[Albion] The return of capital punishment?

vegster · Aug 16, 2019

Knocky's Nose said:
I like the cut of your jib, Sir....

Can we also bring back Mental Asylums for single mothers, and call disabled people 'Invalids'. Oh, and bring back outside toilets.

I still have an outside toilet ! only as a back up though, it is a bit of an icebreaker at Christmas parties !

Oh, for got to add, how about" Transportation to The Colonies " for theft ?

Questions · Aug 16, 2019

If we did go back to public floggings and hangings I bet Sky would bid for the tv rights.

Guinness Boy · Aug 16, 2019

vegster said:
I still have an outside toilet ! only as a back up though, it is a bit of an icebreaker at Christmas parties !

If you need to break the ice in an outside Kermit may I point you in the direction of a decent Thai restaurant. Anything with three chillies next to it and a couple of Singhas should do the trick.

vegster · Aug 16, 2019

I forgot a couple more... how about Workhouses for the poor ? then they don't have to use Foodbanks ? And how about reinstating Bedlam for those with mental health problems who are draining our country's finances ? make them put on a bit of a show and we can sell tickets to the asylum. … Capita and Serco will clean up.

midnight_rendezvous · Aug 16, 2019

Hastings gull said:
I don't think you can say that with any degree of certainty. How do you really know it doesn't work? Yes, murderers took the chance in this country prior to the abolition of the death penalty, but how many potential murderers were put off by the threat of the noose - you can obviously tell us, as you say that the death penalty doesn't work.

If the death penalty worked as any sort of deterrent then surely no murder or serious crime would be committed in countries where the death penalty is still a thing. Look at the US, an overwhelming number of criminologists say it has no deterrent effect whatsoever. States without the death penalty continue to have significantly lower murder rates than those that retain capital punishment.

As I said in my OP, if it didn’t work back in the days of being hung, drawn and quartered and all those other nasty ways of executing people, its not going to work now.

Knocky's Nose · Aug 16, 2019

Questions said:
If we did go back to public floggings and hangings I bet Sky would bid for the tv rights.

Today's equivalent would be Man City v Norwich....

SweatyMexican · Aug 16, 2019

There will always be a chance of accidentally punishing the wrong person.

No.

Cheshire Cat · Aug 16, 2019

No.

Not ever.

Under any circumstances.

Hastings gull · Aug 16, 2019

Mustafa said:
For you and others that support it - what is the argument for it?

If you're concerned about due punishment, surely life in prison until they die is a worse punishment than the so called "easy way out"?

If you're concerned about expense to the tax payer by keeping them alive, I would guess having them on death row near enough equates to the cost, if not in fact costing considerably more.

By ending the lives of the worst criminals, it just seems to be depriving the sciences such as criminology or psychology from studying the most dangerous criminals beyond their convictions.

Can't think of an argument for it.

I don't know, and nor do you if it is an easy way out or not. Why do you come up with such a the conclusion about cost? Do you know is this is the case? What evidence do you have for this? Any why can't the studies take place before their ultimate punishment? This is just pure speculation.

Winker · Aug 16, 2019

A rural crime, ten males aged between 13 & 30 have been arrested, police have been seen on the local traveller camp, forget hanging, bring back cluster bombs.

Hastings gull · Aug 16, 2019

midnight_rendezvous said:
If the death penalty worked as any sort of deterrent then surely no murder or serious crime would be committed in countries where the death penalty is still a thing. Look at the US, an overwhelming number of criminologists say it has no deterrent effect whatsoever. States without the death penalty continue to have significantly lower murder rates than those that retain capital punishment.

As I said in my OP, if it didn’t work back in the days of being hung, drawn and quartered and all those other nasty ways of executing people, its not going to work now.

With respect, you are missing the point. I did not claim that it does not work, and the fact that murders do take place, clearly shows that the fear of the death penalty is not a deterrent for some. I agree. But what we do not know is how many are put off by the thought that if they murder someone, however much they might want to, they will be hanged or whatever. You are a teacher, as I was. You know full well that the punishment that you give to one child has a duel function - punishment of that child, and a lesson to others not to go down the same avenue. What you don't know is how many might have been tempted, but that public censure is your attempt to nip it in the bud. The principle is the same.

BensGrandad · Aug 16, 2019

I would be in favour but it will never happen.

Knocky's Nose · Aug 16, 2019

Cheshire Cat said:
No.

Not ever.

Under any circumstances.

This begs the old question (and I'm playing Devil's Advocate here...)

If a man broke into your home and murdered your wife and children, then tried to murder you (thought he had, but you survived..), and when you woke up to find you had lost everything in your world - would you think "I'd like to see him getting pizza once a week, access to a gym, TV and a Playstation, play pool, cook, do a few degree courses, and get Christmas Dinner every year.." - or would you wish him dead, like your wife and children were, because he killed them?

Just a question, not an argument.

Pavilionaire · Aug 16, 2019

If you have the death penalty then you lose the moral high ground when it comes to human rights. Indeed, this is the central pillar of a civilised society from which other good stuff comes. Look at the USA - f*cked up good and proper.

Bill Cassidy's tie up · Aug 16, 2019

carlzeiss said:
Just ban caravans from the Roads .

What I thought as well

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

KNC · Aug 16, 2019

Is there a reality show in the offing?

Hastings gull · Aug 16, 2019

Pavilionaire said:
If you have the death penalty then you lose the moral high ground when it comes to human rights. Indeed, this is the central pillar of a civilised society from which other good stuff comes. Look at the USA - f*cked up good and proper.

A huge country - totally written off in 5 words.

Pavilionaire · Aug 16, 2019

Hastings gull said:
A huge country - totally written off in 5 words.

Try putting gun genie back in the bottle. Like I said, f*cked up good and proper.

Hastings gull · Aug 16, 2019

Pavilionaire said:
Try putting gun genie back in the bottle. Like I said, f*cked up good and proper.

No one denies that they have a problem with guns, as we have a problem with knife crime, but your ridiculously wild description just writes off so much good that the Americans have to offer. I am pretty certain that 250,000,000 Americans would not describe their country as you seem to expertly see it from 3000 miles away. Presumably after the murders that we have seen these last few days here, your description of this country would be the same?

Guinness Boy · Aug 16, 2019

Hastings gull said:
No one denies that they have a problem with guns, as we have a problem with knife crime, but your ridiculously wild description just writes off so much good that the Americans have to offer. I am pretty certain that 250,000,000 Americans would not describe their country as you seem to expertly see it from 3000 miles away. Presumably after the murders that we have seen these last few days here, your description of this country would be the same?

There have been 22 school shootings in the US this year

I wouldn't expect our country to be described in nearly the same terms and, as an ex-teacher, I don't believe you genuinely would either.

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[Albion] The return of capital punishment?

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