General Election 2015

[Herr Tubthumper]

Not sure that will automatically follow: Labour had more votes and fewer seats than the Tories in the 1951 General Election but there was no call at all for a move to an alternative system

That was over 60 years ago though. I'm not sure you can base an argument on then as things were quite different then

 

[The Birdman]

Ed Milliband leading this great nation? Ha ha ha ha.

Even worst if Ed propped up by the SNP we can thank UKIP for that.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Even worst if Ed propped up by the SNP we can thank UKIP for that.

The SNP have said they will help stop a Cameron led government if they can. It's a very probably outcome.

 

[cunning fergus]

I did not set myself up as rule maker, I merely bit at Fergus because he was posting in an underhand way, rather than stating his real views. I'm happy with the 'cut and thrust' he refers to, but I could do without being told to 'shove it up your tory arse' by somebody who, I would hazard a guess, voted for Thatcher. That's just playing silly games.

To pick up the thread again.........and letting bygones be bygones, our initial exchange arose from the implications of the Labour Party's politcal decision to facilitate the free movement of people from within the EU (including accessation countries) and generally take a more relaxed atittude to border control. The naturalisation of millions of immigrants in the last 10-15 years is just one consequence of this political decision. These are undeniable facts.

As someone who is openly supporting Labour (and stating on this thread that it is necessary to vote for them), why should I not point out to you that Labour's policy is now to control migration. This is a full u-turn from their previous position when in Government; and which is evidently a position they want to distance themselves from.

Labour (and taking Yvette Coopers Press Release as an example) are not pointing to their record on migration whilst in Govt and saying it benefitted GDP (like you want to do) and the reason they are not doing that is because the broad implications for the British working class concerning that policy decision has been disasterous.

The fact that you still support their previous policy, and justify it on the back of GDP means you support a free labour market and let the devil take the hindmost.

This ideology is not consistent with the Labour Party I remember...............free markets of any kind stink of toryism....................hence reference to your Tory arse.

In the meantime you have not sought to vaildate the question I asked of why a return to Labour's policy of uncontrolled labour market would benefit the British working class, instead you went stright to the G. Brown manual for dealing with immigration matters....................I have merely been your own personal Gillian Duffy (a Labour member hersel I seem to remember).

 

[seagullsovergrimsby]

I would say that the Greens have had a lot of focus this last week and a lot of airtime which is good. I think many on the progressive left would like what they say. Except those who live in brighton and hove and have lived the green nightmare this last 3 years

Pretty certain the running of BHCC by the Greens will cause major embarrassment at a national level for the Greens prior to May.

 

[spring hall convert]

Labour In Scotland Update

http://news.stv.tv/scotland-decides...murphy-fails-to-make-general-election-impact/

SNP 52%(55 seats)
LAB 24%(4)
CON 12%
LDEM 4%
GRN 4%

Annihiliation. Are we going to see natural Tories voting Labour in Scotland to try and keep the SNP out?

It's pretty embarassing for Westminster to see what happens when people are given a realisitic alternative to the current shower of self-serving no marks. I wonder if we'll see a genuine nationalist alternative to the SNP, pre-independence. That could make things a bit awkward.

 

[Blue Valkyrie]

Salmond as Deputy PM could well be on the cards.

Devolution maximus for Scotland on its way it seems.

 

[Gwylan]

That was over 60 years ago though. I'm not sure you can base an argument on then as things were quite different then

Fair point (although it also happened in 1974) but my general argument is that there's no great desire for a move to a new voting system and a discrepancy in an election result won't change that. We had a referendum just four years ago and there was a massive vote against the idea - I can't see there being another referendum any time soon.

Pretty certain the running of BHCC by the Greens will cause major embarrassment at a national level for the Greens prior to May.

As I said earlier, the figures don't bear this out. Caroline Lucas is on course to increase her majority massively and the Greens nationally are, according to opinion polls, on two or three times the vote last time round. How is that embarrassing?

 

[spring hall convert]

As I said earlier, the figures don't bear this out. Caroline Lucas is on course to increase her majority massively and the Greens nationally are, according to opinion polls, on two or three times the vote last time round. How is that embarrassing?

The positive PR that Caroline Lucas has generated by just being a fantastic consituency MP with a firm, consistent national standpoint on a variety of important issues will far outweigh any embarassments the council could cause.

However, it does ask a pretty serious question. How many more of her have they got waiting in the wings or is it going to be a succession of UKIP style embarassments?

 

[beorhthelm]

Labour In Scotland Update

http://news.stv.tv/scotland-decides...murphy-fails-to-make-general-election-impact/

SNP 52%(55 seats)
LAB 24%(4)
CON 12%
LDEM 4%
GRN 4%

Annihiliation. Are we going to see natural Tories voting Labour in Scotland to try and keep the SNP out?

those seats cannibalise the Labour seats. i wonder if we'd see Tories vote Liberal to shore up half a dozen of their seats

 

[Westdene Seagull]

Salmond as Deputy PM could well be on the cards.

Devolution maximus for Scotland on its way it seems.

Would Labour really form a coalition with the SNP ? It seems hard to believe given Labour were anti-Scottish independence and that Gordon Brown was seen as the person that rescued the No campaign.

 

[spring hall convert]

those seats cannibalise the Labour seats. i wonder if we'd see Tories vote Liberal to shore up half a dozen of their seats

You're right and far more likely.

 

[Gwylan]

However, it does ask a pretty serious question. How many more of her have they got waiting in the wings or is it going to be a succession of UKIP style embarassments?

Now that's a good question.The candidate for Hove is a total buffoon so I hope that's not a guide for the rest of the country

 

[beorhthelm]

Would Labour really form a coalition with the SNP ?

of course they would. the question is, how long would it last and what policies are going to be jettisoned to get SNP on board.

 

[Simster]

Would Labour really form a coalition with the SNP ? It seems hard to believe given Labour were anti-Scottish independence and that Gordon Brown was seen as the person that rescued the No campaign.

Of course they would. The electorate have voted in a SNP majority in Scotland but that didn't stop them consequently voting No to independence by a comfortable margin.

 

[Soulman]

Whoops there goes another Labour MP. Another defecting to Ukip.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...the-party-i-once-knew-is-no-more-9991576.html

 

[Simster]

of course they would. the question is, how long would it last and what policies are going to be jettisoned to get SNP on board.

IMO, it would be more about assurances of Scottish jobs and Scottish parliamentary power than jettisoning significant Labour policy. That's why such a coalition is so likely.

 

[spring hall convert]

To pick up the thread again.........and letting bygones be bygones, our initial exchange arose from the implications of the Labour Party's politcal decision to facilitate the free movement of people from within the EU (including accessation countries) and generally take a more relaxed atittude to border control. The naturalisation of millions of immigrants in the last 10-15 years is just one consequence of this political decision. These are undeniable facts.

As someone who is openly supporting Labour (and stating on this thread that it is necessary to vote for them), why should I not point out to you that Labour's policy is now to control migration. This is a full u-turn from their previous position when in Government; and which is evidently a position they want to distance themselves from.

Labour (and taking Yvette Coopers Press Release as an example) are not pointing to their record on migration whilst in Govt and saying it benefitted GDP (like you want to do) and the reason they are not doing that is because the broad implications for the British working class concerning that policy decision has been disasterous.

The fact that you still support their previous policy, and justify it on the back of GDP means you support a free labour market and let the devil take the hindmost.

This ideology is not consistent with the Labour Party I remember...............free markets of any kind stink of toryism....................hence reference to your Tory arse.

In the meantime you have not sought to vaildate the question I asked of why a return to Labour's policy of uncontrolled labour market would benefit the British working class, instead you went stright to the G. Brown manual for dealing with immigration matters....................I have merely been your own personal Gillian Duffy (a Labour member hersel I seem to remember).

Fergus, the more I read your posts, the more I think I understand where you are coming from. Would I be right to say that if there were a party with a broadly socialist agenda, that advocated a withdrawal from the EU, they would likely have your support.

Have you any idea why the common thought process seems to be that being anti-EU (in its current form) isn't commensurate with being "left-wing?"

 

[Gwylan]

Whoops there goes another Labour MP. Another defecting to Ukip.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...the-party-i-once-knew-is-no-more-9991576.html

Er ... or not

To reiterate, no Labour MP has defected to UKIP, let alone another

 

[Soulman]

Er ... or not

To reiterate, no Labour MP has defected to UKIP, let alone another

Oh dear, i mean't to put mayor, slip of the thumb, still should get a few looking at the link