Thatcher T-Shirts Sold in Brighton...

[Norman Potting]

No you haven't got maggie to thank, I was educated under a Labour government, and my history O level course was "british economic and social history since the 17th century" boring as f***, and destroyed the love i had for that subject at school.

Conversely I studied that at "O" level and really enjoyed it - the teacher who did the European History "O" level did try and sell it to us on the grounds that there were "...loads of wars and more blood" on his course, and tempted though I was (he was also a good teacher and mad as a very mad thing) I preferred to learn about the industrial revolution.

Still enjoy history of all sorts, including the wars and blood stuff and not neccessarily British. Would be a boring world if we weren't all different I guess.

 

[User removed 4]

Wow. I never knew this.

Ha ha ha , cough , splutter, you're a card aren't you ?

 

[User removed 4]

Conversely I studied that at "O" level and really enjoyed it - the teacher who did the European History "O" level did try and sell it to us on the grounds that there were "...loads of wars and more blood" on his course, and tempted though I was (he was also a good teacher and mad as a very mad thing) I preferred to learn about the industrial revolution.

Still enjoy history of all sorts, including the wars and blood stuff and not neccessarily British. Would be a boring world if we weren't all different I guess.

wee ceratinly are different, learning about the land acts , spinning jenny etc bored the life out of me!!

 

[severnside gull]

There might just be a new market for the Dancing on Thatcher's Grave t-shirts after today's Hillsborough revelations

 

[ALBION28]

Quite the opposite. Outside the bubble of the south east you'll find the majority of country would happily raise a glass to her demise. And a fair few within the bubble too.

Spot on,real problem with those having south east tinted glasses...bit of the old I,m alright mate, to hell with you.

 

[User removed 4]

Spot on,real problem with those having south east tinted glasses...bit of the old I,m alright mate, to hell with you.

You're probably right but does anyone seriously think that if the situation were reversed and it had been the south east that was in trouble and the north that was living high on the hog then there would have been hordes of chip on their shoulder northerners demanding action to share the burden ??

 

[Titanic]

Nice work from Ed...

 

[Westdene Seagull]

I find it somewhat ironic that those on the left are willing to still blame Thatcher for the ills of today despite Labour having been in power for 13 years ( and Blair serving for long than Thatcher ). Yet when the current Tory government complain that they are trying to sort out Labour's mess Labour deny any responsibility. They can't have it both ways !

As for pissing on anyone's grave or celebrating an elected leaders death, well I'd support [MENTION=6886]Bozza[/MENTION] banning them for a few weeks.

 

[Jimmy's gonna get ya!]

You're not seriously asking that question, surely?

Yes I am. If I am ignorant, (likely) please enlighten me. I know what they have done for their paying members, but the country as a whole......

 

[Dandyman]

That picture on that revolting t-shirt is from a mass grave of our serviceman who died in france , you can tell by the style of crosses and the way they are placed in their rows . That for me makes it all the more distasteful. Arrest this filthy piece of disrespectful shit now...

A member of my family is remembered at Poziers Commonwealth War Grave in France. I am not in the least offended by the T-Shirt.

 

[Westdene Seagull]

A member of my family is remembered at Poziers Commonwealth War Grave in France. I am not in the least offended by the T-Shirt.

But would you be if Thatchers name was replaced by Blairs ?

 

[Dandyman]

But would you be if Thatchers name was replaced by Blairs ?

No, I think he is a "wordbannedbynazimods" as well.

 

[kemptown seagull]

I wonder if they'd be allowed to sell those T-Shits with death to the Prophet Mohammed?

 

[Westdene Seagull]

No, I think he is a "wordbannedbynazimods" as well.

Fair enough - I obviously meant to type a left wing PM's name !

 

[Seagull over Canaryland]

Punters forget that Mrs T swept to power on the back of one of Labour's darkest periods in government when the unions ruled the roost, winter of discontent etc, the economy was in a mess, we had gone cap in hand to the IMF for bail outs (sound familiar?) and inspite of this Labour dared not stand up to the militant left etc. They knew that many of the UKs traditional industries were grossly inefficient, over-staffed and blighted by terrible industrial relations - yes, under a Labour Govt. The UK was teetering on a precipice and needed decisive action.

Mrs T showed the sort of backbone that is sorely lacking among most politicians - she wasn't afraid to take the hardest decisions in the interests of the Country. OK that meant taking on the Miners and making other industries leaner and meaner. Plus she stood up to Europe and demanded the rebate that has stood in our favour for years much to the resentment of the French. She wasn't beyond telling US Presidents a few home truths rather than being their lapdogs and she took us into a just war. She came very close to being assassinated at The Grand Hotel and got my respect for her iron determination after that.

She wasn't always right and certainly lost a lot of support when she took on that rather patronising 'more royal than the royals' voice which made me feel she had lost any empathy with the public.

OK she is a rather sad figure these days but I suggest history will judge her leadership far more positively than anything in the 25 years before or since her.

Compare that to the rather lily livered rose tinted politics of the Blair and Brown era who are at least equally culpable when it comes to nearly bankrupting the UK and creating financial heartache for far more punters than Mrs T did. They could have been respected for making decent decisions of their own, but bottled it.

 

[Dandyman]

Punters forget that Mrs T swept to power on the back of one of Labour's darkest periods in government when the unions ruled the roost, winter of discontent etc, the economy was in a mess, we had gone cap in hand to the IMF for bail outs (sound familiar?) and inspite of this Labour dared not stand up to the militant left etc. They knew that many of the UKs traditional industries were grossly inefficient, over-staffed and blighted by terrible industrial relations - yes, under a Labour Govt. The UK was teetering on a precipice and needed decisive action.

Mrs T showed the sort of backbone that is sorely lacking among most politicians - she wasn't afraid to take the hardest decisions in the interests of the Country. OK that meant taking on the Miners and making other industries leaner and meaner. Plus she stood up to Europe and demanded the rebate that has stood in our favour for years much to the resentment of the French. She wasn't beyond telling US Presidents a few home truths rather than being their lapdogs and she took us into a just war. She came very close to being assassinated at The Grand Hotel and got my respect for her iron determination after that.

She wasn't always right and certainly lost a lot of support when she took on that rather patronising 'more royal than the royals' voice which made me feel she had lost any empathy with the public.

OK she is a rather sad figure these days but I suggest history will judge her leadership far more positively than anything in the 25 years before or since her.

Compare that to the rather lily livered rose tinted politics of the Blair and Brown era who are at least equally culpable when it comes to nearly bankrupting the UK and creating financial heartache for far more punters than Mrs T did. They could have been respected for making decent decisions of their own, but bottled it.

Thatcher gave us massive unemployment, riots, the destruction of communities and industries, the sell-off of public assets at knock down prices to a bunch of thieving spivs, the replacement of productive industry with casino speculators, 15% interest rates, a foreign policy that managed to reach such a level of dishonesty and incompetence it took the sacrifice of the Armed Forces to cover it up, a massive rise in inequality and a divided and corrupted country. She was kept in power not by the support of the majority British people but by the opportunism of the SDP and her own cynicism.

 

[seaford]

I despise the woman, but I think that really Denis has the right idea. The woman is so ill, she probably cannot even remember what she has done. Whilst I laughed when I saw the t-shirt (and the other one that is also on sale), I should move on.

 

[abc]

You're not seriously asking that question, surely?

I would doubt it as its, as you imply, so obvious.

In the '70s they brought the country to its needs by strike after strike. In the '80s they destroyed our mining industry by backing Militant and Scargill. In the '90s they licked their wounds because the leader of the Labour party was a Tory in disguise. Now they are financing and controlling the Labour party again and hoping once again to bring the country to its knees by striking.

The difference is this time, thanks to Thatcher, they are a busted flush.

 

[clapham_gull]

wee ceratinly are different, learning about the land acts , spinning jenny etc bored the life out of me!!

Yes exactly. Funnily enough the first time I actually learnt the interesting stuff was at East London Poly. I studied there for a year before dumping that and moving to Manchester.

I did "cultural studies" having no idea what was before turning up. Basically it was a Marxist interpretation of history. When people use the term "political correctness" these days they have no idea believe me... It was an extremely radical environment.

And my point ? They made sure we were taught the Kings and Queens, the dates etc. without a political bias. Other lectures did of course but not the History.

First and only time I was taught the English Civil War. If I had stayed they would the second world war etc...

 

[Seagull over Canaryland]

Thatcher gave us massive unemployment, riots, the destruction of communities and industries, the sell-off of public assets at knock down prices to a bunch of thieving spivs, the replacement of productive industry with casino speculators, 15% interest rates, a foreign policy that managed to reach such a level of dishonesty and incompetence it took the sacrifice of the Armed Forces to cover it up, a massive rise in inequality and a divided and corrupted country. She was kept in power not by the support of the majority British people but by the opportunism of the SDP and her own cynicism.

Most of that is true and much of it reflects what she inherited too. Her record almost matches the incompetence of Labour both before and after her. As previously said probably half of her early impact was essential as the UK was on the edge of the abyss, some real decisions had to be made (or you could shut your eyes and hope it might go away). Either way the country was bankrupt with a huge deficit, only propped up by the IMF so something had to be done. Yes there was a lot of collateral damage but sadly a good deal of it was probably necessary. The social landscape of the UK would have been much worse without her. Tinkering around the edges wasn't an option.

I'm not a Tory apologist, merely a rather jaundiced voter and observer of politics for 40 odd years who has long lost any naive faith he once had in politicians of any persuasion. As stated in another thread I don't see any decent politicians around who make me feel optimistic about the future. (Boris - ha ha)

This t-shirt thing is rather shallow rhetoric and won't fool anyone interested in serious politics. It just attempts to perpetuate something that Labour could so easily have corrected since when they had the chance. Why didn't they? I bet they regret it now.