[Politics] US mid-terms

[Crawley Dingo]

double post

 

[Crawley Dingo]

In theory

Yes true, but if for example Biden was shown running around with a bloodied axe chopping people up and you were a Democrat in a marginal then yes there is pressure on you and with a split senate getting 8 to flip is not to far a possibility as your cynical response implies. Also a lot of DNC want Biden gone before 2024. It would require more than the conspiracy and smear aimed at Trump(Which is why he was cleared).

This may begin to play out in Brazil where the Supreme court cleared Lula of corruption along party lines and those judges are now facing empeachment from the new Government. As a Brazillian I know said to me this level of institutional conflict can spill onto the streets and quicker than some assume.

 

[Zeberdi]

es true, but if for example Biden was shown running around with a bloodied axe chopping people up and you were a Democrat in a marginal then yes there is pressure on you and with a split senate getting 8 to flip is not to far a possibility as your cynical response implies.

I’m not sure what point you’re trying to prove here with that outlandish example - if a president or VP’s High Crimes consisted of them running round with a bloodied axe chopping people up’ I hardly think the House of Reps would be spending the next 6 months carrying out investigations and then drawing up articles of impeachment to be used as a tool to remove the President - the federal police and possibly National Guard would be in there like a shot to remove him - and he’d be locked up and/ or sectioned under the mental health act!! Don’t forget, The 25th Amendment to the US Constitution can be triggered at any time to immediately remove a president by the VP and Cabinet - a President running round chopping people up is clearly unable to carry out his duties.

I wasn’t being cynical- I just think it’s probably a little naive to think impeaching a president will lead to him being convicted if he’s ‘obviously’ guilty and further, that it will get across the additional hurdle of having a majority vote to actually remove him from power. My comment ‘in theory’ a President could be removed from power for wrongdoing is entirely correct. That’s not cynicism it’s based on an awareness of the facts.

An Impeachment trial is not like a legal trial, it is a political process. Even if the Senate voted to ‘convict’ ( as they did the second time Trump was impeached), there are no judicial punishments and they still have to take an additional vote to actually remove the guilty party from Office/bar him standing for public office in the future - which the Senate voted not to do in Trump’s case.

Only 3 Presidents have ever been impeached in the US and NONE have been removed from office. The decision by the Senate to remove an impeached President is purely a political one.

This does not mean a President will get away with wrongdoing- they will still potentially face criminal charges in a court of law. Trump still is facing ongoing investigations by federal agencies and the DOJ for his time in office and for the Capitol riots.


EDIT - BTW The last time any one party had a two thirds majority in the Senate was in 1964 when Lyndon Johnson was voted back in to a second term on 61.1% of the popular vote and gained two senate seats giving the Dems a two third majority

 

[Kalimantan Gull]

Yea funny that. How the Dems won all the ballot based seats and lost the voter based ones.

I don't know what this means

 

[Albion my Albion]

DeSantis is Trump's big rival for the Republican nomination, and neither have an awful lot of time for each other. If DeSantis gets it he likely won't give Trump and his mob the pardons they're all desperate for, leaving them to face the music in court.

l

 

[Frutos]

The new majority Speaker is Kevin McCarthy who Trump very much sees as his pathway to the Whitehouse

McCarthy now the first Speaker in US history to be voted out.

 

[Hugo Rune]

McCarthy now the first Speaker in US history to be voted out.

What’s more shocking is that they drafted in Rick Moranis as temporary cover.

1989 - Honey, I Shrunk the Kids - Premier.

2023 - Honey, I Took Over the House - Temporarily

 

[Stato]

It's mad stuff. One of the most surprising elements to me is that anyone is listening to anything that walking stick of rancid butter Matt Gaetz has to say. The DoJ didn't charge him, but the public accusations of what he was up to and his close connection with the bloke who admitted guilt and got eleven years would have been enough to guarantee the end a political career back in less partisan, more circumspect times. Instead of being an embarassing pariah, he's ended up being some sort of leader of the frothing right wing MAGA caucus. They really will forgive anything of powerful men.

 

[dsr-burnley]

It's mad stuff. One of the most surprising elements to me is that anyone is listening to anything that walking stick of rancid butter Matt Gaetz has to say. The DoJ didn't charge him, but the public accusations of what he was up to and his close connection with the bloke who admitted guilt and got eleven years would have been enough to guarantee the end a political career back in less partisan, more circumspect times. Instead of being an embarassing pariah, he's ended up being some sort of leader of the frothing right wing MAGA caucus. They really will forgive anything of powerful men.

Gaetz had very little support from the Republicans in the house - only 8 out of 221 supported getting shut of McCarthy, with 3 abstentions. It's the Democrats who really stood with Gaetz on this issue, 208 of 211 voting against, 3 abstentions.

Strange, because it appears that Gaetz's stickingpoint was that McCarthy wanted to work with Democrats to avoid government shutdown; I can't believe the Democrats oppose that in principle, so presumably they were just voting that way to stir up a bit of manure. The wonderful world of politics!

 

[JBizzle]

Gaetz had very little support from the Republicans in the house - only 8 out of 221 supported getting shut of McCarthy, with 3 abstentions. It's the Democrats who really stood with Gaetz on this issue, 208 of 211 voting against, 3 abstentions.

Strange, because it appears that Gaetz's stickingpoint was that McCarthy wanted to work with Democrats to avoid government shutdown; I can't believe the Democrats oppose that in principle, so presumably they were just voting that way to stir up a bit of manure. The wonderful world of politics!

I suppose what i comes to next is who they believe will be the new house leader. McCarthy, although far from perfect was at least willing to deal with the Democrats. Who knows who'll be the next one to come in? If the Republicans unite behind a candidate (and it happens to be some like Gaetz) then you can count out any bi-partisan collaboration until at least the mid-terms, in which case the Dems will have properly shot themselves in the foot.

 

[Stato]

Gaetz had very little support from the Republicans in the house - only 8 out of 221 supported getting shut of McCarthy, with 3 abstentions. It's the Democrats who really stood with Gaetz on this issue, 208 of 211 voting against, 3 abstentions.

Strange, because it appears that Gaetz's stickingpoint was that McCarthy wanted to work with Democrats to avoid government shutdown; I can't believe the Democrats oppose that in principle, so presumably they were just voting that way to stir up a bit of manure. The wonderful world of politics!

Of course the opposition will vote against you. That's politics. The madness is that knowing this, and without having a replacement who would be acceptable to all Republicans, Gaetz and his bunch have cut off the head of their own party. It shows a denial of reality that makes you wonder how any of them were politic enough to get themselves elected in the first place. In a tantrum partly because McCarthy hasn't subpoenaed Biden's son, they've actually thrown out all of their subpoena power until another permanent speaker can be elected!

Given that it took them 15 ballots to finally elect McCarthy after he agreed to give them the bullets with which to shoot him, and that some of his supporters apparently left Congress last night saying that they would renominate him and vote for him at all future votes, it will be interesting to see how long this takes and the odds market for the next speaker. One name that is likely to be on the list is the Democrats' minority leader Hakeem Jefferies. He'd actually need to turn less Republicans than voted against McCarthy to win a majority. Presumably, that's one reason why the Democrats supported the motion to vacate.

 

[Crawley Dingo]

Gaetz had very little support from the Republicans in the house - only 8 out of 221 supported getting shut of McCarthy, with 3 abstentions. It's the Democrats who really stood with Gaetz on this issue, 208 of 211 voting against, 3 abstentions.

Strange, because it appears that Gaetz's stickingpoint was that McCarthy wanted to work with Democrats to avoid government shutdown; I can't believe the Democrats oppose that in principle, so presumably they were just voting that way to stir up a bit of manure. The wonderful world of politics!

I thought it was about doing a side deal for Ukraine funding with Democrats and not brining it before congress.

 

[dsr-burnley]

I thought it was about doing a side deal for Ukraine funding with Democrats and not brining it before congress.

Might be. I haven't followed enough detail. Either way, the idea of the Democrats voting him out because he was making deals with the Democrats seems a little counter-intuitive.

 

[Crawley Dingo]

Might be. I haven't followed enough detail. Either way, the idea of the Democrats voting him out because he was making deals with the Democrats seems a little counter-intuitive.

The republicans have just booted a couple of Dems out of "Courtesy" offices for siding with the FC, one of them is Pelosi who is also being blamed by the fallen speaker of not keeping a secret deal to back him up. Which kind of prooves the Freedom Caucus's point that he is a fifth columnist/RINO.

Its all a bit weird and surreal at the moment.

 

[FamilyGuy]

Gaetz had very little support from the Republicans in the house - only 8 out of 221 supported getting shut of McCarthy, with 3 abstentions. It's the Democrats who really stood with Gaetz on this issue, 208 of 211 voting against, 3 abstentions.

Strange, because it appears that Gaetz's stickingpoint was that McCarthy wanted to work with Democrats to avoid government shutdown; I can't believe the Democrats oppose that in principle, so presumably they were just voting that way to stir up a bit of manure. The wonderful world of politics!

Yes, "Strange" in a world where that means "hypocritical".

 

[FamilyGuy]

I thought it was about doing a side deal for Ukraine funding with Democrats and not brining it before congress.

Gaetz started the rumour about a side deal, but provided no evidence - that doesn't mean that its not true though - but when has truth meant anything to the Republican Party since they set themselves squarely behind Trump?

 

[FamilyGuy]

The republicans have just booted a couple of Dems out of "Courtesy" offices for siding with the FC, one of them is Pelosi who is also being blamed by the fallen speaker of not keeping a secret deal to back him up. Which kind of prooves the Freedom Caucus's point that he is a fifth columnist/RINO.

Its all a bit weird and surreal at the moment.

"at the moment"!!??

Haven't you noticed anything since the day of the golden escalator?

 

[Crawley Dingo]

Gaetz started the rumour about a side deal, but provided no evidence - that doesn't mean that its not true though - but when has truth meant anything to the Republican Party since they set themselves squarely behind Trump?

Have you even looked into the substance of the charges?

 

[Crawley Dingo]

"at the moment"!!??

Haven't you noticed anything since the day of the golden escalator?

Trump Derangement syndrome.

 

[Stato]

So both Trump and Gaetz have endorsed Jim Jordan to replace McCarthy. Wonder what attracts those two to a man who has been accused by multiple victims as turning a blind eye to their sexual abuse?