiership side out of interest?

It's called The Premier League these days, as it has done for the last 10 years or so if you don't follow or get to football much.

I'll take that as 'no' then to my original question though and therefore I'd hazard a guess I know a little bit more about and have more first hand experience of African agriculture, farming and food standards than you who hasn't.

As has been pointed out on post #33719, your name calling of remain voters and anti-capitalist, anti-EU/it's all one giant capitalist conspiracy was a bit OTT and is now rumbled, but I'm sure that wont stop you.

Ke tla go bona.

 

[Pretty pink fairy]

THESE DOOM MERCHANTS ARE LIKE A BUNCH OF SCAG HEADS RUNNING AROUND LOOKING FOR THEIR NEXT FIX
regards
DR

 

[Lincoln Imp]

You sound as if you are trying to set an A level question. Very boring. I never claimed to have evidence - I was part posing a question, part making a suggestion. As a suggestion, I suggest it is one which many reasonable people, both on the remain and leave sides, might find feasible. The fact that I support Brexit has no bearing on my feeling that the Labour leave vote may have been substantially New Labour.

Sorry - didn't mean to bore you. I imagined that as New Labour was essentially a centrist party those who voted for it would tend to vote as other centrists tend to. To remain in the EU. No evidence for that either.

 

[Lincoln Imp]

Who, after he left power, admitted in a TV interview that the aim was always full political and financial integration - a United States of Europe. He also admitted that they couldn't mention this during the referendum campaign because it would probably have meant we didn't join.

You've made this point before, so may I also make a point I've made before? A recurring theme of the first European referendum was the concept of 'shared sovereignty'. It came up so often that the Daily Telegraph said that it was dominating the debate. The claim that people were told that it was all about trading is a bit of a myth.

 

[Pretty pink fairy]

You've made this point before, so may I also make a point I've made before? A recurring theme of the first European referendum was the concept of 'shared sovereignty'. It came up so often that the Daily Telegraph said that it was dominating the debate. The claim that people were told that it was all about trading is a bit of a myth.

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
regards
DR

 

[cunning fergus]

It's called The Premier League these days, as it has done for the last 10 years or so if you don't follow or get to football much.

I'll take that as 'no' then to my original question though and therefore I'd hazard a guess I know a little bit more about and have more first hand experience of African agriculture, farming and food standards than you who hasn't.

As has been pointed out on post #33719, your name calling of remain voters and anti-capitalist, anti-EU/it's all one giant capitalist conspiracy was a bit OTT and is now rumbled, but I'm sure that wont stop you.

Ke tla go bona.

You can take it how you want, whether I have lived in Africa or not does not diminish one iota the points I have made about the negative implications for African countries in their dealings with the EU. You don't need to take my word for it either, which is why I attached Greenpeace reports on that very point.

You can whine all you like about my name calling, I was born long enough ago to remember the old Labour Party, and its deep rooted suspicion of the EU (and its predecessors). You cannot change history.

So I would wager you are one of the young and dumb lot who think you are a lefty, when sadly you are the opposite.

It's ok, you'll grow out of it.

 

[JC Footy Genius]

I still can't fathom out why the poor and disenfranchised didn't vote for an option that was recommended by people who had been screwing them over for decades that guaranteed more of the same. Also surprising that they didn't listen to people who generally view them as a bit thick and racist who are generally doing rather well out of the current system and really couldn't give a toss about them.

 

[ManOfSussex]

You can take it how you want, whether I have lived in Africa or not does not diminish one iota the points I have made about the negative implications for African countries in their dealings with the EU. You don't need to take my word for it either, which is why I attached Greenpeace reports on that very point.

You can whine all you like about my name calling, I was born long enough ago to remember the old Labour Party, and its deep rooted suspicion of the EU (and its predecessors). You cannot change history.

So I would wager you are one of the young and dumb lot who think you are a lefty, when sadly you are the opposite.

It's ok, you'll grow out of it.

You attached a few reports on a matter you don't really know anything about for the purposes of trolling and have subsequently been rumbled in your lack of first hand knowledge on something, and you persist in this anti-EU/Capitalist conspiracy nonsense as well. If you're going to troll at least pick a subject you know something a little bit about and be consistent - those reports were written by those young, dumb lot who think they're lefties when they're sadly the opposite according to you. You're all over the place?!

I doubt very much to the point that I don't actually believe you, as your credibility is rather shot, when you say you can remember the Labour Party in the 1960s as you're just trolling, but in the unlikely event you are actually speaking some semblance of truth, perhaps you should grow up and join the 21st century.

Don't waste your time responding to this or attempting to insult me though - I'm immune to insults.

Robala sentle.

 

[ManOfSussex]

I still can't fathom out why the poor and disenfranchised didn't vote for an option that was recommended by people who had been screwing them over for decades that guaranteed more of the same. Also surprising that they didn't listen to people who generally view them as a bit thick and racist who are generally doing rather well out of the current system and really couldn't give a toss about them.

Nothing's going to change for the poor and disenfranchised after Brexit under the right-wing Conservatives along with their money, safe from the The EU Anti Tax Avoidance Directive. Hopefully it will under Corbyn - people want change, they're going to have it when he's in power

 

[JC Footy Genius]

Nothing's going to change for the poor and disenfranchised after Brexit under the right-wing Conservatives along with their money, safe from the The EU Anti Tax Avoidance Directive. Hopefully it will under Corbyn - people want change, they're going to have it when he's in power

Funny how the Tory establishment and the vast majority of their big money backers obviously weren't bothered by the The EU Anti Tax Avoidance Directive and held the same position as you. #moreofthesame

Yes many people want radical change which is easier to deliver when our directly elected representatives are given more power. Brexit also makes them more accountable .. no more blame the EU excuses. Corbyn is a lifelong opponent of the EC/EU and probably more Eurosceptic than our current PM.

 

[cunning fergus]

You attached a few reports on a matter you don't really know anything about for the purposes of trolling and have subsequently been rumbled in your lack of first hand knowledge on something, and you persist in this anti-EU/Capitalist conspiracy nonsense as well. If you're going to troll at least pick a subject you know something a little bit about and be consistent - those reports were written by those young, dumb lot who think they're lefties when they're sadly the opposite according to you. You're all over the place?!

I doubt very much to the point that I don't actually believe you, as your credibility is rather shot, when you say you can remember the Labour Party in the 1960s as you're just trolling, but in the unlikely event you are actually speaking some semblance of truth, perhaps you should grow up and join the 21st century.

Don't waste your time responding to this or attempting to insult me though - I'm immune to insults.

Robala sentle.

You are struggling here chicken..........lets do this nice and slow, what exactly have I been rumbled on?

You highlight the points where I am wrong..........old Labour Party euro scepticism, the opposition of trade unions to the EEC, historical pro EU Tory policies, the degradation of British working class interests n the alter of free markets, the ridiculous of CAP, the exploitation of African countries in EU trade deals.........take your pick.

The fact that you choose to disagree with me or do not want to accept these facts or views does not make you right...........as it happens in relation to the undeniable historical facts it makes you a bigot. A Tory big business cock sucking bigot at that.

You know that though, it's why you're upset at Brexit........you're on here every day, you are hurting bad.

 

[cunning fergus]

Nothing's going to change for the poor and disenfranchised after Brexit under the right-wing Conservatives along with their money, safe from the The EU Anti Tax Avoidance Directive. Hopefully it will under Corbyn - people want change, they're going to have it when he's in power

I know you are too young know Corbyn's track record, but really...........you are all over the place.

http://uk.businessinsider.com/jerem...s-all-the-times-he-said-the-eu-was-bad-2016-4

Jeez, if you are the future, this country is in trouble when us old-uns take the celestial elevator.

 

[cunning fergus]

Nothing's going to change for the poor and disenfranchised after Brexit under the right-wing Conservatives along with their money, safe from the The EU Anti Tax Avoidance Directive. Hopefully it will under Corbyn - people want change, they're going to have it when he's in power

Just to bring us up to date, that article was when Jena was hiding his historical views, the manifesto and recent interviews have clarified the position.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...ms-union-immigration-maastricht-a7855621.html

You need to support Chukka Ummna.......he's the Tory that wants to remain in like you.

He's not quite the working class boy from Croydon either, if they walk like a Tory and talk like a Tory, you know what they are right?

 

[ManOfSussex]

Funny how the Tory establishment and the vast majority of their big money backers obviously weren't bothered by the The EU Anti Tax Avoidance Directive and held the same position as you. #moreofthesame

Yes many people want radical change which is easier to deliver when our directly elected representatives are given more power. Brexit also makes them more accountable .. no more blame the EU excuses. Corbyn is a lifelong opponent of the EC/EU and probably more Eurosceptic than our current PM.

Like the Billionaire newspaper barons weren't interested you mean? The vast majority of elected Tory MP's were making a decision on what was best for the country because Brexit isn't, but the right-wing, self interested rump were not and were manipulating people into voting accordingly. We'll see what happens when it all goes wrong and The EU can't be blamed for our shortcomings anymore.

 

[ManOfSussex]

You are struggling here chicken..........lets do this nice and slow, what exactly have I been rumbled on?

You highlight the points where I am wrong..........old Labour Party euro scepticism, the opposition of trade unions to the EEC, historical pro EU Tory policies, the degradation of British working class interests n the alter of free markets, the ridiculous of CAP, the exploitation of African countries in EU trade deals.........take your pick.

The fact that you choose to disagree with me or do not want to accept these facts or views does not make you right...........as it happens in relation to the undeniable historical facts it makes you a bigot. A Tory big business cock sucking bigot at that.

You know that though, it's why you're upset at Brexit........you're on here every day, you are hurting bad.

Amazing how consumption of alcohol or substances turned you into a brave keyboard warrior in the midnight hour. You call me a cock sucking bigot, when other than trolling on here and coming up with remarks like that, you're all over Muslim threads making derogatory remarks and trolling on them? You seem more 1970's National Front than 1970s Labour to me.

I know you are too young know Corbyn's track record, but really...........you are all over the place.

http://uk.businessinsider.com/jerem...s-all-the-times-he-said-the-eu-was-bad-2016-4

Jeez, if you are the future, this country is in trouble when us old-uns take the celestial elevator.

I know Corbyn's track record and the fact he's hardly pro-EU thanks. This country's already in big trouble now and the foreseeable. Post Brexit I hope he becomes PM though. It was a bit late when you made these rambling, substance induced posts though. Are you sure it's me all that's all over the place?

Just to bring us up to date, that article was when Jena was hiding his historical views, the manifesto and recent interviews have clarified the position.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...ms-union-immigration-maastricht-a7855621.html

You need to support Chukka Ummna.......he's the Tory that wants to remain in like you.

He's not quite the working class boy from Croydon either, if they walk like a Tory and talk like a Tory, you know what they are right?

It's getting a bit boring you calling remain voters Tories, as trolling goes it's a rather poor effort. I don't need to support Chukka Ummna, ultimately he's irrelevant to it all rather like you. Len McLuskey and The Unions have more relevance and influence to Labour's Brexit and single market stance down the road than him and trolls like you.

Hope you're not feeling too unwell this morning.