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[Football] How to fix VAR ?



Swegulls

Well-known member
Aug 29, 2023
382
Stockholm
Bin it, I'm only interested in if the ball is over the line or not. Save the money and spend it on the referees instead. I can't think of a worse job than theirs with constant abuse regardless what happened during the game. I'm glad that some still cope with it. I don't know what the recruiting of new referees looks like but I'm glad we still have one on the pitch.
 

peterward

Well-known member
NSC Licker Extraordinaire
Nov 11, 2009
10,881
Also, Stockley Park is often reviewing incidents when play is still going on (ie, Forest's penalty on Saturday). Not sure I, or the players, would want to hear audio on the PA of some bloke asking Bazza if he's got a better angle while we're attacking the other end.
Right from the outset I was anti-VAR. Nothing has changed. If it has to stay then a challenge system is the best of a bad bunch of options.
Accepting linesman decision on offsides (no more lines) and giving each team 1 offside review per game. Would be miles better.

That would deal with "clear and obvious". You wanna gamble it after a goal, that's captains choice.

Lewis Dunk then has power to overturn an error, not Stuart Atwell micro managing every call in Stockley Park by mm's
 

Kosh

'The' Yaztromo
VAR has runied football for me. To the extent that I am considering not bothering anymore.

The reason I love(d) football is that amazing 5 or 10 seconds when we score. The unbridled joy of being amongst like minded people - the feeling you can't describe to non football fans..

That's been taken away. I find myself sitting, arms crossed, when we score now - waiting to see if I'm allowed to celebrate.

Not for me.
Yep - it’s absolutely awful, it really is.
 

mejonaNO12 aka riskit

Well-known member
Dec 4, 2003
21,415
England
To me, offsides should be like 'umpires call' in cricket. If an offside is being reviewed then draw the lines, hit 'submit'. No need to start trying to be correct by the millimeter. A quick draw and then go.

The computer will then determine if the lines are within the 'margin of error' parameters. if they are then it simply says 'referees call'. Ie the technology is showing its a close call, too close to get funny about, so lets stick with the original decision.

Just like an LBW call. We see the images and think "that looks like it'll probably be going through to hit off stump" but the technology accepts there is a margin for error and basically says 'this is too close to be definitive. Stick with the umpires original decision'

I don't care if a players toe is offside. The rule was brought in to dictate the pattern of play etc. If a player is probably marginally offside but it's given I don't really care. That doesn't feel like a team has been robbed.
 

Falmer Flutter ©

Well-known member
Feb 18, 2004
902
Petts Wood
VAR has runied football for me. To the extent that I am considering not bothering anymore.

The reason I love(d) football is that amazing 5 or 10 seconds when we score. The unbridled joy of being amongst like minded people - the feeling you can't describe to non football fans..

That's been taken away. I find myself sitting, arms crossed, when we score now - waiting to see if I'm allowed to celebrate.

Not for me.
After Mac Allister's thunderbolt was ruled out last season I was so close to just walking out. I just couldn't believe that the game I loved would forensically and deliberately want to overturn something so beautiful. Thankfully RDZ has saved me, but I find watching games on TV tedious now.
 


gripper stebson

Well-known member
Jul 27, 2004
6,652
After Mac Allister's thunderbolt was ruled out last season I was so close to just walking out. I just couldn't believe that the game I loved would forensically and deliberately want to overturn something so beautiful. Thankfully RDZ has saved me, but I find watching games on TV tedious now.
Beautifully put mate.
 

southstandandy

WEST STAND ANDY
Jul 9, 2003
5,569
Bin it.

Why should the Championship, Leagues 1 & 2 have the priviledge and luxury of not having a system that spoils the sport, and the Prem be punished by having it?

Surely it should only be the lower leagues that would have such a useless system.
 

Stumpy Tim

Well-known member
(1) Remove lines from offside, and make it clear & obvious only. I remember in the FA Cup semi-final against Millwall, Montoya was flagged offside despite being yards onside. That's the kind of decision we want removed from the game, not Dunk's agaist Everton.
(2) Keep goal-line technology
(3) Ban slow-motion on any red card or penalty decision, and give a 30 second limit.

Job done
 


Nobby Cybergoat

Well-known member
Jul 19, 2021
6,465
To me, offsides should be like 'umpires call' in cricket. If an offside is being reviewed then draw the lines, hit 'submit'. No need to start trying to be correct by the millimeter. A quick draw and then go.

The computer will then determine if the lines are within the 'margin of error' parameters. if they are then it simply says 'referees call'. Ie the technology is showing its a close call, too close to get funny about, so lets stick with the original decision.

Just like an LBW call. We see the images and think "that looks like it'll probably be going through to hit off stump" but the technology accepts there is a margin for error and basically says 'this is too close to be definitive. Stick with the umpires original decision'

I don't care if a players toe is offside. The rule was brought in to dictate the pattern of play etc. If a player is probably marginally offside but it's given I don't really care. That doesn't feel like a team has been robbed.
Then you have to start having conversations about margin of error parameters. It would solve nothing. Go with the onfield decision

VAR is basically a bit like Brexit. We were sold an impossible dream. Many were sceptical, but lots bought into that dream and wanted it given a try. The outcome is beyond nightmarish and it's almost impossible now to find sensible people who still feel positively. Though there's a strange feeling of determinism, that it doesn't really matter what is sensible, or what people want, we have to carry on down the path we're on
 

Pevenseagull

Anti-greed coalition
Jul 20, 2003
19,372
1) Each captain has 3 challenges and 20 seconds to decide whether to use it. Unless they're used, VAR keeps it's sticky beak out of it completely.
2) VAR for offsides and penalty decisions only. When a challenge is made, it is for clear and obvious errors only in the penalty area. I don't mind offside decisions being made precisely, but we need clarification on the offside LAW as to which part of the body should be measured,
3) VAR not to be used for anything else, including red cards. Challenges always look worse in slow motion. Just let the ref decide on the field.

Not sure 1) would help much. Average goals per game in the PL is under 3* . Can't find a figure for average number of goals per game disallowed for offside but I'm guessing it's less than 2.

Would this not mean that in the average game one of the captains would call for a review every time the ball went in ... just in case?

*https://www.myfootballfacts.com/pre...remier-league/premier_league_goal_statistics/
 


Boroseagull

Well-known member
Aug 23, 2003
2,040
Alhaurin de la Torre
For anyone who watched, or didn't, last night's game Fulham v Wolves you may like to read ToL report of the game concentrating on the awful mess VAR and Michael Salisbury made of the game. For the officials to admit that at least 3 expensive (to Wolves) mistakes were made is just not acceptable to any football fan. When will they get it right?

 

Kalimantan Gull

Well-known member
Aug 13, 2003
12,795
Central Borneo / the Lizard
Offsides should be easy. Just create a definition of 'level' - overlapping torsos or whatever, and then apply 'linesmans call' to that. He flags him off, he has to be off by a mm or whatever to overturn it. He doesnt flag, then he stays onside provided the 'level' definition is met.

Further to that, the image is stopped at the frame PRIOR to the ball being kicked, again to give benefit of the doubt to attackers.

Penalties - the ref checks them all without input from VAR. The ref has to see something to overturn his original decision. Could apply that to all goals scored too.

Penalties not given, fouls in build up to goals, and potential red cards. Each manager has two challenges. I don't really like this but again I want a scenario where its down to the on field ref and not a VAR ref. Or the ref just checks everything, but it could get time consuming. Or keep it at it is, we can probably live with VAR getting involved here, as long as the ref approaches all these with an open mind.

Handballs - just change the law so nearly all handballs in the area are punished by indirect free kicks, no way should an accidental handball least to an almost certain goal. But that needs FIFA, the FA cant change that.

Finally, all videos are played on big screen. That would also speed it up, ref can check all goals on big screen without running off to the side. Bring both captains in for a chat, let them make their case , easier than trying to keep everyone away.
 

Kalimantan Gull

Well-known member
Aug 13, 2003
12,795
Central Borneo / the Lizard
Not sure 1) would help much. Average goals per game in the PL is under 3* . Can't find a figure for average number of goals per game disallowed for offside but I'm guessing it's less than 2.

Would this not mean that in the average game one of the captains would call for a review every time the ball went in ... just in case?

*https://www.myfootballfacts.com/pre...remier-league/premier_league_goal_statistics/
The advantage of a review though is that only the ref reviews. He doesn’t have a VAR ref in his ear telling him what he thinks.
 


Easy 10

Brain dead MUG SHEEP
Jul 5, 2003
61,579
Location Location
Finally, all videos are played on big screen. That would also speed it up, ref can check all goals on big screen without running off to the side. Bring both captains in for a chat, let them make their case , easier than trying to keep everyone away.
Anfield and Old Trafford don't have big screens...
 

Kinky Gerbil

Im The Scatman
NSC Licker Extraordinaire
Jul 16, 2003
57,601
hassocks
Binning var is basically saying that our refs are too incompetent to use technology that the rest of Europe seem to use without too much issue,
The problem isn’t VAR in terms of well a concept and technology. It’s the f***ing idiots using it. My view is that if they can t use VAR then they should be allowed to referee a game. Using var should be easier but no, let’s f*** it up.

Yeah, I loved the way Italy got punished and knocked out after VAR gave the stonewall pen v Ukraine

O hang on....
 

Nixonator

Well-known member
Feb 8, 2016
6,731
Shoreham Beach
Before VAR referees estimated to get 96% of decisions correct.

As a result of VAR we are probably at 98% of decisions correct. The focus by the media (and fans) is on the decisions that VAR gets wrong, the ones it gets right tend to be forgotten quickly.

If you want errors to be eliminated completely then VAR will never be a success.
Illustrates why it didn't need 'fixing' to begin with unless 100% is attainable. Which we all know it isn't and never will be due to the subjective nature of the game.

The frustration, disruption and indecision that come about as a result of VAR are not worth the 2% benefit.

Bin it.
 


Krafty

Well-known member
Apr 19, 2023
1,433
1) Install semi-automated offsides, which were used at the World Cup.
offside.jpg

2) Bin the rest (excluding goal-line technology), until the rules are clear and the refereeing is consistent.
 

Steve in Japan

Well-known member
NSC Licker Extraordinaire
May 9, 2013
4,375
East of Eastbourne
I have come to believe that the PL and Sky and BT actually want all the added drama and controversy that VAR brings, it's become part of the football product that they pay for and market. You constantly hear commentators saying gleefully "ooooh, VAR will take a look at that". VAR is for the TV audiences, they really don't care about the supporters watching live. And the PL and PGMOL are not at all invested in making it work properly.

It needs a boycott - UK wide, every PL team, on the same weekend. But I think we know that's not going to happen.
 

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