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[Politics] Far right party set to take power in Holland ?



Zeberdi

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Herr Tubthumper

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Jul 11, 2003
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The Fatherland
Not really unfortunately- the far right are gaining ground all over Europe and in the US
Recent elections in Germany and Spain returned socialist leaders. Poland booted out a right wing government and the UK will do the same next year. There’s others to.
 

Zeberdi

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Recent elections in Germany and Spain returned socialist leaders. Poland booted out a right wing government and the UK will do the same next year. There’s others to.
That may be the case but the PiS in Poland still won the most votes - the trend overall has been that far right parties are gaining traction and moving into mainstream politics - they do not have to be in power to effect policymaking - it’s a good argument for FPTP but not one I agree with I hasten to add!

“Over the past year, right-wing parties have made significant gains across Europe. Right-wing nationalists are now governing outright in Italy and Hungary, have recently joined the governing coalition in Finland and support the government in Sweden. And although Poland’s pro-EU opposition parties defied expectations and won enough seats to oust the nationalist Law and Justice party (PiS) in the country’s recent elections, PiS still took the largest number of votes.”


 
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Herr Tubthumper

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The Fatherland
Not really unfortunately- the far right are gaining ground all over Europe and in the US
PPV are predicted to win 35 seats in the 150-seat parliament. Let’s see if they can form a working majority given few parties will work with them.
 

attila

1997 Club
Jul 17, 2003
2,242
South Central Southwick
No - an example of why PR is a proper electoral system, FPTP is batshit nonsense and much of our media are utterly clueless.
Exit polls say veteran far right bigot Geert Wilders' PVV party is predicted to gain the most seats in the Dutch parliament with around 35% of the vote.
That is SHOCKING.
Cue FPTP programmed UK media trumpeting:
'FAR RIGHT WINS DUTCH ELECTION'.
No it hasn't.
I repeat: if true, their percentage is shocking. But they have benefited from the collapse of the 'moderate' Right. They have, as far as I can see, no one they can form an alliance with. The Left vote has gone up considerably too and the same polls predict that the Left and centre will have a majority.
 


A1X

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I know someone who’ll be delighted

GIF by SB Nation
 

Zeberdi

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PPV are predicted to win 35 seats in the 150-seat parliament. Let’s see if they can form a working majority given few parties will work with them.
Did you not look at the links? Are you suggesting the far right is not on an upward trend?

Maybe no one will work with the PPV but they are a particular case and have a history of external and internal conflict - as you know, in PR systems, far right parties don’t need majorities, they can get a disproportionate amount of power just by being invited to form a coalition/election pact with a minority government or even just making pre-election pacts on specific policy in exchange for support on other policies - as Netanyahu’s election deal with the Justice Party and Religious Zionists show in Israel - All it takes is for one political party not much caring about the devil they have to get into bed with in order to stay in power and the extremist loonies have you by the balls on some serious policy issues.

To get an objective view we need to look at the long term net gains of the far right over the past 5 decade or so and, a word I am sure you are familiar with, the cultural Zeitgeist in which these gains are occurring- which is very much about depleted resources, economic downturns post-pandemic, anti-immigration, nationalistic priorities, erosion of democratic freedoms and racism.
 
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Kuipers Supporters Club

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Feb 10, 2009
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Recent elections in Germany and Spain returned socialist leaders. Poland booted out a right wing government and the UK will do the same next year. There’s others to.
Spain is a totally different case.

The Conservatives won, the only reason Pedro Sanchez is still in power is because he did a deal with the separatists, something he said he’d never do before the election.

The AfD are now a clear second in the opinion polls in Germany.

The right are winning voters all over the world.

Rather than be dismissive people need to think why that is the case.

Just look at Argentina.
 


PeterT

Well-known member
Apr 21, 2017
2,181
Hove
Being follicly challenged, I take comfort that all these unhinged, right wing nutters getting popular or elected across the globe all seem to have mad hair and far too much of it.
 

Zeberdi

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Actually I’m not even sure why what I said in post #2 is contentious and why there is even a disagreement - the long term trends say the far right is on an upward trajectory - poll results, electoral events and trends tend not to lie and an incredibly broad range of media sources while differing on minituea all identify that the far right is gaining traction amongst the electorate all over Europe (and in the GOP/Trump in the US, Bolsonaro in Brazil, Netanyahu in Israel …etc) despite the actual outcome of elections - popular support for far right ideology has already in some Countris moved to mainstream politics.

 
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beorhthelm

A. Virgo, Football Genius
Jul 21, 2003
35,211
Spain is a totally different case.

The Conservatives won, the only reason Pedro Sanchez is still in power is because he did a deal with the separatists, something he said he’d never do before the election.

The AfD are now a clear second in the opinion polls in Germany.

The right are winning voters all over the world.

Rather than be dismissive people need to think why that is the case.

Just look at Argentina.
people want change. if current government is left leaning, the votes will go right leaning, and vice versa. most of Europe is in economic doldrums or recession, hang over from money print/inflation/interest rate cycle of past few years, end of a decade coasting while not addressing older problems. so they'll vote for the other side to see if they can do better.
 


Weststander

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Actually I’m not even sure why what I said in post #2 is contentious - the long term trends say the far right is on an upward trajectory - poll results, electoral events and trends tend not to lie and an incredibly broad range of media sources while differing on minituea all identify that the far right is gaining traction amongst the electorate all over Europe (and in the US, South America, Israel …etc) despite the actual outcome of elections


Unscientifically, my instinct is of a peak ‘liberal’ world about 20 years ago. The first murmurings of loons with significant support that I can recall was Sarah Palin and The Tea Party movement. Since then it seems a never ending Whackamole of nationalists or the Far Right having some electoral success globally. Imho social media and misinformation would be a factor.
 

Bakero

Languidly clinical
Oct 9, 2010
13,570
Almería
Spain is a totally different case.

The Conservatives won, the only reason Pedro Sanchez is still in power is because he did a deal with the separatists, something he said he’d never do before the election.

"Won" is a stretch. The PP needed another 40 seats for a majority so were some way short. In terms of the popular vote there's wasn't much in it. Sanchez's PSOE were about 300,000 behind but they actually gained a seat.
 
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Zeberdi

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Zeberdi

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Oct 20, 2022
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No - an example of why PR is a proper electoral system, FPTP is batshit nonsense and much of our media are utterly clueless.
Exit polls say veteran far right bigot Geert Wilders' PVV party is predicted to gain the most seats in the Dutch parliament with around 35% of the vote.
That is SHOCKING.
Cue FPTP programmed UK media trumpeting:
'FAR RIGHT WINS DUTCH ELECTION'.
No it hasn't.

I repeat: if true, their percentage is shocking. But they have benefited from the collapse of the 'moderate' Right. They have, as far as I can see, no one they can form an alliance with. The Left vote has gone up considerably too and the same polls predict that the Left and centre will have a majority.

You seem to be conflating forming a government with winning an election - they are entirely different things.

No one said Wilders would be able to form a government if he won the most number of seats which clearly the exit polls are showing he has - and it can not be argued that this is not a very significant net gain not a loss for the PVV - the most seats they have gained in an election and are now the first place party in Holland. Entirely consistent with my original assertion that we are seeing an overall resurgence of right wing popularism in Europe.

Rather than be dismissive people need to think why that is the case.
Unless people can recognise what is happening I don’t think people will even begin to understand why the far right are winning so much popular support.

What is really scary is that some would even go so far as to suggest that it is fake news saying that they are - it’s the same pollyanna attitude that people have in the US who don’t really believe that Trump could very very possibly win the US election (if the GOP nominate him as their candidate) in the biggest right wing swing to far right governance the American people have ever seen.

 
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Ali_rrr

Well-known member
Feb 4, 2011
2,664
Utrecht, NL
The PVV will be in power. The NSC party has already said they will be willing to work with them and I am sure others will too.


The PVV have toned down their anti-islam, Nexit rhetoric and have solely focused on immigration from outside the EU. Socially, they are very left.
 

A1X

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Sep 1, 2017
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Deepest, darkest Sussex
The PVV will be in power. The NSC party has already said they will be willing to work with them and I am sure others will too.


The PVV have toned down their anti-islam, Nexit rhetoric and have solely focused on immigration from outside the EU. Socially, they are very left.
WTF, was that decided on a Crodo poll? I missed that.
 

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